UsualSuspect

Fugg 'em'. The government takeover crazy Libs...AND the punks at GM that finally had the chickens come home to roost.

You make a few fun cars...I have one still. But you got your bread and butter from selling crap with cheapazz plastics and sheeit falling off when you hit a bump and you wonder why people who value their hard-earned money shop elsewhere. Great motors but what good is it when the rest of the vehicle falls apart around it?

Ive had a Firebird, T/A and a Formula WS6. 3 Camaros and 2 Challengers, and 2 Mustangs(one a Cobra) and as much fun as they all were...the F-Body cars stand apart as being completely built like crap. My current WS6 being the exception but it only has 69K miles.

Besides the WS6 we now have a new TRD Tacoma, a new 4Runner and a RAV4 for the kids to bum around in. All are trouble-free with TIGHT builds. A previous SR5 truck and a Lexus both had 240K on them when sold and were as solid as the day they were new.

I'd love to buy American only...but until I'm independently wealthy my patriotism is outweighed by my pragmatism.

I got no problem buying a new Shelby or even a Porsche someday maybe.

GM blew it.

SoCal TA

Not being dramatic, but I have put up with great drivetrains in crappy cars for a long time because I was loyal to Pontiac, not GM. Looking at the sales figures, keeping Buick and killing Pontiac tells me that GM is more interested in what the Chinese want than what I want.

From today's LA Times:

In a zero-hour bid to stay out of bankruptcy, General Motors Corp. said today it would fold the Pontiac brand, cut 42% of its U.S. dealers and 28% of its plants by the end of 2010, and offer holders of $27 billion in debt significant equity stakes in the company.

GM will also cease production of Hummer, Saturn and Saab vehicles and shed 21,000 jobs by year's end.

One sticking point for GM has been reducing by as much as half $20 billion in cash obligations to a retiree healthcare trust. The automaker said it would accomplish that goal with a debt-for-equity swap, and would also offer the same exchange to the Treasury in exchange for up to $10 billion in debt and to private holders of $27 billion in GM bonds.

A tender offer extended by the company today would trade 225 shares in the company for every $1,000 in debt, and Henderson said it aimed to cut about $44 billion from its balance sheet.

If successful, it would give the U.S. government at least a 50% stake in the automaker, with the union holding up to 39% and bondholders with an additional 10% share. Current shareholders would effectively be wiped out. Henderson did not give details on how GM would be managed in that scenario, but said that the "administration is not interested in running GM."

Meanwhile, GM said it would soon begin contacting the approximately 2,600 dealers it has selected for elimination and make them undisclosed offers to surrender their GM franchises. That could cost billions of dollars, although Henderson declined to give specifics of the offer.

A big part of that reduction would be eliminating Pontiac, which GM today added to the list of targeted brands. Hummer, Saab and Saturn were already slated for closure. Henderson said that production of all four brands would cease by 2010, although a few Pontiac models could be extended for another year.

In addition, Henderson said that should a potential buyer of one of those brands wish to continue selling the same models, GM would be open to performing contract production.

So if the government (administration) does not want to run it, then who does....likely the UAW at the next largest controlling amount of 39%...So GM is either managed or very influenced by the UAW then ever before, along with the government pushing their agenda through them....I think GM should go into backruptcy, and that may be the direction the bond holders will likely only allow!? It will be interesting to see what happens, but GM will be very different.


SoCal TA

BANDITCAR

Could someone PM me or just post the mailing address(snail mail) for GM Corporate Headquarters.

I have a 5 page letter for them to read.

jbs02somws6

iTrader: (1)

Sales have nothing to do with Pontiac being axed. The main reason is that Pontiacs are not as profitable as the other GM brands to produce. Has nothing to do with Chinese driving Buicks.

blindxeyed

iTrader: (8)

Did some digging and found that all the Buick models sold in China are actually produced in Asia, and are not manufactured versions from the US/Canada that were exported. I initially thought the same thing as you, but after finding that out, it just wouldn't make sense that they would keep the name here just so they could keep selling them in China when they can just as easily shut down Buick in North America and still be a success with them in China.

LorcinLs1

To all of the mfers who buy foreign junk,thank you! I hope your job is next to go

xx_ED_xx

iTrader: (17)

I am sorry but how many years has gm had these plastic intake gasket problems. And they still have problems....

