most reliable and hassle-free way to make ~450rwhp?
12-15-2005, 07:35 AM
#21
On The Tree
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 110
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by 777
HMM, I thought there were some problems with the c6 z06.
12-15-2005, 08:04 AM
#23
9 Second Club
iTrader: (15)
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: VT/SC
Posts: 3,132
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
My dads car is prob the most hassle free 450rwhp car I've seen... Bone stock with no bolt-ons and 1000 miles he had a p1 blower and intercooler installed... after a tune it was good for 446 rwhp. The car drove like any other vette until you floored it. Then he went with a 224 cam and raised the rev limiter to 6600. It's now making 500+ and it still drives almost like stock. I think thats the easiest and most headache free way to 500 rwhp.
12-15-2005, 10:08 AM
#25
TECH Enthusiast
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Texas is home; Sasebo Japan for now :(
Posts: 736
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by Chas1
I'm at 7lbs and making 436 RWHP 404 RWTQ. I haven't run it at the track, waiting until after Christmas to get some drag radials. I get absolutley NO traction now.
if its too much hassle, i understand lol
12-15-2005, 11:43 AM
#26
Originally Posted by 300bhp/ton
Can I start by asking you a few questions.
1. Why do you want 450rwhp, is it for bragging rights or dyno stats?
Surly if you want a fast car, then setting a target ET and building a car to achieve it would be a better bet.
2. You seem at odds, 450rwhp, well a real 450rwhp (meaning not produced on a non load bearing dyno) is actually a lot to ask and still be reliable. Think about it there are very few production cars that make that kind of power, and the ones that do are very expensive and usually exotic supercars that are not designed to be driven daily.
NOTE: 450rwhp on a Dynojet dyno would be like dynoing 410-430rwhp or less on a Mustang Dyno. The power is of course the same, but the numbers will vary.
If you are after that kind of power then, no a H/C full bolt on appraoch would not be best. Sure it will make the power (just) but it's street manors will be pretty compromised. It would probably be reliable, but durability will suffer resulting in much higher and more frequent maintance. So therefore I see 3 options. None particulary cheap.
1. Full bolt on's with a mild cam. This should get you to a genuine 370+rwhp. And then have a shot of nitrous so you can up the anti when needed. This is the cheapest option, but to do it properly will require you to upgrade the chassis/suspension and other components.
From stock budget on ~$7000 in parts (no labour) and that's provided nothing breaks. However, you will eventually break your rear end so add another $2000-2500 on top to cover that.
2. Same as above, but get either a 402 or 408ci block. This way you probably can ditch the nitrous and still make some good power. But it's going to be more expensive.
3. Supercharger, you might not need as many bolt ons, but a few won't go a miss. This will probably cost similar to getting a bigger ci motor. And should easily make 440rwhp (Mustang Dyno). But it will cost and although 7-8psi of boost is considered safe, you may still blow the engine up (it can and does happen). So a forged engine is a safer bet, but it's even more $$$.
As I said, instead of aiming at a particular HP level, why not just build the car up to meet a particular goal.
Personally I'd rather dyno less power and run faster, than make massive dyno stats but be unable to use any of it.
Here's my build sheet for my mods. There's still plenty of variation, but I have researched each component type and manufacture. And I am happy that it will deliver the performance I am requiring. I would also port my own TB and would carry provisions for replacing the rear end when it breaks.
Full Service:
All fluids, plugs, leads, belts, etc.
