Help Swirls, please save me!!!
06-05-2008, 09:11 PM
#1
Help Swirls, please save me!!! Got swirls after a buff real bad, any suggestions on how to get them out? I tried swirl remover but that made it worse. Then I have tried carnuba wax (hand) and that has helped alot but not enough. It is a black SS
06-05-2008, 09:32 PM
#2
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if you know how to use a rotary buffer heres a method for you. if they are bad the best way is using a rotary in my opinion but that could mean really screwing your paint up if you dont know what your doing. so heres my writeup using products that i like and i dont care what other people think. its long and its how to buff a car completely but if you do it right you wont have any swirls.
This is my way of buffing so if anyone tells you a different way they might have a better way or they may not but this is the way I like to buff cars. The one thing that I do recommend is to have some skill with a rotary buffer or find something that you can practice on before attempting it on your car. Factory clear is a lot thinner then on cars that have been repainted and it is easier to burn through to the paint. The main thing you want to be the most careful on is the edges because they are the easiest to burn. Something I like to do is use a quality masking take used for painting cars that wont rip off if the buffer hits it. I normally use the green scotch masking tape. So say your doing a good, what I would do is tape the fender edges and then tape off or put some towels to block the cowl from getting compound on or in it because if you don’t you will have a fun time trying to get it off or out. When you get to the fender tape off the hood edge the mirror edge and the door and the molding. When you get to the door tape off the molding, handle, weatherstrip, fender edge, and quarter edge. Then just repeat on the other panels. Also when you tape things don’t tape it right on the edge, you want to tape it on overlapping the edge a little bit and then push the tape into the jam to fully protect that edge. Now do you have to tape everything? The answer is no its just a precaution that I personally recommend when your first learning to buff. Also regarding swirls if they have been for there for a real long time there’s a chance that they might not come out depending on how bad they really are but its worth giving it a shot before you know you have to re-paint it. Below I am going to include a list of materials that I use before I start the whole write up.
Materials
3M Green Scotch Masking Tape - Sizes ¼” and 1 ½”
- I use 1 ½” on the edges and the ¼” for smaller areas like the moldings.
3M Perfect-It 3000 Rubbing Compound
3M Perfect-It 9” Wool Pad
3M Perfect-It 3000 Swirl Remover
3M Perfect-It 8” Black Foam Pad
3M Perfect-It 3000 Ultrafina(Swirl Eliminator)
3M Perfect-It 8” Blue Ultrafina Foam Pad
3M Perfect-It 3000 Final Glaze
3M Perfect-It 6” Black Foam Pad(Hook -It 2 Backing Plate)
Rotary Buffer Of Your Choice( Mine is a Dewalt or Makita)
6” Dual Action Palm Sander Of You Choice(Mines A Snap On)
- Only Have To Use This Step If Using The Final Glaze Step
Extension Cord
Cleaning Spur
Quality Microfiber Towels(Mine Are From Cobra)
Few Terry Clothes
Meguiars Final Inspection or Something To Use When Wiping Compounds Off
Clay Bar(if needed)
1) If you car is a car that you drive or hasn’t been freshly painted then your going to want to give it a thorough washing and completely dry off the car. If you have bugs or tar marks then your going to want to clay bar those off or if your like me, I clay bar the whole panel to remove any contaminants and then I wipe the panel down using a the final inspection and the a micro fiber towel. Be sure that you have a garage or a place to do this because being out in the sun and heat is no good. It causes the compound to dry faster then it should.
2) Now that the car is cleaned off and ready to be buffed you can do this one of 2 ways. Do one panel at a time or one step at a time. One Step means doing the entire car with the first method and then moving on to the next. I recommend to do it this way because they you don’t have to keep cleaning your panels off.
3) Now the fun begins. Plug that buffer in attach the wool pad and getting the rubbing compound out. Now personally I like to buff with a wool pad at around 2000rpm but you can do it at any speed that is comfortable with you. If you’re a beginner I recommend 1400 or even lower if you don’t feel comfortable. Tape off your edges. Take the buffing spur pull the trigger and run it through the pad to clean it. When you see no more dust you know your good to go. Apply a decent amount of compound to the area that your going to buff set the buffer on the compound and give the trigger a quick pull and move the buffer back and forth really quick or just rub the compound in without pulling the trigger. This will help you avoid splatter. Then pull the trigger and start to buff and be sure to keep the buffer moving from left to right to avoid one area getting to hot. Do a section at a time. After you finish your panel wipe it down thoroughly using a micro fiber towel. If you choose to do the whole car then go on to the next panel and repeat. If not then keep the tape on and read the next step. Its going to appear hazy and swirly but not to worry.
