Catalitic decomposition of Nitrous Oxide
07-04-2004, 07:03 AM
#82
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Originally Posted by Draco
Question:
Spark plugs are designed to remove heat from the combustion chamber. What affect does the catalyst coating have on a plug's ability to disipate this heat and thus help prevent pre-ignition?
I would be wary of taking a catalytic plug and not only increase cylinder pressure, but also increase the heat in the combustion chamber and increase my chances of pre-ignition.
Spark plugs are designed to remove heat from the combustion chamber. What affect does the catalyst coating have on a plug's ability to disipate this heat and thus help prevent pre-ignition?
I would be wary of taking a catalytic plug and not only increase cylinder pressure, but also increase the heat in the combustion chamber and increase my chances of pre-ignition.
Originally Posted by P Mack
Wouldn't it be better to spray this stuff in the intake manifold or intake ports of the head? Seems like it would come in contact with more of the charge that way. I am looking forward to the results.
07-04-2004, 09:25 PM
#83
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Originally Posted by BigPlanTransAm
well, increased cylinder pressure = increased horsepower. that increased pressure usually comes from a more oxygen being burned which = more heat... so you would be afraid of something that shows the characteristics of more power? excessive heat is bad, im just correcting your thoughts on the combustion process.
well if it makes spark plugs cost $80 with a few dabs on the tip, how much would you be willing to pay to spray it away into your combustion chamber?
well if it makes spark plugs cost $80 with a few dabs on the tip, how much would you be willing to pay to spray it away into your combustion chamber?
Yep, increased heat is fantastic - on the combustion/power stroke. But I want my spark plug to help dissipate that heat ASAP before the next compression stroke to avoid pre-igniting the fresh mixture. I just worried that the coating would reduce the heat dissipation - then on the next compression stroke, have the catalyst work so well that the "extra" oxygen released by it would ignite early (pre-ignition) thanks to this extra heat.
07-06-2004, 09:57 AM
#84
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Hey guys this thread has been going on for awhile. Just got off the phone with NX, they just finished some track test on 8,7 and 6 second cars. There track rep saw no change in ET,MPH or tune up. If these plugs are so power ful why didn't those cars see any decrease in et.
07-06-2004, 03:37 PM
#87
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As I have already said that my plugs are still a prototype and they should begin with little powers. First they installed my plugs on a more than 600 cubic inces car and not tuned for catalyst. 
I can find two explanations to this result:
1. There was not enough fuel (as on the NX's dyno test)
2. Catalyst fastened off or melted because of high temps.
Anyway I haven`t seen the result and I was not informed by NX.
However we prepared a new solution, optimized for saving the catalyst in an agressive environment...
I can find two explanations to this result:
1. There was not enough fuel (as on the NX's dyno test)
2. Catalyst fastened off or melted because of high temps.
Anyway I haven`t seen the result and I was not informed by NX.
However we prepared a new solution, optimized for saving the catalyst in an agressive environment...
Last edited by VIl; 07-09-2004 at 05:07 AM.
07-09-2004, 07:10 AM
#90
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The results of the NX tests contradict the laws of the nature. The catalytic agent should add power, and it was noticed, on any car. If there is enough of fuel and catalytic agent is existing.
P.S.And nevertheless the Earth spins
P.S.And nevertheless the Earth spins
07-11-2004, 12:41 PM
#92
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Everything is not so awful.
Negative result is a result too. Also, the abscense of any analysys is evident.
If you remember, the results of their dyno tell about opposite.
And you should agree, that current invention is the only one since the beginning of nitrous oxide applying for the last 25 years (even since WW2), maybe except wet systems were made.
It isn`t worth thinking that catalyst is a magic, that`s why some technical problems should be taken out before the serial device grows from a prototype.
It`s a hard work and you can help me cope with it.
Negative result is a result too. Also, the abscense of any analysys is evident.
If you remember, the results of their dyno tell about opposite.
And you should agree, that current invention is the only one since the beginning of nitrous oxide applying for the last 25 years (even since WW2), maybe except wet systems were made.
It isn`t worth thinking that catalyst is a magic, that`s why some technical problems should be taken out before the serial device grows from a prototype.
It`s a hard work and you can help me cope with it.
07-13-2004, 05:15 AM
#94
Someone else seems to have done a little research into this catalytic decomposition thing, although the abstract referenced below is about using propane & nitrous as a rocket fuel, not really automotive. Has anyone seen this before?
http://www.stormingmedia.us/84/8443/A844393.html
http://www.stormingmedia.us/84/8443/A844393.html
07-13-2004, 10:10 AM
#95
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Interesting read for sure:
Just a couple questions: This seems to be a race type platform only as 2000 miles on plugs isn't very good for a daily driver (yes it's a prototype and results should be lengthened). Instead of a coating on the plug wouldn't a fuel additive or even a sister canister to inject the catallyst in with the n20 work better? (if it can be made in a gas form)
I can see this working for NHRA classes of cars which are only allowed a certian hp shot with their weight of vehicle, but for street use where u can just bump up jet sizes, it doesn't seem economically feasable ( I for one don't want to replace plugs in that LS1 every 2000 miles)
I'm also a little confused (and it's been talked about in length) that if you start the decomposition earlier wouldn't that just be pre-Detonation? So to get the max performance out of this plug you'd have to adjust the timing and add more fuel in with the n20 right?
