Quick background on my car - Black 2001 WS6 6spd with 51k miles, no problems mechanically

Unfortunately it has the god awful bubbly sail panel. It started with just one and over the years it has spread and infected the whole panel . I'm planning on selling the car but I'm conflicted whether it would be worth my time to go ahead and replace it. Per the advice I found here on the forums, I went to the junk yard ripped off an old one and tried to remove it from the metal but didn't have the time or patience to do it. Now I'm considering buying one from 6LE designs and spending quite a bit more to replace it that way.

So despite all this, is it worth it to spend the extra money to fix the sail panel before I put the car up for sale? Or should I just sell it as is? Given the miles on the car and it's condition it won't be hard to sell, but I'd like to get whats worth out of it.

Let me know what you guys think, any advice would be appreciated!

 

My answer is no. You'll spend around a grand "If you take it somewhere to be done" that's if you have the sil panel. I'm sure it will half that if you do it yourself. I could be way off but I still say sell it the way it is.

 

 

I think it will depend on the buyer.

An informed buyer would probably know about the issue and the cost to repair it. If a good sail panel was important to them, the buyer will subtract the cost of the repair from the offer unless you price the car accordingly.

When buying older cars like 4th gen or 3rd Gen fbody cars - paint, body and interior condition is actually more important to me than mechanical condition. It's cheaper to swap in a good used LS engine / transmission than to pay for a good professional repaint for the car.

If you have the time and funds and really think your car is otherwise in outstanding condition, I would fix the issue and price the car accordingly. You will have documentation to show the issue is fixed. 99.9% of other cars for sale won't have that. However, fussy low mile buyer that pays the premium for a super nice car will probably be wanting a car with less miles.

I'd fix it even if I ate loss just a matter of doing the right thing for the Trans Am that is out of production and never coming back.

 

Thanks for the feedback! Your last point is exactly why I've been debating on fixing myself and not passing the problem to a future buyer. I still have a great amount of respect for the car and it doesn't sit right with me selling it the way it is.

 

A good post by @99 Black Bird T/A above - he makes some great points.

Believe it or not, a lot of folks still aren't informed/knowledgeable about this issue. I still see new members mentioning that they knew nothing of this problem prior to buying the car, and are now wondering what to do about it. I think many of them assume that a simple repaint of the roof is all that's needed; it's not really intuitive to assume that the whole roof will need to be replaced unless you already know about the details of this condition (and many still don't).

Personally, I probably wouldn't even buy another '99+ 4th gen at this point unless there was some documentation of a proper roof replacement, unless maybe the car was a steal, and I certainly wouldn't be willing to pay top dollar (or anything close to it) for one which hasn't had this problem corrected. I went through this repair on my '02 car and I'd rather not do it again, especially now that getting a new roof isn't as simple as just ordering one from GM. This is one primary reason why I prefer '98 cars (ones built before 05/98); all the other '98 specific stuff that most folks complain about is, to me, a non-issue compared to dealing with the roof replacement on the later cars.

Having said that, I don't think you'd ever totally recover the money you'd spend to fix this correctly, unless you source a used panel and do all the labor yourself. Again, many buyers still don't realize the totality of this issue or the value of not having to deal with it, so the premium you can attach to a "repaired" car isn't going to be huge at this point. But, there are some shoppers out there like me who would value this repair - just be sure to document that the repair was done properly (i.e. proper underside prep of the new panel to ensure the issue does not return) if you do go through with it.

 

This type of thing is most prominent on black cars that aren't stored.
The sunlight has more sail panel kills then the best nerd has kills at Quake.

I had a few very very small ones and just popped/scratched them off flat, been years and no issues, my sails still looks almost like new.
With a black car its possible to just treat a certain area, but I've seen bad ones on here where someone takes off the panel, had a professional shop re-do/repaint/refinish the entire panel and they STILL come back!

Do you have pics?
If you have yours repainted, from what I understand it needs to be sanded to the hills, with a good primer, base and clear by someone who know's what they are doing.
Body shops are hit and miss, do you know of any good ones in your area? The best guys are the ones who are retired but still do it here and there, they know all the little tricks.

