rnl35thss

iTrader: (14)

Well said ryarbrough.

Super-Bat

iTrader: (38)

Austin (BeastBuster) is a stand up and honest guy that I have dealt with in the past on multiple occasions. I do not believe him to be creating a story here.
While I do not know how the wheels were damaged, I believe Austin when he says he did not have anything to do with them being bent.
I'm sorry he had to dish out so much money on a nice set of wheels he was hoping to get a good deal on.

BeastBuster

iTrader: (1)

Thanks a lot bud!

First off, I was not concerned that they may have been bent. I didn't trust Discount Tire to tell me anything. I knew without a doubt they were bent because I saw them on the balancing machine. This is information covered on the first page of this thread. Also previously said is that they were confirmed to be bent by three shops. Discount, a local wheel shop, and then Chicago Wheel when they did the repairs. It took me awhile to do the actual repair for a couple of reasons: I never should have had to pay for the repairs, repairs cost money and I didn't have that kind of money to spend before then.

You missed the point entirely, if 223Hawk admits it as a possibility, then why did he ignore me instead of trying to discuss it or negotiate? This alone should be enough for some kind of reprimand. Seriously here is the PM I sent to him, his reply (the last he would ever send), and the PM I sent where he started ignoring me.

Re: Wheels
I cannot think of any reason why the people would not tell you that your wheels were bent... But the people over here at Discount Tire told me that there was no way you could not have known these were bent. But you seem to be an honest guy so I believe you were unaware but I find it very hard to believe that the people at Big-O could have missed it if they tried to balance them. I understand that you might not want to just take my word for it so if there is anything you want me to do (Letter from Discount, etc) let me know. I do need to get these fixed soon though, as vibrations are actually very noticeable... And they put the least bent wheel up front. I am gonna try and find some shops that straighten wheels and get back to you on what they quote me.

Thanks,

-Austin

Default Re: Wheels
Austin, Im still in the air about this. I cant believe the wheels are bent. Its not that I dont believe you or need a letter from a tire shop. Iv had a car (87 Trans Am) That the GTA wheels were bent, Yeah that sucked but who I knew a guy back then that could balance tires and take most of that out. I truly think they may have been bent in shipping! I think you need to contact UPS. I just dont know! The day they came off my car, I had drove the car, and NEVER any vibration at all. Not to be a Dick but you waited 2 months to get tires, then tell me they are bent. Im sorry but I dont feel I should pay for the repairs. If something would have came up sooner, I might be a lot more flexible, but this is more than 2 Months AFTER purchase. You got the Firehawk wheels at a VERY good price! If this was me, and I was very concerned about this, I would not wait days in between emails(Messages on ls1tech) and stay on top of this.

Thanks
Joey

Re: Wheels
I realize that this is a tense situation on both sides but don't make judgements or assumptions that I am not concerned. I have not been home a lot in the past few days. I assure you, I am taking this very seriously. I was very excited to get these wheels so I am sure you can imagine the frustration I feel that 3 of the 4 wheels I bought are bent.

Yes it has been a couple months since the purchase but I did not sit around with my thumb up my *** waiting to put tires on. Trust me, I had them mounted as soon as I could afford it. Though the time frame doesn't really matter since this is an issue of me paying for something that I did not receive. While I agree that $650 is a hell of a deal for Firehawk wheels in good condition (why I bought them) I do not believe that is a fair price for wheels that the majority of are structurally damaged. I think that does not qualify as really good condition. If I buy something that requires fixing, it is not in good condition.

I am giving you the benefit of the doubt that you were not aware these are bent but I am telling you now. And while I can appreciate that you would want to believe that this happened during shipping, it is highly implausible for a couple reasons. First, the damage was described to me to have been caused by (or by a similar force to) hitting a pothole at high speeds. That would require an excessive amount of down force on the wheels vertically but the wheels were stacked in the boxes horizontally. Second, even if somehow the wheels managed to experience said force, this would cause damage to the box. The boxes were perfectly fine which rules out any force large enough to damage the wheels in such a way that it would resemble hitting a pothole at high speeds.

-Austin

I was civil the whole time, even after he started giving me attitude. I had no idea he was just going to ignore me. He only sent two PMs in response to the bent wheels before he ignored me.

Is this the kind of seller you want on the boards? The kind that has no problem taking 650 of your hard-earned dollars and then has the gall to ignore you after a buyer brings up a potential problem with his product? This is utterly disgusting, does LS1Tech condone this type of behavior? It would seem so as there have been no consequences for 223Hawk. He obviously is operating with the attitude that once it is out of his door, it's not his problem. I give him $650 and all I get is two replies?

