My Fuel Solenoid Failed
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From: Cape Coral, Florida
My Fuel Solenoid Failed I have run 6 or 7 bottles through my TNT F1 Wet kit. Last night I ran out of nitrous in the middle of a run for the first time, and it didn't bog down. I took the bottle off, it was empty. I tried running the car agian, activated the system and no bogging at all. I thought that this was a little strange, I have always heard that the engine will bog down when you run out of juice and get extra fuel. I take the car home disconnect the fuel solenoid from the power ring and try to test it out. The solenoid click but no fuel, well maybe a dribble. The car was running and the schrader valve was removed. My car usally runs rich N/A at about 925mv but when I sprayed 100 shot it would drop down to the 600mv for a split second then back up to 860-880 (most of the time). On the 75 shot it would drop to 880 and stay there. I have LS1 scanmaster and I have only gotten high knock retard a few times 3.9 degrees (this was at the track at the end of the 1/4). I usally see less than 1.5 degrees. Have I been spraying this whole time with no fuel. Do you think that my engine is damaged. What next
Teching In
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From: Lafayette, Louisiana
Re: My Fuel Solenoid Failed Do you have a Fuel Safety Switch? If not, I'd recommend investing in one to protect against just the sort of occurrence you are referring to.
FoFo
'96 Corvette GS "Clone" 454 / 400 N2O
FoFo
'96 Corvette GS "Clone" 454 / 400 N2O
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From: Cape Coral, Florida
Re: My Fuel Solenoid Failed Yes, I do have a FPSS. I don't see how the switch could help me out any, I have the pressure to the noid. The fuel noid wasn't opening.
On The Tree
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From: Austin, Texas
Re: My Fuel Solenoid Failed umm, why wouldnt you connect the FPSS at the opposite end of the fuel noid? If it fails then it shuts down. makes sence to me, but i always see it before at the rail.
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From: chicago
Re: My Fuel Solenoid Failed To test the noid put a small screw driver or something similar near the back end of the noid by the nut holding on the cover. The shaft in the middle will become magnetic when you activate the noid. That tells you the noid is working. There has been alot of talk about the seat in the noid swelling up from the 10%ethanol gas that would make the opening in the noid to become obstructed even when it was technically open.also check for any forgien particals (like teflon tape) that could be blocking the solenoid up. hope that helps
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Re: My Fuel Solenoid Failed I had a similar incident happen on the 150 shot but luckily i noticed the O2's drop to ZERO!!! I had a swelled solenoid seal on the plunger. Call TNT they will fix you up. This is caused by cheap gas which uses a ethanol additive to up the octane. NEVER buy CITGO gas. I always stay with Texaco and Chvevron after this incident and have never had a problem again. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" />
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Re: My Fuel Solenoid Failed </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by cantdrv65:
<strong>I had a similar incident happen on the 150 shot but luckily i noticed the O2's drop to ZERO!!! I had a swelled solenoid seal on the plunger. Call TNT they will fix you up. This is caused by cheap gas which uses a ethanol additive to up the octane. NEVER buy CITGO gas. I always stay with Texaco and Chvevron after this incident and have never had a problem again. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" /> </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">EXACTLY my friend. Thats what happend to mine, but I was spraying a 200 wet shot for a bottle and a half and NO engine damage. knock on some serious wood!!!
I now use only Amoco gas and now 0 problems. Citgo caused mine also. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="gr_images/icons/mad.gif" />
<strong>I had a similar incident happen on the 150 shot but luckily i noticed the O2's drop to ZERO!!! I had a swelled solenoid seal on the plunger. Call TNT they will fix you up. This is caused by cheap gas which uses a ethanol additive to up the octane. NEVER buy CITGO gas. I always stay with Texaco and Chvevron after this incident and have never had a problem again. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" /> </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">EXACTLY my friend. Thats what happend to mine, but I was spraying a 200 wet shot for a bottle and a half and NO engine damage. knock on some serious wood!!!
I now use only Amoco gas and now 0 problems. Citgo caused mine also. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Mad]" src="gr_images/icons/mad.gif" />
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From: CA
Re: My Fuel Solenoid Failed </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Bob99Z28:
<strong>umm, why wouldnt you connect the FPSS at the opposite end of the fuel noid? If it fails then it shuts down. makes sence to me, but i always see it before at the rail.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Most people have both solenoids tied to the same relay. The FPSS would complete the ground for that relay. Therefore, if the FPSS is on the other side of the solenoid, the ground would never be completed for that relay because there is no fuel pressure until the solenoid is open. You could do something like what you are talking aout if the fuel and N2O solenoids are on different relays, and the fuel relay does not have the FPSS completion but the N2O does. Then the fuel solenoid has to open and pressurize the FPSS before the N2O opens. I've thought about doing that myself, but I figured it was too much work and I wasn't even sure how much "lag" there would be. Safest thing to do is probably wire two fuel solenoids in parallel.