I am not surprised build a quality car and americans buy them. Before my layoff i worked for gm previous to that I worked for kia. And kia makes it easier to work on their cars. A simple f*Cking tire rotation on a gm vehicle. I got to reset the tpms sensor position. With a damn tool. I do it on a kia and WOW look no special reset tool needed. There is many other things but it is not worth writing. Some people just dont get it

JBIRD02

iTrader: (4)

What I dont understand is why they even bother with the GMC line. With the exception of the Acadia, they are all re-badged chevy's (Silverado-Sierra, Tahoe-Yukon, Colorado-Canyon, etc.), they are the same thing. Why not combine the GMC's with the Chevy's and keep pontiac? I dont know, I guess I just think it sucks

Well, maybe mine has been an exception as well. I got 114k on mine & it still rides/drives/performs great. Every modification on the car has been elective except the 2 window motors I've replaced, so if thats all that has broken in 7 years, I cant complain. As a matter of fact, I got a compliment on how new my leather seats still look just the other day.

blindxeyed

iTrader: (8)

I feel the same way, I despise GMC solely because of that reason. But unfortunately, as of last least years sales, GMC is GM's #2 best selling brand. They sold over 100k more vehicles than Pontiac, so GM would be a fool to drop them instead. Can't say I blame GM for keeping them over Pontiac.. I just don't understand why so many people prefer GMC's clones to the original Chevy's. Makes no sense to me

Big_Bird_WS6

iTrader: (7)

why not get rid of chevy and keep them all. you could take chevy and put it by its self and it hasa a car that is in every other brand.

chevy trucks/suv = gmc trucks/suv
impala (shity) = pontiac g8

and so on. get rid of chevy chevy always has to have what the other companies have. like the acadia, chevy bitched till they got the travers(or how ever it is spelled

and to blindxeyed. GMC is the clone to the "original"chevy. i hate the front of the new chevy trucks. that plastic **** sucks. gmc is so much better.

blindxeyed

iTrader: (8)

Chevy is GM's flagship brand. They would be committing suicide if they did that. That would be like FoMoCo closing down Ford, and only keeping Lincoln and Mercury.. that's just stupid.

Impala does not = G8, those aren't even on the same platform. Impala is on an updated version of the W-body platform, while the G8 is on the Zeta platform. The Impala is FWD, while the G8 is RWD. No similarities at all. The only thing you can compare the G8 to is the new Camaro, because those are on the same platforms.

As for the Acadia and the Traverse.. Chevy came out with the concept version of the Traverse back in 2005 (google Chevrolet Sequel), a year before the Acadia was introduced. The introduction of GMC's Acadia was a good opportunity for Chevy to roll out the Traverse. The only similarities between the two are the doors. The rest is completely different.

Throughout GMC's history, it has done nothing but sell cloned Chevrolet's. They're not the original.. In fact, google GMC Sprint and tell me what that looks like to you. All GMC does is clone Chevy's, offer fancier upgrade packages, and as you so kindly pointed out, they throw on a different grill. If any brand needs to be cut the most, it's GMC. GM could then use that saved money, and fancy up their Chevy trucks for ya, because every manly man needs a fancy truck.

Big_Bird_WS6

iTrader: (7)

well the denali(new body) in 07 had the 6.2L and it wasnt till 08 in the chevy max half ton that you could get the 6.2L. so who copied who there? also go up to a new chevy and take a stick and tap the front bumper. on the out sides by the fenders it is metal. now tap the center. plastic ****. go to my dads denali. all the way across, fendr to fender the bumper is steel.

Bret@EFIAlchemy

iTrader: (3)

QUOTE=JBIRD02

What I dont understand is why they even bother with the GMC line. With the exception of the Acadia, they are all re-badged chevy's (Silverado-Sierra, Tahoe-Yukon, Colorado-Canyon, etc.), they are the same thing. Why not combine the GMC's with the Chevy's and keep pontiac? I dont know, I guess I just think it sucks

Exactly, keep the brands that started it all. Get rid of the ones invented to make the world happy. Like you said if its a rebadge get rid of it. And technically the acadia is the same thing as the Enclave by Buick and now the Traverse by Chevy. They are all just rebadged unibodys to cater to peoples specific preferences. I think theres alot more people who would rather drive a pontiac "X" than a rebadge unibody.

mieux97

iTrader: (1)

I dunno man....the Traverse looks like an exact carbon copy of the Enclave.

Bret@EFIAlchemy

iTrader: (3)

Exactly my point

BlackHawk256

Don't target the Government, target G.M!!!! When it's all said and done, G.M. is hacking Pontiac, not the government.
G.M is the one who ran out of money making stupid mistakes by not looking into the future in the 90's, ideals such as the Aztek, and too much trying to squeeze two models out of one body didn't help. The government is not targeting Pontiac as a performance brand when it currently has 1 vehicle that could be considered a muscle car. In that case, the government would be targeting Chevrolet, which is relying too heavily on a Muscle Car (2010 Camaro) to give them life again.

fortmyerspolice

iTrader: (7)

I'm kind of glad to see Pontiac go. Why? Simply because their lineup of cars are **** (besides the G8, but even thats not a Pontiac). What difference does it make to current T/A owners anyway. The best Pontiac's died in 02, what the hell are you guys bitching about anyway?

Big_Bird_WS6

iTrader: (7)

ok so acadia came out first. does this mean cut the traverse Chevy and keep GMC. since the chevy is the rebadge in this one?

i like your idea. it would help alot. take each car back to its roots and start there. but each of the cars have something different. like the traverse and acadia or in the middle of the line then the buick has all the fanacy stuff. then the saturn has the ****. so what do you do then. make the acadia the ****. and have all the options up to the buick style?