And RPM makes a good point, some people don't know it can be a taxing fix pending the severity, so if you get an interested buyer you can just say, "yeah, that just needs some new paint".
Lol, little white lie never hurt anyone.

 

I've never had or even seen this sail panel issue on a car.....but I got a quote from a shop in Lauderdale that only does show car quality paint work.....they do not work on normal every day cars. I was considering years ago to paint it charcoal grey like my CETA rear bumper mod is painted.. Then I said to self....how dumb would that look and didn't do it.......LOL

He told me two days and $300.00......Show Car quality.

So anyone charging more than that I would say is ripping you off. Its an easy, fast fix.

.

 

You are correct, black roofed cars are by far the worst, especially in hot/high UV climates, but it does happen even with light colors (including silver and pewter) if they are exposed to enough heat/sunlight. Not sure if anyone has experienced this with a white roof, but the underlying problem is the same so it's certainly possible even with that color.

Keeping the car indoors certainly helps to pause the condition, but it won't prevent it unless the car is rarely or never exposed to intense sunlight/heat. And once they get bad, it doesn't even take intense sunlight to bring out the bubbles, just hazy sunshine will do it. Some have even reported this happening when the vehicle is stored in a hot garage. Very low mile show cars that spend a bunch of time in the summer sun at shows, but are otherwise in a garage, also eventually see this issue under the right conditions.

There is no way to fix this permanently by just treating certain areas, nor will any amount of sanding or priming on a contaminated panel make the problem go away forever. The issue lies underneath, as GM omitted the primer on the underside of these panels starting at the end of the '98 model year (based on my research going back to 2003, the process change seems to have happened sometime in May of '98 - earlier cars are unaffected). If it comes back after roof replacement, then it's because the underside of the new panel wasn't properly prepped with an epoxy primer prior to install - or because a body shop reused a roof that was already contaminated (you can't fix one that's already bad, once the glue has soaked into the panel there is no permanent fix except for a new panel).

All of this is covered pretty extensively in the FAQ sticky at the top of this section; the entire thread is a long read but, over the years, I've edited/updated the first post of the thread to contain all the important points of the issue.

 

You probably haven't seen this on yours because you have a '98. The only '98s that have this issue are ones built in or after 05/98 (and some of the May cars are probably fine as well). 1993 through all but the last three months of 1998 production are unaffected by this condition. In fact, the GM TSB only states "1999-02", but this is incorrect as I've confirmed the condition on many 05/98-07/98 built 1998 model year cars. In my 15 years of researching this issue, I've never seen nor received any reports of a 1998 F-body having this issue with a built date prior to May of 1998.

This is not an easy, fast fix at all. Nor is $300 going to cover the proper repair and cost of a new panel if you're paying a shop to do it (though good used panels can be found cheap for those who have junkyard early 4th gens in their area). The roof must be R&R'ed, plus prep and paint.

 

Thanks for all the replies, I appreciate the advice! The car has been garaged since I've owned it and has seen rain maybe a couple of times in the past 5 years. A friend and I buffed the entire car about 3 years ago, I noticed little bumps coming up not to long after. I'm thinking that kick started the problem. I'll try and post some pictures tomorrow, it's pretty bad.

 

Buffing wouldn't have caused this, it's a condition that originates and grows under the surface; given the right type of heat/sun exposure, it will eventually work it's way to the top no matter what. But you might have become more aware of the paint imperfections after doing that corrective work on the finish.

 

Honestly, if you have a panel already pulled from the junkyard, sell the car and include the panel if they want it. I've done 3 tops, 2 pulled from junkyard cars. The majority of the time in the project will be the removal of the steel from the bottom of the replacement piece. A wire saw helps, but you'll want to strategically remove steel first to make it more manageable. I went through a cutoff wheel each time... but I digress...

You won't need the replacement piece if you sell the car, but the buyer would eventually want it. So, why not skip the labor and just include it with the sale of the car? Heck, direct them to the sticky in this section and wish them luck.