Tuning with HPT ..Need advice
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Tuning with HPT ..Need advice Okay so I will attach my tune and a scan I did when I first started the car, From idle the afr starts great on the wideband then it goes really lean ... like off the chart .. I corrected some and its on the chart at idle but doesn't take throttle .. in the attached scan I got it slowly up to about 2800 and it was at 40 degrees of timing .. I just think that is a little high and I dont know how to command it to be lower based on an SD tune.
If I can figure out how to get HPT to scan my wideband input I will be logging that tomorrow as well.
Please take a look at the scan and tell me where I can start, I will be working on the tune all day tomorrow.
If I can figure out how to get HPT to scan my wideband input I will be logging that tomorrow as well.
Please take a look at the scan and tell me where I can start, I will be working on the tune all day tomorrow.
Okay so I will attach my tune and a scan I did when I first started the car, From idle the afr starts great on the wideband then it goes really lean ... like off the chart .. I corrected some and its on the chart at idle but doesn't take throttle .. in the attached scan I got it slowly up to about 2800 and it was at 40 degrees of timing .. I just think that is a little high and I dont know how to command it to be lower based on an SD tune.
If I can figure out how to get HPT to scan my wideband input I will be logging that tomorrow as well.
Please take a look at the scan and tell me where I can start, I will be working on the tune all day tomorrow.
If I can figure out how to get HPT to scan my wideband input I will be logging that tomorrow as well.
Please take a look at the scan and tell me where I can start, I will be working on the tune all day tomorrow.
Check your O2 sensors first. In your logs it looks like you may have a bad O2 sensor as it is not responding. It stays around 480-510mV. You can see it in the scanner on the ''Charts''.
EDIT: I read your post on HPtuners forums...
to get it to your tuner.. just take your high and low octane spark tables and lower them a few degree's...
multiply your ve table by like 5-10%
Fix your injector tables a little...
that will get you to your tuner.... just be easy on the throttle.
to get it to your tuner.. just take your high and low octane spark tables and lower them a few degree's...
multiply your ve table by like 5-10%
Fix your injector tables a little...
that will get you to your tuner.... just be easy on the throttle.
Last edited by 1BAD_LS1; Sep 30, 2009 at 10:55 PM.
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I have read every guide here and on HPT's site, It just doesnt mean anything to me until I can see it in action. I will go over what 1bad ls1 said tomorrow but it looks to me like he is just trying to get me to change everything over to open loop like some people run for SD,
Also 1bad, what timing table? the IAT table looks to me like it references the MAF for airflow data, and I dont know if that is right or if it needs to be changed.
Also all the info for my build is either in my sig or on the link for my build which is also in my sig.
I will work on the above corrections and post updates about 9 local time tomorrow. Thanks for the help so far.
Also 1bad, what timing table? the IAT table looks to me like it references the MAF for airflow data, and I dont know if that is right or if it needs to be changed.
Also all the info for my build is either in my sig or on the link for my build which is also in my sig.
I will work on the above corrections and post updates about 9 local time tomorrow. Thanks for the help so far.
I have read every guide here and on HPT's site, It just doesnt mean anything to me until I can see it in action. I will go over what 1bad ls1 said tomorrow but it looks to me like he is just trying to get me to change everything over to open loop like some people run for SD,
Also 1bad, what timing table? the IAT table looks to me like it references the MAF for airflow data, and I dont know if that is right or if it needs to be changed.
Also all the info for my build is either in my sig or on the link for my build which is also in my sig.
I will work on the above corrections and post updates about 9 local time tomorrow. Thanks for the help so far.
Also 1bad, what timing table? the IAT table looks to me like it references the MAF for airflow data, and I dont know if that is right or if it needs to be changed.
Also all the info for my build is either in my sig or on the link for my build which is also in my sig.
I will work on the above corrections and post updates about 9 local time tomorrow. Thanks for the help so far.
on hp tuners you said you just needed to get to your tuner.... just take a few degrees off your spark tables, add 5-10% to your ve table, and fix your injector tables.
do those things and stay out of the throttle and youll get there fine.
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I have read every guide here and on HPT's site, It just doesnt mean anything to me until I can see it in action. I will go over what 1bad ls1 said tomorrow but it looks to me like he is just trying to get me to change everything over to open loop like some people run for SD,
Also 1bad, what timing table? the IAT table looks to me like it references the MAF for airflow data, and I dont know if that is right or if it needs to be changed.
Also all the info for my build is either in my sig or on the link for my build which is also in my sig.
I will work on the above corrections and post updates about 9 local time tomorrow. Thanks for the help so far.
Also 1bad, what timing table? the IAT table looks to me like it references the MAF for airflow data, and I dont know if that is right or if it needs to be changed.
