On average, how much HP are you guys losing with a n20 tune and plug gap over a tune and gap more suitable for N/A performance?

I just did some work on my engine and I�m about 20HP away from where I think it should be.

I�m running TR6 plugs gapped at .030 with ~13.1 AF (taken from a GM Tech Tool ) and 26* of timing.

Would a larger plug gap, less fuel and more timing be responsible for the missing 20HP?

 

if you're missing 20, you might want to look else where besides the plugs

 

In the past I've dropped about 45hp between N/A tune and N20 tune from pulling a bunch of timing for a wee bit o' the spray.

 

depends on the vehicle, if your motor likes a lot of timing then the results would be fairly dramatic, if it doesnt then it wont make a whole lot of difference

 

I never dyno'd the difference, but did compare track times. I actually kept about the same mph and et from "daily street tune" to "nitrous tune." I will say it took me quite a bit of messing around with timing tables, and fueling vs. the nitrous etc to iron it out, but was very happy with the results. Even better when you dual tune it, so the nitrous activates the reduction in timing and addition of fueling...

 

since i run 2 dry stages i dont loose any power due to timing
N/A my motor at wot will pull .98g/cyl so i will run 29* timing any where up to .98g/cyl anything above that i retard the timing to 22* at 3200rpm when the nitrous hits it is instantly above 1g/cyl so there is no overlap. 490rwp on the old motor tune and 490n/a when on the new nitrous tune.

maybe guys running a wet shot could hit it with a small dry shot to retard timing when spraying? i like having one tune that works all the time

 

I didnt loose anything with mine. I have TR6s gapped at .035, and pulled out 4*. This was with similar weather. I also believe that the plate added about 5/5, and the timing lost me 5/5 so the gains I got from the plate negated any losses from taking out timing.

 

I had my car tuned for a 150hp shot and the first pull was just under 400rwhp. After some tweaking and tuning it turned out just over 400rwhp on motor alone. So since the temp was decreasing due to the evening, I would say the pulls were about the same between the tune I had before the nitrous tune and then after the nitrous tune.

My bet is you'll lose very little hp if any!

 

I just got EFI Tune and this seems interesting, I just looked at my 50 shot dry log I am over .98 g/cyl from 4600-5100 RPM, I will have to see what NA my g/cyl is for comparision (Stock LS-1), and adjust accordingly (Edit...looks like .72 or so for mine sound about right?).

EFI Live (Commercial ver) has a feature that you can access the valet mode to change up the timing tables. Once the Valet mode PCM wire is grounded it uses the valet tables.

Isn't there a tuning trick using IAT for timing changes also?

 

Thanks for the info guys.

I�m about to buy HP Tuners so I can learn to do this my self.

Can either of you guys tell me more about this dual tune configuration? Maybe I can get my tuner to set me up that way until I can get my own tuning software.

The only problem then is the plug gap. I�m sure it doesn�t make a large difference, but I wouldn�t feel safe running much over .033 with a 150 � 200 shot no matter what the timing is. So I would need to test a few things out with that.

 

rmitchell242 thats pretty impressive, I haven't logged a car yet that pulled over .80/g NA, except maybe one cell here or there, but definately not into the .96 range repeatable. Good info.

 

You can run 100% timing N/A and have it automaticly retard the timing to a set value on the juice Nothing a 1000ohm resister,a couple of relays and tapping into the intake air sensor can't fix .Been doing it for years

 

I have a timing tuner, so I run 34* until the car hits WOT @ 3250 RPM's with the nitrous armed then it yanks out 6* and I spray 125 wet. This works prety good so far, the only difference my car sees N/A is TR6's gapped @ .035 and I dont even notice the difference in plug heat ranges.

 

looking at a log from the one of my last dyno pulls N/A it logged and the graph is very smooth
.77 g/cyl@3100 rpm
.80 g/cyl @ 4024 rpm
.85 g/cyl @ 4320 rpm
.90 g/cyl @ 4596 rpm
.95 g/cyl @ 5358 rpm
.99 g/cyl @ 6697 rpm


what do you generally see on your maf in g/sec when logging the cars you are talking about? i seem to be around 425-450 g/sec at 6500 rpm wot

 

I do not have that table for the LS2 yet. the only problem with that is when you get really hot IAT's (100*+)your spray may not cool you off to the point of timing retard I know my shot cools me off around 40-50* and if it were 105 out it may only cool my IAT to 60* which for me it is not uncommon to run in that temp at night so i would not want to retard timing at 60*

 

I'd have to actually sift thru pages of logs, but rarely did I log a car pulling over .76g throughout WOT.

 

I had 30* advance and put down 470 n/a, we pulled 4* for a safe dry nitrous tune (and n/a), and I only dropped to 465. I think this will work, but may need to pull another * or two once we jump to the 125 jet.

 

If you use this method you won't loose any hp n/a running a dry hit.
From the links section of my web.
Pull timing on dry hits
Robert

 

I recommend getting a flash programmer....I have the SCT Flash programmer so that way when I'm not using the juice I can get as much HP as possible NA with a seperate NA tune and n20 tune.

My car with this tune with only a catback exhaust and airlid made 325rwhp 333rwtq

with a Zex dry kit and an NOS jet with supposedly 100shot the car put down 405 rwhp 445rwtq on the n2o tune.

on the n2o with cheap street tires with 30,000 miles on it my car ran 12.64 @ 114mph with the n2o and tune.

These programmer seem pricey but well worth the money imo.