4) Time to switch pads. Put the black foam pad and get out the swirl remover. Run the spur through very lightly to clean the pad. Make sure the surface is clean of all compound before starting to buff. For swirl remover I like to buff at about 1600-1800rpm depending in how much of a rush I am. With this step be sure to take your time because if you don’t your going have swirls in the end product. Again apply some compound to the panel and smear it in with the pad or pull the trigger a little to avoid splatter. Again you want to do an area at a time and make sure that there’s always a good amount of compound. After this step it should appear more glossy. After you get done with the panel or car proceed to again wiping down with a different clean micro fiber towel that will only be used for this step.
5) Again it’s time to switch pads. Switch over to the Ultrafina pad and get out the Ultrafina compound. Run the spur through very lightly to clean the pad. I like to buff at about 1600-1800 for this as well. Make sure the surface is cleaned of all the swirl remover. If there’s any minor swirls left over this will take care of it. Now for this step I do one thing differently. I will do one panel at a time and I will do the whole panel then I will wipe it off before going to the next step. Do not let this stuff dry on the panel. Put a good amount of compound on the panel and smear in with the pad or pull the trigger to avoid splatter. Unlike the others this compound has to be wiped off by hand and will not disappear like the others. You want to buff it in so that it looks like there’s a wet swirly film all over the whole panel. After you get the whole panel completed wipe it down thoroughly. And move on to the next.
6) OPTIONAL STEP: Take out the dual action sander and the final glaze. This is almost like putting a nice wax over everything. Again I do this one panel at a time. Apply some and d/a the glaze in good. After doing the panel wipe it down thoroughly and move onto the next.
After you’ve done this you should have a good looking finish if done correctly. If you have to wash the car and make sure you look at all the jambs to get rid of any compound that might of got into there and if its not fresh paint you can go right ahead and take your favorite wax and give it a good coat and then just stand back and look at your handy work. I prefer using zaino or wolfgang or pinnacle wax but any of your choice will be good. Just remember that its your car that your buffing and buff at the speeds that feel the most comfortable so you don’t mess anything up.
This is my way of buffing so if anyone tells you a different way they might have a better way or they may not but this is the way I like to buff cars. The one thing that I do recommend is to have some skill with a rotary buffer or find something that you can practice on before attempting it on your car. Factory clear is a lot thinner then on cars that have been repainted and it is easier to burn through to the paint. The main thing you want to be the most careful on is the edges because they are the easiest to burn. Something I like to do is use a quality masking take used for painting cars that wont rip off if the buffer hits it. I normally use the green scotch masking tape. So say your doing a good, what I would do is tape the fender edges and then tape off or put some towels to block the cowl from getting compound on or in it because if you don’t you will have a fun time trying to get it off or out. When you get to the fender tape off the hood edge the mirror edge and the door and the molding. When you get to the door tape off the molding, handle, weatherstrip, fender edge, and quarter edge. Then just repeat on the other panels. Also when you tape things don’t tape it right on the edge, you want to tape it on overlapping the edge a little bit and then push the tape into the jam to fully protect that edge. Now do you have to tape everything? The answer is no its just a precaution that I personally recommend when your first learning to buff. Also regarding swirls if they have been for there for a real long time there’s a chance that they might not come out depending on how bad they really are but its worth giving it a shot before you know you have to re-paint it. Below I am going to include a list of materials that I use before I start the whole write up.
Materials
3M Green Scotch Masking Tape - Sizes ¼” and 1 ½”
- I use 1 ½” on the edges and the ¼” for smaller areas like the moldings.
3M Perfect-It 3000 Rubbing Compound
3M Perfect-It 9” Wool Pad
3M Perfect-It 3000 Swirl Remover
3M Perfect-It 8” Black Foam Pad
3M Perfect-It 3000 Ultrafina(Swirl Eliminator)
3M Perfect-It 8” Blue Ultrafina Foam Pad
3M Perfect-It 3000 Final Glaze
3M Perfect-It 6” Black Foam Pad(Hook -It 2 Backing Plate)
Rotary Buffer Of Your Choice( Mine is a Dewalt or Makita)
6” Dual Action Palm Sander Of You Choice(Mines A Snap On)
- Only Have To Use This Step If Using The Final Glaze Step
Extension Cord
Cleaning Spur
Quality Microfiber Towels(Mine Are From Cobra)
Few Terry Clothes
Meguiars Final Inspection or Something To Use When Wiping Compounds Off
Clay Bar(if needed)
1) If you car is a car that you drive or hasn’t been freshly painted then your going to want to give it a thorough washing and completely dry off the car. If you have bugs or tar marks then your going to want to clay bar those off or if your like me, I clay bar the whole panel to remove any contaminants and then I wipe the panel down using a the final inspection and the a micro fiber towel. Be sure that you have a garage or a place to do this because being out in the sun and heat is no good. It causes the compound to dry faster then it should.