Also all the info for my build is either in my sig or on the link for my build which is also in my sig.
I will work on the above corrections and post updates about 9 local time tomorrow. Thanks for the help so far.
You're not running a MAF, right? So set the DTC any way you want except for '3-no error reported'.
PE delay does nothing, I always 0 it anyway. And set both the PE and Boost tables to one safe value. 1.27 is fine.
Disable COT, DFCO, and DFCO clutch transition.
Disable closed loop and LTFTs with high enable temps and set the whole OLFA table to 1.
Timing is based off of dynamic airflow, which is calculated form either MAF or VE or both. Set the higher airflow of areas of the high octane tables to a safe timing. Maybe 15 or so. Then copy that table into the low octane and subtract 5-10 degrees from the whole table.
Once you run through the VE table a time or two and get it decently smooth with no lean spikes you can put some timing back in it.
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Verdad Gallardo You have to be in open loop to tune. The idles tables with 0 don't matter on your car.
You're not running a MAF, right? So set the DTC any way you want except for '3-no error reported'.
PE delay does nothing, I always 0 it anyway. And set both the PE and Boost tables to one safe value. 1.27 is fine.
Disable COT, DFCO, and DFCO clutch transition.
Disable closed loop and LTFTs with high enable temps and set the whole OLFA table to 1.
Timing is based off of dynamic airflow, which is calculated form either MAF or VE or both. Set the higher airflow of areas of the high octane tables to a safe timing. Maybe 15 or so. Then copy that table into the low octane and subtract 5-10 degrees from the whole table.
Once you run through the VE table a time or two and get it decently smooth with no lean spikes you can put some timing back in it.
You're not running a MAF, right? So set the DTC any way you want except for '3-no error reported'.
PE delay does nothing, I always 0 it anyway. And set both the PE and Boost tables to one safe value. 1.27 is fine.
Disable COT, DFCO, and DFCO clutch transition.
Disable closed loop and LTFTs with high enable temps and set the whole OLFA table to 1.
Timing is based off of dynamic airflow, which is calculated form either MAF or VE or both. Set the higher airflow of areas of the high octane tables to a safe timing. Maybe 15 or so. Then copy that table into the low octane and subtract 5-10 degrees from the whole table.
Once you run through the VE table a time or two and get it decently smooth with no lean spikes you can put some timing back in it.
I think he's just looking for a tune to get to his tuner though... I started thinking about it and realized that everything he needs and MORE is in the "How To's" and "writeups".
OP- if you are gona tune it yourself, read and follow the writeups also fix your injector tables (correct injector data is 50% of a GOOD tune IMO)... and i would recomend the "Calibrated Success" Tuning CD!
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Origionally yes, I was just trying to get it to a tuner, but now my tuner told me if I can get most of the "kinks" worked out on my own then he would do the dyno portion next weekend (10-10) on their open house dyno day and it would only cost me $40 for the regular 3 pulls so I am very interested in getting the "street tune" very close before that date.
I am currently making the changes listed above and I will post a new scan after they are made and the car comes to temp (also maybe a cold start scan?)
Thanks a lot guys, keep up the good work!
I am currently making the changes listed above and I will post a new scan after they are made and the car comes to temp (also maybe a cold start scan?)
Thanks a lot guys, keep up the good work!
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You have to be in open loop to tune. The idles tables with 0 don't matter on your car.
You're not running a MAF, right? So set the DTC any way you want except for '3-no error reported'. Left it set to 2-no mil light
PE delay does nothing, I always 0 it anyway. And set both the PE and Boost tables to one safe value. 1.27 is fine.Set EQ Ration vs map to 1.27 across the board assume the other figure you are referring to is Enrichment rate? it was 1.000 I set it to 1.27 also
Disable COT, DFCO, and DFCO clutch transition.Done, Set both DFCO values to 0 TPS
Disable closed loop and LTFTs with high enable temps and set the whole OLFA table to 1. Set closed loop enable vs IAT to 284 across. Set LTFT to disable OLF/A set entire table to 1.0
Timing is based off of dynamic airflow, which is calculated form either MAF or VE or both. Set the higher airflow of areas of the high octane tables to a safe timing. Maybe 15 or so. Then copy that table into the low octane and subtract 5-10 degrees from the whole table. Set High octane table from .80@ 2800RPM all the way down to 15 degrees, Low octane table was already at 11 and 10 for these sections, took 7 out across the board on low octane and smoothed to make table look close to right, leaving max commanded at high rpm/ airflow to be 10 degrees
Once you run through the VE table a time or two and get it decently smooth with no lean spikes you can put some timing back in it.