<strong>umm, why wouldnt you connect the FPSS at the opposite end of the fuel noid? If it fails then it shuts down. makes sence to me, but i always see it before at the rail.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Most people have both solenoids tied to the same relay. The FPSS would complete the ground for that relay. Therefore, if the FPSS is on the other side of the solenoid, the ground would never be completed for that relay because there is no fuel pressure until the solenoid is open. You could do something like what you are talking aout if the fuel and N2O solenoids are on different relays, and the fuel relay does not have the FPSS completion but the N2O does. Then the fuel solenoid has to open and pressurize the FPSS before the N2O opens. I've thought about doing that myself, but I figured it was too much work and I wasn't even sure how much "lag" there would be. Safest thing to do is probably wire two fuel solenoids in parallel.
Re: My Fuel Solenoid Failed Do not try to use a FPSS...Throw it in the trash it is a POS. Get a quality A/F meter and you will notice the problem quickly. I had a FPSS and it would turn on and off with simple engine vibration. They are just cheap hobbs switches and will introduce more problems than they will prevent.... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" />
Remember fuel is just like any other thing in life you get what you pay for. I would also avoid Diamond Shamrock.
<small>[ July 09, 2002, 10:04 PM: Message edited by: cantdrv65 ]</small>
Remember fuel is just like any other thing in life you get what you pay for. I would also avoid Diamond Shamrock.
<small>[ July 09, 2002, 10:04 PM: Message edited by: cantdrv65 ]</small>
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From: CA
Re: My Fuel Solenoid Failed </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by rich:
<strong>2 fuel soleniods in parallel? You wouldn't know one was bad til both were bad. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" /> </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Well, I test my solenoids periodically, so I'm sure I would notice a problem. But yes, it is possible for two solenoids to go bad, not very likely though.
<strong>2 fuel soleniods in parallel? You wouldn't know one was bad til both were bad. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" /> </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Well, I test my solenoids periodically, so I'm sure I would notice a problem. But yes, it is possible for two solenoids to go bad, not very likely though.
Re: My Fuel Solenoid Failed </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by akw408:
<strong> </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by rich:
<strong>2 fuel soleniods in parallel? You wouldn't know one was bad til both were bad. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" /> </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Well, I test my solenoids periodically, so I'm sure I would notice a problem. But yes, it is possible for two solenoids to go bad, not very likely though.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">If you wire two fuel solenoids in parallel and get bad gas, you will simply have two bad fuel solenoids instead of one..... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" /> Basically you've done nothing except add expense and labor. Think about it. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" />
<small>[ July 12, 2002, 12:04 AM: Message edited by: cantdrv65 ]</small>
<strong> </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by rich:
<strong>2 fuel soleniods in parallel? You wouldn't know one was bad til both were bad. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Confused]" src="images/icons/confused.gif" /> </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Well, I test my solenoids periodically, so I'm sure I would notice a problem. But yes, it is possible for two solenoids to go bad, not very likely though.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">If you wire two fuel solenoids in parallel and get bad gas, you will simply have two bad fuel solenoids instead of one..... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" /> Basically you've done nothing except add expense and labor. Think about it. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" />
<small>[ July 12, 2002, 12:04 AM: Message edited by: cantdrv65 ]</small>
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From: CA
Re: My Fuel Solenoid Failed </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by cantdrv65:
<strong>If you wire two fuel solenoids in parallel and get bad gas, you will simply have two bad fuel solenoids instead of one..... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" /> Basically you've done nothing except add expense and labor. Think about it. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" /> </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">If you add gas with ethanol, yes, you may be screwed. I don't think that they will both go bad at the same time, but it can happen. Most likely they won't both go bad at the same time though. The parallel fuel solenoids is a preventive measure for solenoids sticking closed for whatever reason, ethanol and other crap. I didn't say that parallel fuel solenoids was the answer to all your problems. If you don't check them routinely and put bad gas in, then skip putting two fuel solenoids in.
