Guide to VE tuning using fuel trims
11 Second Club
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 226
Likes: 0
From: Va. beach,Va
Originally Posted by horist
Added this to the main sticky up top... thanks for the work. You may want to specify in there though that 98-00 cars (at least F-Bodies) use a secondary VE table when in SD mode, so you want to adjust the Main VE
But then also the secondary VE, perhaps those that have done SD tuning on the earlier PCMs can offer some advice
But then also the secondary VE, perhaps those that have done SD tuning on the earlier PCMs can offer some advice
11 Second Club
Joined: May 2004
Posts: 226
Likes: 0
From: Va. beach,Va
Originally Posted by 99whitews6
i made a simple VE caculator excel sheet in which you paste your current primary and secondary VE table and your STFT histogram(averaged) and it calculates your new primary and secondary VE. It also takes percentages of your STFT's so you dont have to do one pass with 100% and another pass with 50 %. its set up like this.
STFT <-10 multiply by 0.75
STFT <-6 multiply by 0.4
STFT <-3 multiply by 0.2
-3< STFT <=0 mulitply by 1
0< STFT <4 multiply by 0.5
4 < STFT < 8 multiply by 0.75
STFT > 8 multiply by 1
Kinda like that, then it takes these values and adds/subtracts them from the old VE and calculates a new VE. I used a lesser multiplier for the negative values since I like to have the STFT slightly negative.
If you want I can email it to you and you can look at it. It is a very simple excel sheet and took only ten minutes.
STFT <-10 multiply by 0.75
STFT <-6 multiply by 0.4
STFT <-3 multiply by 0.2
-3< STFT <=0 mulitply by 1
0< STFT <4 multiply by 0.5
4 < STFT < 8 multiply by 0.75
STFT > 8 multiply by 1
Kinda like that, then it takes these values and adds/subtracts them from the old VE and calculates a new VE. I used a lesser multiplier for the negative values since I like to have the STFT slightly negative.
If you want I can email it to you and you can look at it. It is a very simple excel sheet and took only ten minutes.
you want to change both the primart and the secondary tables, they are pretty much the same except for the enrties. the primary goes 5 kpa and secondary goes 10. make the main changes to the primary and copy over to secondary
12 Second Club
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 117
Likes: 0
Originally Posted by 99whitews6
Proportional idle turned off
LTFT learning turned off
copied high octane to low octane
oh wait........
RPM
Speed
TPS
Ignition Timing Advance
KR
Mass Air flow
MAP
ECT
IAT
O2 b1s1
O2 b2s1
TPS (volts)
Idle park position airflow
STFT 1
STFT 2
LTFT 1
LTFT 2
IAC position
FTC
I can send you the log, its not my newest one but it logs these parameters. STFT's and LTFT's log although retard and advance log only on upper row.
I looked over a couple of older logs (before I disabled MAF/proportional idle/ltft learning) and the advance and retard worked fine.
LTFT learning turned off
copied high octane to low octane
oh wait........
RPM
Speed
TPS
Ignition Timing Advance
KR
Mass Air flow
MAP
ECT
IAT
O2 b1s1
O2 b2s1
TPS (volts)
Idle park position airflow
STFT 1
STFT 2
LTFT 1
LTFT 2
IAC position
FTC
I can send you the log, its not my newest one but it logs these parameters. STFT's and LTFT's log although retard and advance log only on upper row.
I looked over a couple of older logs (before I disabled MAF/proportional idle/ltft learning) and the advance and retard worked fine.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Well, I am in the middle of tuning my car in speed density. Unfortunately I was not able to use the timing histograms with the MAF unplugged, because the timing stayed in the .08 row. I asked here and no one could tell me a way around this. I e-mailed Keith at Hptuners and he responded withing a few minutes and told me the way around it. With the MAF unplugged you will have to remove the MAF PID from the scanner and then insert the Dynamic Airflow PID and then the timing histograms will work correctly!! Now I see no reason to hook up the MAF again. I hope this helps some of you and remeber, you have to remove the MAF pid or the scanner will use that for the timing, insert the Dynamic Airflow pid and it will work just like before. All thanks should go to Keith for this information. HP tuners is awesome and the customer service is second to none. Thanks again Keith.
Matt
Originally Posted by nbmls1ta
HP tuners is awesome and the customer service is second to none. Thanks again Keith.