You're not running a MAF, right? So set the DTC any way you want except for '3-no error reported'. Left it set to 2-no mil light
PE delay does nothing, I always 0 it anyway. And set both the PE and Boost tables to one safe value. 1.27 is fine.Set EQ Ration vs map to 1.27 across the board assume the other figure you are referring to is Enrichment rate? it was 1.000 I set it to 1.27 also
Disable COT, DFCO, and DFCO clutch transition.Done, Set both DFCO values to 0 TPS
Disable closed loop and LTFTs with high enable temps and set the whole OLFA table to 1. Set closed loop enable vs IAT to 284 across. Set LTFT to disable OLF/A set entire table to 1.0
Timing is based off of dynamic airflow, which is calculated form either MAF or VE or both. Set the higher airflow of areas of the high octane tables to a safe timing. Maybe 15 or so. Then copy that table into the low octane and subtract 5-10 degrees from the whole table. Set High octane table from .80@ 2800RPM all the way down to 15 degrees, Low octane table was already at 11 and 10 for these sections, took 7 out across the board on low octane and smoothed to make table look close to right, leaving max commanded at high rpm/ airflow to be 10 degrees
Once you run through the VE table a time or two and get it decently smooth with no lean spikes you can put some timing back in it.
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No time to buy the CD and watch it, but thanks for the suggestion.
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Ok, so here are the latest after setting up the tune as suggested, and also how now I see it is told in the HPT help file (
) the car seems to still be real lean at cold start, but after coming above about 140 it goes right into a nice idle afr was a little rich about 12.5 for idle but anytime I give it slow RPM it still shoots timing crazy high to like 39 39.5 and im just scared to drive it and log with load on it that high. Is that normal?
P.S I can just do a flash config from now on right after the OS had been flashed.
) the car seems to still be real lean at cold start, but after coming above about 140 it goes right into a nice idle afr was a little rich about 12.5 for idle but anytime I give it slow RPM it still shoots timing crazy high to like 39 39.5 and im just scared to drive it and log with load on it that high. Is that normal?P.S I can just do a flash config from now on right after the OS had been flashed.
With the OLFA set to 1 across the table it will idle lean (and probably a little rough) when it's cold. Once you have the VE table set you put the OLFA back to stock (or mostly stock if you change it slightly in the normal operating zone) so you add more fuel at low coolant temps. You can bump it up a little now at low ects to help it start better if you'd like. Low load, light throttle timing is high in the factory tables and can run over 40 degrees in some parts of the table. Don't mistake that with higher load/WOT timing which should start below 20 and be worked up through trial and/or on the dyno. Look for the redhardsupra IFR spreadsheet to get you setup, if you haven't.
When loading a new tune you just want to write calibration only.
When loading a new tune you just want to write calibration only.
Idle and part throttle should be around 14.7AFR. Tuning should be tune with the engine at temp so the cold end of the OLFA table can be moved up.
That's just low load timing. It won't hurt anything, but if you're scared just make it less.
That's just low load timing. It won't hurt anything, but if you're scared just make it less.
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Alright I just made some other changes trying to get the ifr table dialed in along with some other small things, ill attach the scan of my first attempted drive, it didnt seem to be adding any fuel but every time I touched the gas it went dead lean and started to stumble. I tried adding a little fuel in the VE table down low but it didnt seem to move the afr gauge, in fact now it idles even leaner off the chart.
Edit, added a short new idle with the wideband logging.
Edit, added a short new idle with the wideband logging.
Last edited by Super Slow SS; Oct 1, 2009 at 03:15 PM.
Making your IFR higher will make it add less fuel.
Are you just using the default imperial config? Whenever you start logging make sure that you reset the fuel trims.
Edit: Also make sure to delete the MPA and MAF PIDs and insert the 2bar MAP PID. And make sure to log Commanded AFR and error %
Are you just using the default imperial config? Whenever you start logging make sure that you reset the fuel trims.
Edit: Also make sure to delete the MPA and MAF PIDs and insert the 2bar MAP PID. And make sure to log Commanded AFR and error %
Last edited by JonCR96Z; Oct 1, 2009 at 03:44 PM.
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Okay so just and update, after adding like 30 to all the cells in the VE table it is very close to the right idle and up to 2400RPM afr so I actually got to drive the car some and things are looking good, thanks for all the help im sure i'll need some more at some point.
Also, how do I reset the fuel trims and get the AFR commanded to show up?
Also, how do I reset the fuel trims and get the AFR commanded to show up?
any time you do a "full write" or you can do it with the scanner go to Displays->VCM controls->fuel and spark->reset fuel trims.
To scan a/f commanded you have to set it up on "table display". Right click the table in an empty spot and click insert. The PID window will open, you have to click on "fuel system", then double click on the low res one.
To scan a/f commanded you have to set it up on "table display". Right click the table in an empty spot and click insert. The PID window will open, you have to click on "fuel system", then double click on the low res one.