Induction:
TSP Lid Texas Speed & Performance $95.00
Paper filter
Exhaust:
PaceSetter Exhaust Ceramic-Coated Long Tube Headers, 1998-1999 LS1 F-Body with Emissions Fittings, With TSP 3" Y-Pipe with Hi-Flow Catalytic Converters Texas Speed & Performance $700.00
SLP Loud Mouth single 3.5" slash tip on each side Texas Speed & Performance $405.99
Transmission:
Pro Yank 3400 stall Yank $995.00
Perma Cool 20-22000 GVW Transmission Cooler Texas Speed & Performance $49.99
Tuning:
VCM Suite Pro HP Tuners $499.00
Dyno Tune $400.00
Suspension & Chassis:
Tubular Sub-Frame Connectors - Mild Steel Spohn Performance $150.00
Tubular LS1 Solid Motor Mounts Spohn Performance $145.00
Tubular Shock Tower Brace Spohn Performance $85.00
Lower Control Arms - Boxed with Poly Bushings Spohn Performance $140.00
LCA Mounting Hardware Kit (F) Spohn Performance $10.95
Lower Control Arm Relocation Brackets Spohn Performance $65.00
Panhard Bar - Adjustable with Poly Bushings Spohn Performance $125.00
Panhard Bar Mounting Hardware Kit Spohn Performance $10.95
Adj. Torque Arm - LS1 F-Body w/Long Tubes Spohn Performance $435.00
Torque Arm Rear Mounting Hardware Kit Spohn Performance $19.95
Spohn Sway Bars - Solid 4140 Chrome Moly Spohn Performance $295.00
Poly Bushing & Chassis Grease - 14 oz. Tube Spohn Performance $15.00
Polyurethane Transmission Mount - GM Spohn Performance $24.50
Additional Performance modifications:
SLP LS6 Intake Manifold with EGR Provision Texas Speed & Performance $498.99
Thunder Racing LS1 Cam Swap Package w/ Dual Valve Springsxincluding gasket set ($54.99) and complete with TR224/224-112 Camshaft Thunder Racing $854.98
Wheels:
American Racing Equipment Classic Torq-Thrust II Wheels Summit Racing, 17 x 9.5 all round with 275/40-17 tyres $1,371.96
The brakes would also need to be updated. And I'd probably go for a Strange 12 bolt rear with 3.73 gears.
All the above are what I would consider FULL BOLT ONS with a cam. There are still many parts such as MAF and pulley swaps and smooth bellows. However I do not deem them either worth the hassle, pointless or possible counter productive to change (for future modifications). Also the car should still remain comfortbale to drive and ride in, sound good without being too noisy. Retain all the creature comforts, handle well. And be FULL emissions legal. If it's still not enough I would add a Procharger also and run 7-8psi.
From here on you could go 125 shot of nitrous, or indeed add a Procharger D1 blower, although you may want to revise which cam to use if you go FI.
Hope this helps.
1. Why do you want 450rwhp, is it for bragging rights or dyno stats?
Surly if you want a fast car, then setting a target ET and building a car to achieve it would be a better bet.
2. You seem at odds, 450rwhp, well a real 450rwhp (meaning not produced on a non load bearing dyno) is actually a lot to ask and still be reliable. Think about it there are very few production cars that make that kind of power, and the ones that do are very expensive and usually exotic supercars that are not designed to be driven daily.
NOTE: 450rwhp on a Dynojet dyno would be like dynoing 410-430rwhp or less on a Mustang Dyno. The power is of course the same, but the numbers will vary.
If you are after that kind of power then, no a H/C full bolt on appraoch would not be best. Sure it will make the power (just) but it's street manors will be pretty compromised. It would probably be reliable, but durability will suffer resulting in much higher and more frequent maintance. So therefore I see 3 options. None particulary cheap.
1. Full bolt on's with a mild cam. This should get you to a genuine 370+rwhp. And then have a shot of nitrous so you can up the anti when needed. This is the cheapest option, but to do it properly will require you to upgrade the chassis/suspension and other components.
From stock budget on ~$7000 in parts (no labour) and that's provided nothing breaks. However, you will eventually break your rear end so add another $2000-2500 on top to cover that.
2. Same as above, but get either a 402 or 408ci block. This way you probably can ditch the nitrous and still make some good power. But it's going to be more expensive.
3. Supercharger, you might not need as many bolt ons, but a few won't go a miss. This will probably cost similar to getting a bigger ci motor. And should easily make 440rwhp (Mustang Dyno). But it will cost and although 7-8psi of boost is considered safe, you may still blow the engine up (it can and does happen). So a forged engine is a safer bet, but it's even more $$$.
As I said, instead of aiming at a particular HP level, why not just build the car up to meet a particular goal.
Personally I'd rather dyno less power and run faster, than make massive dyno stats but be unable to use any of it.
Here's my build sheet for my mods. There's still plenty of variation, but I have researched each component type and manufacture. And I am happy that it will deliver the performance I am requiring. I would also port my own TB and would carry provisions for replacing the rear end when it breaks.
Full Service:
All fluids, plugs, leads, belts, etc.