2) Now that the car is cleaned off and ready to be buffed you can do this one of 2 ways. Do one panel at a time or one step at a time. One Step means doing the entire car with the first method and then moving on to the next. I recommend to do it this way because they you don’t have to keep cleaning your panels off.
3) Now the fun begins. Plug that buffer in attach the wool pad and getting the rubbing compound out. Now personally I like to buff with a wool pad at around 2000rpm but you can do it at any speed that is comfortable with you. If you’re a beginner I recommend 1400 or even lower if you don’t feel comfortable. Tape off your edges. Take the buffing spur pull the trigger and run it through the pad to clean it. When you see no more dust you know your good to go. Apply a decent amount of compound to the area that your going to buff set the buffer on the compound and give the trigger a quick pull and move the buffer back and forth really quick or just rub the compound in without pulling the trigger. This will help you avoid splatter. Then pull the trigger and start to buff and be sure to keep the buffer moving from left to right to avoid one area getting to hot. Do a section at a time. After you finish your panel wipe it down thoroughly using a micro fiber towel. If you choose to do the whole car then go on to the next panel and repeat. If not then keep the tape on and read the next step. Its going to appear hazy and swirly but not to worry.
4) Time to switch pads. Put the black foam pad and get out the swirl remover. Run the spur through very lightly to clean the pad. Make sure the surface is clean of all compound before starting to buff. For swirl remover I like to buff at about 1600-1800rpm depending in how much of a rush I am. With this step be sure to take your time because if you don’t your going have swirls in the end product. Again apply some compound to the panel and smear it in with the pad or pull the trigger a little to avoid splatter. Again you want to do an area at a time and make sure that there’s always a good amount of compound. After this step it should appear more glossy. After you get done with the panel or car proceed to again wiping down with a different clean micro fiber towel that will only be used for this step.
5) Again it’s time to switch pads. Switch over to the Ultrafina pad and get out the Ultrafina compound. Run the spur through very lightly to clean the pad. I like to buff at about 1600-1800 for this as well. Make sure the surface is cleaned of all the swirl remover. If there’s any minor swirls left over this will take care of it. Now for this step I do one thing differently. I will do one panel at a time and I will do the whole panel then I will wipe it off before going to the next step. Do not let this stuff dry on the panel. Put a good amount of compound on the panel and smear in with the pad or pull the trigger to avoid splatter. Unlike the others this compound has to be wiped off by hand and will not disappear like the others. You want to buff it in so that it looks like there’s a wet swirly film all over the whole panel. After you get the whole panel completed wipe it down thoroughly. And move on to the next.
6) OPTIONAL STEP: Take out the dual action sander and the final glaze. This is almost like putting a nice wax over everything. Again I do this one panel at a time. Apply some and d/a the glaze in good. After doing the panel wipe it down thoroughly and move onto the next.
After you’ve done this you should have a good looking finish if done correctly. If you have to wash the car and make sure you look at all the jambs to get rid of any compound that might of got into there and if its not fresh paint you can go right ahead and take your favorite wax and give it a good coat and then just stand back and look at your handy work. I prefer using zaino or wolfgang or pinnacle wax but any of your choice will be good. Just remember that its your car that your buffing and buff at the speeds that feel the most comfortable so you don’t mess anything up.
06-06-2008, 07:24 PM
#3
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Don't even try it your self if you have never done it before. I'd be doing a lot asking around to see if there is someone in you area that really knows what they are doing with a buffer.
06-06-2008, 08:58 PM
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yeah im going to edit this whole thing soon because its old and ive changed a few things in the past couple years. anyways hes right dont try this unless you have something to practice on. im sure if you go to a body shop they can give you some decent panels that they are just going to scrap. i personally think the rotary is the way to go but it takes a lot of practice. people have different preferences on compounds and pads aswell. a porter cable or udm can do you really well aswell but personally i like the rotary.
06-09-2008, 02:34 PM
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paint can really get jacked up if you dont know what your doing with a buffer. lol Clearcoat is only so thick... 
ask me how I know... Pay someone that knows what they are doing, you will be happy you did.
ask me how I know... Pay someone that knows what they are doing, you will be happy you did.
06-09-2008, 02:36 PM
#7
+2 for not screwing with a rotary buffer unless you know how to use one. When I was in high school I worked as a detail manager at a Porsche/BMW/MB dealership, and I think half the cars that came in for a detail were there because someone tried to use a rotary buffer on it with no experience and turned the car's paint into swirl city.