It seems that one would get more performance and safty out of injecting propane in with the n20..
Just some thoughts.
Just a couple questions: This seems to be a race type platform only as 2000 miles on plugs isn't very good for a daily driver (yes it's a prototype and results should be lengthened). Instead of a coating on the plug wouldn't a fuel additive or even a sister canister to inject the catallyst in with the n20 work better? (if it can be made in a gas form)
I can see this working for NHRA classes of cars which are only allowed a certian hp shot with their weight of vehicle, but for street use where u can just bump up jet sizes, it doesn't seem economically feasable ( I for one don't want to replace plugs in that LS1 every 2000 miles)
I'm also a little confused (and it's been talked about in length) that if you start the decomposition earlier wouldn't that just be pre-Detonation? So to get the max performance out of this plug you'd have to adjust the timing and add more fuel in with the n20 right?
It seems that one would get more performance and safty out of injecting propane in with the n20..
Just some thoughts.
07-15-2004, 08:34 AM
#96
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Thanks to 69Muscle for a kind word.
Usually catalysts are metals, oxides or complex subjects, which are not gasous. I don`t have any information about N2O catalyst in vapor form. Also I don`t obtain any information about N2O catalyst, which decomposes it earlier than 100C, to place it somewhere in the intake manifold. Here, as you see, is the difference between my patent ans NASA`s one (that`s what LS1M was speaking about), that the catalyst should be placed inside the combustion chamber.
Nothing is going to happen to the catalyst after 2000 miles, but it will be covered with gasoline depositions. So you just need to clean them. Probably this will not happen in the USA, as gasoline is cleaner there. And the plugs will run 20000 miles.
The ability of engine, equipped with catalyst, to detonate is higher, but we couls successfully cope with it. As you can see the tests by NX more fuel is required and it is easy to tune...
Usually catalysts are metals, oxides or complex subjects, which are not gasous. I don`t have any information about N2O catalyst in vapor form. Also I don`t obtain any information about N2O catalyst, which decomposes it earlier than 100C, to place it somewhere in the intake manifold. Here, as you see, is the difference between my patent ans NASA`s one (that`s what LS1M was speaking about), that the catalyst should be placed inside the combustion chamber.
Nothing is going to happen to the catalyst after 2000 miles, but it will be covered with gasoline depositions. So you just need to clean them. Probably this will not happen in the USA, as gasoline is cleaner there. And the plugs will run 20000 miles.
The ability of engine, equipped with catalyst, to detonate is higher, but we couls successfully cope with it. As you can see the tests by NX more fuel is required and it is easy to tune...
07-15-2004, 08:41 AM
#97
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Originally Posted by VIl
Thanks to 69Muscle for a kind word.
Usually catalysts are metals, oxides or complex subjects, which are not gasous. I don`t have any information about N2O catalyst in vapor form. Also I don`t obtain any information about N2O catalyst, which decomposes it earlier than 100C, to place it somewhere in the intake manifold. Here, as you see, is the difference between my patent ans NASA`s one (that`s what LS1M was speaking about), that the catalyst should be placed inside the combustion chamber.
Nothing is going to happen to the catalyst after 2000 miles, but it will be covered with gasoline depositions. So you just need to clean them. Probably this will not happen in the USA, as gasoline is cleaner there. And the plugs will run 20000 miles.
The ability of engine, equipped with catalyst, to detonate is higher, but we couls successfully cope with it. As you can see the tests by NX more fuel is required and it is easy to tune...
Usually catalysts are metals, oxides or complex subjects, which are not gasous. I don`t have any information about N2O catalyst in vapor form. Also I don`t obtain any information about N2O catalyst, which decomposes it earlier than 100C, to place it somewhere in the intake manifold. Here, as you see, is the difference between my patent ans NASA`s one (that`s what LS1M was speaking about), that the catalyst should be placed inside the combustion chamber.
Nothing is going to happen to the catalyst after 2000 miles, but it will be covered with gasoline depositions. So you just need to clean them. Probably this will not happen in the USA, as gasoline is cleaner there. And the plugs will run 20000 miles.
The ability of engine, equipped with catalyst, to detonate is higher, but we couls successfully cope with it. As you can see the tests by NX more fuel is required and it is easy to tune...
07-16-2004, 04:52 AM
#98
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To 69Muscle:
Some tests, ran in Moscow are published in my site www.sokolniki.com Here are some tests of European and russian cars all with small litrage of engine, but with rather high performance. Some tests were done by our clients without us, so we can`t operate their figures. Here you can also find tests by NX.
The research goes on, at least we know much about different catalysts and the ways of placing them inside the combustion chamber and increasing their resource.
Some tests, ran in Moscow are published in my site www.sokolniki.com Here are some tests of European and russian cars all with small litrage of engine, but with rather high performance. Some tests were done by our clients without us, so we can`t operate their figures. Here you can also find tests by NX.
The research goes on, at least we know much about different catalysts and the ways of placing them inside the combustion chamber and increasing their resource.
07-17-2004, 07:41 AM
#100
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Originally Posted by C4VetteLS1
well im done with the topic...until you put down some real results and not claiming how it has to work....