Matt
Matt
12 Second Club
Joined: Oct 2003
Posts: 117
Likes: 0
Originally Posted by WS6FirebirdTA00
yeah i dont know about that, he always tells me to go to the forums, i told him i changed my ifr table and its right when i did injectors and the car still runs bad and i asked what else to change. he told me i should change the ifr table. well no **** thats already been done. i havent gotten good customer support from them at all when it came to my problems, just had to spend weeks figuring it out on my own
Have a good one
Matt
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**** these are harder questions, i was reading the help file and it said that the proportional base vs airflow mode shoudl change with injector size. doesnt say which way so i went and did trial and error with no help. i posted MANY questions on all the forums that went unanswered or unresolved and searched. i have been doing this for the last month with no answers as of yet. i let them know the extent of my problems, i was told by racetronix that the pulse width may need to be modified. i asked them for help and they told me to do everything that i already told them i did. they have pleanty of time to devlope new things, part of a buisness is customer support. all i asked for was a brief explaination and i got nothing. the time it took him to tell me to go to the help file and go to how tos and then injectors he could have easily explained some of my quesitons that i had, and where he sent me was a waste of time and was no help.
heads and cam go in soon, this is why im trying to figure out my injector problem. i just wish they were as helpful to me as they were to everyone else
thanks for the compliment too
i still really need help with the injector problems so feel free to check my 1.6 million posts asking about it lol
heads and cam go in soon, this is why im trying to figure out my injector problem. i just wish they were as helpful to me as they were to everyone else
thanks for the compliment too
i still really need help with the injector problems so feel free to check my 1.6 million posts asking about it lol
Originally Posted by Silverhawk_02TA
As far as disabling PE, this is necessary as it will dump in extra fuel while you are trying to hit the higher MAP cells and throw off your trims. Yes, if you try to do a WOT run like you would for tuning your PE, you're going to get detonation. However, using my method the engine only hits these cells for a fraction of a second. I can fill almost all my STFT histogram cells up to 6000 RPM, including all max MAP (the most MAP I can pull here in the "Land of Enchamntment" is 85 kpa 
) cells, with absolutely no KR at all, and I run a spark advance table that is much more aggressive than stock. This being said, I do need to add a warning about the importance of monitoring KR during every step of VE tuning to the guide.
) cells, with absolutely no KR at all, and I run a spark advance table that is much more aggressive than stock. This being said, I do need to add a warning about the importance of monitoring KR during every step of VE tuning to the guide.
Thread Starter
TECH Enthusiast
Joined: Jun 2004
Posts: 576
Likes: 0
From: Fredericksburg, VA
Originally Posted by My90Iroc
To disable PE in HP Tuners I can just set the PE Enable - MAP value real high, like 150 right and PE will be disabled?
Originally Posted by My90Iroc
To disable PE in HP Tuners I can just set the PE Enable - MAP value real high, like 150 right and PE will be disabled?
Bill
http://www.allmod.net/hpt/VE2bar.xls
Features:
2bar ready
FULL and HALF resolution output from the same data
HALF resolution calculated as a result of neighbouring FULL res table
automatic filtering out output of values in the target range (if not broken, don't fix it)
Instructions:
copy'n'paste LTFTs
copy'n'paste STFTs
take the results and multiply them on top of your existing VE table.
enjoy,
Marcin
Features:
2bar ready
FULL and HALF resolution output from the same data
HALF resolution calculated as a result of neighbouring FULL res table
automatic filtering out output of values in the target range (if not broken, don't fix it)
Instructions:
copy'n'paste LTFTs
copy'n'paste STFTs
take the results and multiply them on top of your existing VE table.
enjoy,
Marcin
yeah i dont know about that, he always tells me to go to the forums, i told him i changed my ifr table and its right when i did injectors and the car still runs bad and i asked what else to change. he told me i should change the ifr table. well no **** thats already been done. i havent gotten good customer support from them at all when it came to my problems, just had to spend weeks figuring it out on my own
I couldnt agree more
I still cant believe it doesnt come with directions or a friggin manual.
I have countless unanswered questions over there. Im looking else where now. Good luck!
How could they make a manual for the countless setups, PCMs, OS versions, and possible approaches?
I dont feel its their responsibility to tell you how to tune your car, their software allows you to change the computer... why should they be liable for typos in their manual when you blow your engine because they accidently put in an extra zero.
Good luck
Direction and or a manual would have been nice. You get one with everything else you buy???????????????