<strong>If you wire two fuel solenoids in parallel and get bad gas, you will simply have two bad fuel solenoids instead of one..... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" /> Basically you've done nothing except add expense and labor. Think about it. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" /> </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">If you add gas with ethanol, yes, you may be screwed. I don't think that they will both go bad at the same time, but it can happen. Most likely they won't both go bad at the same time though. The parallel fuel solenoids is a preventive measure for solenoids sticking closed for whatever reason, ethanol and other crap. I didn't say that parallel fuel solenoids was the answer to all your problems. If you don't check them routinely and put bad gas in, then skip putting two fuel solenoids in.
Launching!
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From: Jacksonville, FL
Re: My Fuel Solenoid Failed Ok, I get the "parallel" thing but if they both opened, wouldnt you get twice the amount of fuel you need? I first thought you meant in series like you run N2O noids sometimes to make sure you get the N2O closed off in case one sticks open but then I reread it. You're saying to put them side by side with a Y fitting before them and another Y before they enter the nozzle right?
Re: My Fuel Solenoid Failed </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Jax White TA:
<strong>Ok, I get the "parallel" thing but if they both opened, wouldnt you get twice the amount of fuel you need? I first thought you meant in series like you run N2O noids sometimes to make sure you get the N2O closed off in case one sticks open but then I reread it. You're saying to put them side by side with a Y fitting before them and another Y before they enter the nozzle right?</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">The jet that is at the nozzle is what controls the amount of fuel that goes into the motor not the amount of solenoids pushing fuel to the jets.
<strong>Ok, I get the "parallel" thing but if they both opened, wouldnt you get twice the amount of fuel you need? I first thought you meant in series like you run N2O noids sometimes to make sure you get the N2O closed off in case one sticks open but then I reread it. You're saying to put them side by side with a Y fitting before them and another Y before they enter the nozzle right?</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">The jet that is at the nozzle is what controls the amount of fuel that goes into the motor not the amount of solenoids pushing fuel to the jets.
Teching In
Joined: Feb 2002
Posts: 29
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From: Lower Delaware
Re: My Fuel Solenoid Failed How many people are looking at an air/fuel
gauge on an 11 sec pass??? especially with an M6.
That is why I am going to shoot a dry shot, however
I never had any problem with my Nitrous Works wet
kit that was on our 96 M6.
With other applications, I have had NOS solenoids
go bad, but never gas ones.
I always run Exxon 93... as a side note.
Goodluck, I still think a good Fuel pressure safety
switch would be a good idea????
gauge on an 11 sec pass??? especially with an M6.
That is why I am going to shoot a dry shot, however
I never had any problem with my Nitrous Works wet
kit that was on our 96 M6.
With other applications, I have had NOS solenoids
go bad, but never gas ones.
I always run Exxon 93... as a side note.
Goodluck, I still think a good Fuel pressure safety
switch would be a good idea????
Re: My Fuel Solenoid Failed </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by akw408:
<strong> </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by cantdrv65:
<strong>If you wire two fuel solenoids in parallel and get bad gas, you will simply have two bad fuel solenoids instead of one..... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" /> Basically you've done nothing except add expense and labor. Think about it. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" /> </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">If you add gas with ethanol, yes, you may be screwed. I don't think that they will both go bad at the same time, but it can happen. Most likely they won't both go bad at the same time though. The parallel fuel solenoids is a preventive measure for solenoids sticking closed for whatever reason, ethanol and other crap. I didn't say that parallel fuel solenoids was the answer to all your problems. If you don't check them routinely and put bad gas in, then skip putting two fuel solenoids in.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Simply install an A/F gauge...It is cheaper and you will see the lean condition immediately. You get some bad fuel and both solenoids WILL swell shut thus you have spent more funds and prevented nothing.
<strong> </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by cantdrv65:
<strong>If you wire two fuel solenoids in parallel and get bad gas, you will simply have two bad fuel solenoids instead of one..... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" /> Basically you've done nothing except add expense and labor. Think about it. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" /> </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">If you add gas with ethanol, yes, you may be screwed. I don't think that they will both go bad at the same time, but it can happen. Most likely they won't both go bad at the same time though. The parallel fuel solenoids is a preventive measure for solenoids sticking closed for whatever reason, ethanol and other crap. I didn't say that parallel fuel solenoids was the answer to all your problems. If you don't check them routinely and put bad gas in, then skip putting two fuel solenoids in.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Simply install an A/F gauge...It is cheaper and you will see the lean condition immediately. You get some bad fuel and both solenoids WILL swell shut thus you have spent more funds and prevented nothing.