That theory shares the same problem as the one previously posted, it says that I have the intent on trying to scam 223Hawk. If I were intent on scamming 223Hawk it only makes sense that I would have told him very shortly after the wheels arrived but I told him after I had the wheels mounted. Why would I do that? Unless... The wheels were bent.

How often is it that people from the outside know 100% what happened? I would say that is a very rare occurrence. Hell, I am involved and I have no idea what happened. If things were always so black and white, we wouldn't have any need for trials. That is why we have prosecution and defense. Both sides make their cases and then people can weigh the cases and make a decision. We are completely capable of making rational decisions based on logic and facts. If people do not want to make a decision then that is their choice but do not pretend that there has not been enough information presented to make one.

Also, everyone seems to be missing a crucial detail. It does not matter how the wheels were bent. I agree that we will probably never now how it happened but the only thing that matters is if I can prove that it wasn't me. This is really all that matters because if it wasn't me then regardless of how they were bent any and all scenarios would thus make 223Hawk responsible.

At this point I must implore all of you to review everything that has been presented. There is really only one way that all the facts and details come together in a way that makes sense. Whenever somebody has come up with a possible scenario in which I could have done it, there is always a big problem with it.

BeastBuster

iTrader: (1)

Sorry for the double post, my post was too long for one post.

So let's look at each person's case (Facts only)

My case:

-223Hawk admitted shipping damage as a possibility but then ignores me
-The receipt from Discount proving I bought my tires when I said
-I sent a PM to 223Hawk about the bent wheels after buying tires from Discount
-The receipt for the wheel repair

Those are the facts, but there are further arguments for my case that are details throughout this thread and in direct response to the circumstantial points brought up against me. This post is already pretty long so I won't include everything, it is up to the reader to go back and read through all the information.

Furthermore, I would just like to make another point. Let's just ignore the receipt from Discount for a second. Let's assume that I could have been driving on the wheels before I took them to Discount. I think we can all agree that bending 3 wheels and bending the spokes on 2 is no simple task. I would have to be one hell of a talented driver to manage to do this under normal driving conditions in such a short time frame. If it were one wheel, I could see it being a possibility but we are talking about three.

Again, this ignores the receipt but I just wanted to further show the high implausibility that I somehow damaged the wheels myself.

Hawk's case:

-Time frame (Which is a double edged sword because this can actually be used as an argument for me in some circumstances)

And that is really all his case consists of. In reality he doesn't even have one because all he does is post excuses and irrelevant stories, etc.

As I have said, there is more than enough information here to make a decision. It is not really a case here of "Did 223Hawk bend them or did BeastBuster?" All that matters is me proving it wasn't me because by the process of elimination, who then would be responsible?

Why am I trying so hard to convince all of you? Well, I lost a lot of money because of 223Hawk, I take all of this very personally. I realize that money is probably never coming back. But I could not just sit here and be quiet about this. I trusted this guy and I got burned. Badly. I refuse to let anybody else get burned like I did. If I can help it, 223Hawk will not be selling another item on this board.

Jimmy P

iTrader: (177)

Sucks to hear that you got ripped off..Sounds to me like the seller had an idea that they were out of round but figured maybe the buyer would wait and get past the 60 day period that Paypal gives you.
If I was in your shoes I probably wouldn't have checked the rims for being out of round either..atleast not right away.
I bought some rims of here a few months ago, but we didn't get the car running until about 8 weeks later. The idea that the rims would be bent wasn't even in my head..Guess I am too trusting.

SSmoken

iTrader: (26)

yeah because people normally wait 2 months to examine an item they just bought.

89LS1RS

iTrader: (1)

i bought a $2500 chrome accesory drive from s+p. i have complained about some belt/pulley noise from the beginning. i have had the stuff for maybe 5 years, but havent drivenn the car all that much. i now realized i think the brackets that hold the alternator are not machined correctly or something, it looks like its not lined up, maybe consider it "bent"
i could not tell from visual inspection that there is an issue. much like beasts wheels
a long time has gone by so we will see what s+p thinks
i notified them of something wrong when i first got it, they said the bearings in the pullies are cheap and replace them with better ones. they sent me a new pulley. still have the problem. is s+p responsible to fix my problem? i think so

this situation is a little different, but it is similar in the long timeframe it took to get to the realization the parts are defective. similar to finding out the wheels were bent
in the end, i did not recieve what i paid 2500 for,a nice working accesory drive with no issues. beast did not get what he paid for, a set of firehawk wheels "in good condition"
it doesnt matter how it happened. beast didnt get what he paid for, the seller should do what he can to solve the problem. if 223hawk really believed they were damaged in shipping, he should have filed a claim, but i think he knew what really happened.