Induction:
TSP Lid Texas Speed & Performance $95.00
Paper filter
Exhaust:
PaceSetter Exhaust Ceramic-Coated Long Tube Headers, 1998-1999 LS1 F-Body with Emissions Fittings, With TSP 3" Y-Pipe with Hi-Flow Catalytic Converters Texas Speed & Performance $700.00
SLP Loud Mouth single 3.5" slash tip on each side Texas Speed & Performance $405.99
Transmission:
Pro Yank 3400 stall Yank $995.00
Perma Cool 20-22000 GVW Transmission Cooler Texas Speed & Performance $49.99
Tuning:
VCM Suite Pro HP Tuners $499.00
Dyno Tune $400.00
Suspension & Chassis:
Tubular Sub-Frame Connectors - Mild Steel Spohn Performance $150.00
Tubular LS1 Solid Motor Mounts Spohn Performance $145.00
Tubular Shock Tower Brace Spohn Performance $85.00
Lower Control Arms - Boxed with Poly Bushings Spohn Performance $140.00
LCA Mounting Hardware Kit (F) Spohn Performance $10.95
Lower Control Arm Relocation Brackets Spohn Performance $65.00
Panhard Bar - Adjustable with Poly Bushings Spohn Performance $125.00
Panhard Bar Mounting Hardware Kit Spohn Performance $10.95
Adj. Torque Arm - LS1 F-Body w/Long Tubes Spohn Performance $435.00
Torque Arm Rear Mounting Hardware Kit Spohn Performance $19.95
Spohn Sway Bars - Solid 4140 Chrome Moly Spohn Performance $295.00
Poly Bushing & Chassis Grease - 14 oz. Tube Spohn Performance $15.00
Polyurethane Transmission Mount - GM Spohn Performance $24.50
Additional Performance modifications:
SLP LS6 Intake Manifold with EGR Provision Texas Speed & Performance $498.99
Thunder Racing LS1 Cam Swap Package w/ Dual Valve Springsxincluding gasket set ($54.99) and complete with TR224/224-112 Camshaft Thunder Racing $854.98
Wheels:
American Racing Equipment Classic Torq-Thrust II Wheels Summit Racing, 17 x 9.5 all round with 275/40-17 tyres $1,371.96
The brakes would also need to be updated. And I'd probably go for a Strange 12 bolt rear with 3.73 gears.
All the above are what I would consider FULL BOLT ONS with a cam. There are still many parts such as MAF and pulley swaps and smooth bellows. However I do not deem them either worth the hassle, pointless or possible counter productive to change (for future modifications). Also the car should still remain comfortbale to drive and ride in, sound good without being too noisy. Retain all the creature comforts, handle well. And be FULL emissions legal. If it's still not enough I would add a Procharger also and run 7-8psi.
From here on you could go 125 shot of nitrous, or indeed add a Procharger D1 blower, although you may want to revise which cam to use if you go FI.
Hope this helps.
12-15-2005, 11:48 AM
#27
Originally Posted by Wants an LS1
Yea the pepole who dont own it and want one, funny how there the ones telling us of the "problems". didnt that happen with the last z06 and now its been found that with a driver an 02-04 can crack off an 11.9x et?
12-15-2005, 09:08 PM
#29
Launching!
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: The Woodlands, TX
Posts: 223
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by 02blackws679ta
awesome. could you PM me like, a run down of your costs and what not?
if its too much hassle, i understand lol
if its too much hassle, i understand lol
12-15-2005, 09:49 PM
#30
TECH Enthusiast
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Texas is home; Sasebo Japan for now :(
Posts: 736
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
as of now i've got kooks lt's, lanes duals, tsp lid, pretty good amount of suspension mods, and various other things that dont really matter in regards to this.
i'd like to be able to just order the dsc1 kit and have it bolted on, but i know its never as easy as that.
i'd like to be able to just order the dsc1 kit and have it bolted on, but i know its never as easy as that.
12-16-2005, 04:58 AM
#31
TECH Addict
Originally Posted by 02blackws679ta
as of now i've got kooks lt's, lanes duals, tsp lid, pretty good amount of suspension mods, and various other things that dont really matter in regards to this.
i'd like to be able to just order the dsc1 kit and have it bolted on, but i know its never as easy as that.
i'd like to be able to just order the dsc1 kit and have it bolted on, but i know its never as easy as that.
12-16-2005, 11:59 AM
#32
TECH Apprentice
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: fairfax, va
Posts: 362
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by 777
HMM, I thought there were some problems with the c6 z06.
