Removing Cat Converters!!!
#21
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Again, if you need them for your state inspection then I understand.
For a street car, this would be too loud in most cases. Most people already have some sort of muffler when they add LTs and an ORY, so the muffler is already paid for, adding cats would just be an additional expense with no gains. If you have something that's basically mufflerless (like a Loudmouth, etc.), then cats might be a worthwhile option for volume control if you don't want to change the catback arrangement.
#23
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I have never said LT's come with CARB #'s and CARB only means something in California. No other state cares if the modification comes with that number. Connecticut has VERY strict emission requirements and we do not even get close to having to showing CARB #'s
What the link showed was how much technology has progressed and no matter how you slice it if it showed no decrease in power it would be not as good as running no cats at all. We are no longer in the 80's and thats the point.
What the OP was striving for was a "Balance" and asking for both sides.
I have run both with equal enjoyment and dealings with Police and Neighbors. In these cases there are Catted Y's that include dual electric cut outs before the CATS and you truely gain a balance. Not to give much credit but PewterScreaminMach ran that and saw decent gains but was able to open it up when needed.
You can approach the subject in many different ways and mod a car infinite amount of combinations but in the end the owner who pays the $$$ will determine what they want.
What the link showed was how much technology has progressed and no matter how you slice it if it showed no decrease in power it would be not as good as running no cats at all. We are no longer in the 80's and thats the point.
What the OP was striving for was a "Balance" and asking for both sides.
I have run both with equal enjoyment and dealings with Police and Neighbors. In these cases there are Catted Y's that include dual electric cut outs before the CATS and you truely gain a balance. Not to give much credit but PewterScreaminMach ran that and saw decent gains but was able to open it up when needed.
You can approach the subject in many different ways and mod a car infinite amount of combinations but in the end the owner who pays the $$$ will determine what they want.
#24
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Hooker mufflers are usually known to reduce rasp over other mufflers. Maybe you need a better quality Y-merge, like the Flowmaster Y. Another option would be to also add some Dynomax race bullets to the Y-pipe (or one in the I-pipe, if you don't have space elsewhere).
If you are willing to do a different system entirely, true duals with your headers, no cats and something like round/oval Magnaflow (or Borla XR-1) mufflers will give you a very nice "deep muscle car rumble".
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Originally Posted by BlackScreaminMachine
The only time I would consider removing CAT's on these cars is for the installation of a 2-Step or if I was building a track only car.
I think we can agree on the following (as any reasonable person should be able to):
- Cats do not increase power
- Cats cost more money than an ORY
...so you are spending extra money to gain no additional performace of any kind, and in fact losing a bit of performance (albeit small).
The only advantages I can see to cats are the following:
- Volume reduction (might or might not be an advtanage, depending on opinion)
- Emissions compliance
....as far as the first point, there are other ways to reduce volume/rasp that are cheaper than cats (bullet mufflers are $40 each, if you feel your catback isn't quiet enough). I know there are cheap cats on the market too, but they tend to not last long (especially behind a modified engine). So once again, you are left with the only exclusive benefit of cats being emissions compliance. That is the only factor where cats are exclusively advantageous, and even that factor is lost if you have to pass a strict visual inspection and they are not in the stock location (which they never are with LTs). This may not be a problem in your state, but not everyone lives in CT.
#26
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The fact is that having the quickest and easiest route to exit the exhaust will be the most optimal for max effort power. I will never disagree with that and having CATS will always to a degree add a restriction.
But in the real world, there is a balance and in the end, when it comes down to a timeslip or a dyno sheet it can be said that "there is still more in it".
I see your point of "Well if its not going to strict emission legal, then might as well go all the way" and to a point I agree but in the end I have seen guys take my set up and on a bolt on/cam only combination not show that much of a difference to make it worth while for the noise/attention. Especially when you get into stainless steel exhaust like a Corsa/Borla or even a LM1.
Will say there are good points both ways but the owner needs to decide if they can deal with the head aches.
I think the OP will have plenty to work with.
But in the real world, there is a balance and in the end, when it comes down to a timeslip or a dyno sheet it can be said that "there is still more in it".
I see your point of "Well if its not going to strict emission legal, then might as well go all the way" and to a point I agree but in the end I have seen guys take my set up and on a bolt on/cam only combination not show that much of a difference to make it worth while for the noise/attention. Especially when you get into stainless steel exhaust like a Corsa/Borla or even a LM1.
Will say there are good points both ways but the owner needs to decide if they can deal with the head aches.
I think the OP will have plenty to work with.