223HAWK

iTrader: (11)

I love how everyone says, that I knew they were bent or it they use what I said about being bent in Shipping against me! I said it could have happened. I again say, I never knew they were bent, Im not saying it did or did not happen in shipping, that was just a thought of how they could of ended up that way. I did not sell the Firehawk wheels knowing they were bent, and after this time period, I know nothing of what could have happend, Im not going to pay for something that the buyer could have done to them in this time frame. Sorry..

89LS1RS

iTrader: (1)

because those are the ONLY 2 out of 3 possibilities that make sense. they were damaged before you put them in the box, or they got damaged while in the box before beast got them. the fact that the boxes were not damaged discredits the second theory.

"unless beast is lying and trying to scam you for something he did to them after he got them."

BeastBuster

iTrader: (1)

Thanks, and yeah I am too trusting as well. I have paid for it. Oh and just a heads up (in case you need it sometime in the future) Paypal actually only gives you 45 days to make a dispute.

Yeah and apparently you haven't read through this thread. If you want to be sarcastic then expect it in return. People may not wait two months to examine an item, but it is fairly common that they will not install the part for a few months and that is when problems will become apparent.

Thank you for your understanding. I hope your situation works out for ya!

Alright, either you are intentionally being a dumbass or you just blew my mind. Of course the fact that you said they could have been damaged in shipping is going to be used against you. Who else would it be against? Me? That makes sense... You really need to read through everything that has been posted. Either that or you are just ignoring everything that has been said and continue to spout your ignorance. I guess I should spell it out for you.

The reason why the fact you said they could have been bent in shipping is being used against you is because you, as the seller, are responsible for shipping damage. Yet you made no effort to investigate this issue. You said it was a possibility and then ignored me. You graced me with a total of two PMs in regards to the bent wheels before you ignored me. Ignoring me is shady business to begin with, but after only two PMs, it is a lot worse. This would probably be why I and others think you knew something was up.

How they were damaged though is irrelevant. It is not my job to try and figure it out, it was only my job to let you know.

I swear if you bring up "this time period" again, I will have an aneurysm. You ignored me. Not to mention the time that has passed since I told you does not matter seeing as I told you in April. The only time frame that matters is that original 42 days. Did you miss the receipt I posted? I suggest you take a look, because it clearly shows that I bought the tires that are still on the car one day before I told you they were bent. You know for a fact that the wheels didn't come with tires, so then it should be obvious to you that the first time I had the wheels on the car was when I bought the tires. Unless you are really going to sit here and tell me I was running them without tires? So then, I ask you, what could I have possibly done to potentially bend them? Face it, this is on you. If you can't see that, you are clearly in denial. Before you post again, I suggest you actually read this thread. I grow tired of repeating myself just to try and get you to read the points you ignore.

SSmoken

iTrader: (26)

i could care less what you say to me. im not going to read through an entire thread of bickering. if one of the spokes was broken, imo thats noticeable and should have been brought to someones attention asap. also i wouldnt pay a repair shop hundreds of dollars to fix them just to have them tell me they cant be repaired. Maybe he didnt know they were bent, maybe they were bent in shipping, maybe you bent them. the fact of the matter is....nobody knows exactly. you could have bought these brand new and kept them in boxes until you decided to put them on. if you sent a complaint to the company months later i doubt they would refund your money either. its a risk you take. unfortunately it didnt work out.

brandon48080

iTrader: (1)

sounds like you bought the rims "AS IS" its just like buying a used car a gamble if you dont do your home work and check into deals this type of thing will happen you i can produce multipal receipts for tires i get them all the time waiting two months then asking for 1/2 off is crazy good luck to hawk hope he stops bugging you...

meine96ws6

iTrader: (4)

From what I can see 223Hawk takes meticulous care of his car. I really doubt that he would have just slammed potholes with 3 tires.
Now, I know for a fact that "delivery" people toss boxes into the trucks when they get loaded.

Imagine how long it would take to "carefully" load a truck.. Now, imagine if other things got stacked on top? I think how these bent, i understand it sucks to get a messed up part..

But, at the sam time I always check everything out asap.. Whether the parts get mounted or not.

nysbadmk8

Seller... and buyer beware. Used rims.. are used rims.. you now know better next time.

To the seller... maybe inspect your parts better next time..

Everyone needs to suck it up and take it as a life lesson.

TrenSuspension

iTrader: (6)

Agreed 100%...even if the UPS/FedEx guy tosses the box a short distance up into the truck, that is not enough to bend the wheels...srsly, what are they are made of, tin foil?? If the box had no visible signs of wear and tear I highly doubt they were bent in shipping...even though there are some whacky UPS/FedEx loaders/workers who don't care, I don't see them playing "keg toss" with a box of wheels and the box not being damaged. Sorry that excuse of damage in shipping is shady.

Sorry but I don't see the OP making up this up. Is it "possible" he f'ed up the wheels in that timeframe...yes...but he seems like a honest guy who got the short end of the stick regardless of time passed, which in reality is not a long time...we aren't talking 6 mo. down the road. He's made a concerned effort to prove he was wronged.

If the seller had some morals, he would refund part of this guy's troubles. Don't mean to attack you seller but something isn't adding up here.

BeastBuster

iTrader: (1)

By choosing not to read you are being willfully ignorant and I don't support such behavior especially when literally everything you said has been covered elsewhere in the thread.

Actually, it sounds like I paid for wheels in "great shape" (check the original ad, it's posted for a reason) and I received junk.

Also, are you seriously telling me that if I would have done some 'homework' that I could have been spared of this bullshit? I couldn't tell these things were bent when they were right in front of me and you are suggesting that there is some kind of research I could have possibly done to let me know these were gonna show up at my house bent? It seems to me you didn't do any 'homework' before posting this.

Get a clue, half my money back doesn't even cover the cost of the repairs.
$325<$390

Thank you. I cannot tell you how much I appreciate the fact that it seems as though you took the time to read through information presented here!

I think 223Hawk's actions show that morals are in short supply for him. He will never make this right.

Jmagliola

iTrader: (1)

Bottom line = You waited WAY TOO LONG to realize that the wheels had problems.

I would not help you out either. 42 days is 41 days too much. There is absolutely NO WAY I'd trust a buyer that he had nothing to do with my wheels being bent if he waited more then a month.

This is absolutely your fault for not taking the rims down to a tire place and asking them to check them out the day you got them.

There's so many ways that you could be scamming him in the timeframe here that he is absolutely doing the right thing.

You seem honest, but as far as he knows all you swapped them around with damaged wheels to get a refund.

You really need to inspect things the day you get them. If you can't visually inspect them, take them to someone who can.



My feeling is the seller has no responsibility outside of the buyer complaining within 3-5 business days. 42 days? yeah right.

BeastBuster

iTrader: (1)

Any particular reason you brought up this two month old thread? It would be one thing to do so with something relevant or new to say... though you have just repeated things brought up by others. Your logic is flawed, for reasons that I have covered many times. I'm not here to repeat myself a thousand times for people who aren't willing to go through the thread. There is a lot of information, and no, you don't have to read it. You also don't have to post in the thread.

By the way, I have never ever heard of a return policy window only being 3-5 business days. If that is really all the time you believe you as a seller are responsible for, I would never do business with you and I doubt others would either. If somebody complained to me about something I sold them, I would at the very least be willing to hear them out and allow them to present their case, evidence, or whatever to prove their point. It wouldn't matter to me how long it had been if they can make their point. I just don't agree with 223Hawk taking all that money from me and then not even giving me a chance to prove it and ignore me. That just doesn't seem honest to me.

Jmagliola

iTrader: (1)

Sure, i like to debate

Honestly, you are not dealing with a professional business here, and even a professional business would not call a statement from a tire place 42 days after purchase proof.

That's the problem here. My dad owns 5 stores in the north east, if someone claims something about a product 42 days later, it's too late!

Like I said, if you had taken it right to get the tires on and could have shown me as a seller that they were bent within 3-5 business days - then I would have been more understanding.

However, no matter how honest your friends say you are. If I was in his shoes and I KNEW for a fact that they weren't bent on my car, I simply wouldn't believe that you had nothing to do with bending the wheels, when you came back to me more then a month later...

bigboykilroy

iTrader: (48)

The thing that gets me is, I have seen some shady tire shops before sell junk that they dont need to.
Second. The repair order says nothing about bent rims just repair and refinish.
repair what exactly...a lip, a chip in the chrome, what...