BBC vs LSx 454ci......N/A
12-31-2008, 12:40 AM
#81
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You are smoking rocks bro, a aluminum headed BBC weighs te same as a al iron SBC, so, weight will not be an issue, not to mention, i will be making a bit over 700 HP and a 300 hit of dope, if you seriously think a cam only BS motor you are going to put together, you are just needing to stay out of the sun for a while, i will be murdering supras with a bit over 1000 FWHP on 93 octane, you are not even going to be in my league.
But whatever you think.
Yes it was streetable, ran on pump gas, made about 550 HP, and if you think there was no room for improvement, once again, you dont know **** about big block chevys.
But whatever you think.
Yes it was streetable, ran on pump gas, made about 550 HP, and if you think there was no room for improvement, once again, you dont know **** about big block chevys.
. You obviously dont know **** about LS3s 
12-31-2008, 01:34 PM
#83
With all due respect it seems like you really don't know much about BBC's from some of your posts.
Pump gas is great but you have to clarify that thats on motor only RS and trust me, these kind of motors like the race gas regardless of the compression, turst me, I have done it, at the very least run ethonal (like 108 octane or somethng)
$100? Thats chump change man hahaha.
If you really are going cam only and think you will be making 1,000hp then yeah you need to get out of the sun, a built motor then ok.
I still think that you have it stuck in your head that BBC's weigh as much as an M1A2.....
12-31-2008, 01:47 PM
#84
BTW Nelson Racing Engines has some killer BBC and LSX set ups. Both have packages offered that make 2,500+ hp with forced induction. In my book that more power than I'd ever need. You could probably get into the 6's with that kind of power!
2,500hp BBC forced induction package
http://www.nelsonracingengines.com/p..._572bbc_tt.pdf
2,500hp LSX forced induction package
http://www.nelsonracingengines.com/p..._454lsx_tt.pdf
Pretty sick in my book. I like how the LSX makes the same power with about 120 less CID.
I think NA the BBC will win because it can go to like 700 CID. I think an LSX can go what ~500 CID. Very hard to make up for 200 CID NA regardless of how good the LSX head is vs the BBC head, I'd think.
I'm sticking with my more afforable mild 383 SBC and LS6 383 engines...
2,500hp BBC forced induction package
http://www.nelsonracingengines.com/p..._572bbc_tt.pdf
2,500hp LSX forced induction package
http://www.nelsonracingengines.com/p..._454lsx_tt.pdf
Pretty sick in my book. I like how the LSX makes the same power with about 120 less CID.
I think NA the BBC will win because it can go to like 700 CID. I think an LSX can go what ~500 CID. Very hard to make up for 200 CID NA regardless of how good the LSX head is vs the BBC head, I'd think.
I'm sticking with my more afforable mild 383 SBC and LS6 383 engines...
Before you jump the gun with the above Nelson engine you need to look at the parts in them and how close to the raged edge each one is and that 50k for the Nelson is a JOKE. Plenty of very well know race engine shops that will build you one like that all aluminum in a 540 for around 30k with free tuning.
Can they run larger? Yes, do many run larger? No. Some of the 427 LSX motors have no issues spooling.
12-31-2008, 03:31 PM
#85
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What would be cool would be a comparison of a 427 BBC with a LS7. Build both with modern, aftermarket CNC heads, roller valve train, same compression etc and see what the dyno says.
LS7 Advantages: Fuel injection, weight, size and fuel consumption.
BBC Advantages: Larger bore, better exhaust flow with raised port heads, strength of components, price.
My money is on the BBC on the dyno, LS7 for car that gets driven on a frequent basis.
LS7 Advantages: Fuel injection, weight, size and fuel consumption.
BBC Advantages: Larger bore, better exhaust flow with raised port heads, strength of components, price.
My money is on the BBC on the dyno, LS7 for car that gets driven on a frequent basis.
12-31-2008, 04:01 PM
#87
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With all due respect it seems like you really don't know much about BBC's from some of your posts.
Pump gas is great but you have to clarify that thats on motor only RS and trust me, these kind of motors like the race gas regardless of the compression, turst me, I have done it, at the very least run ethonal (like 108 octane or somethng)
$100? Thats chump change man hahaha.
If you really are going cam only and think you will be making 1,000hp then yeah you need to get out of the sun, a built motor then ok.
I still think that you have it stuck in your head that BBC's weigh as much as an M1A2.....
Pump gas is great but you have to clarify that thats on motor only RS and trust me, these kind of motors like the race gas regardless of the compression, turst me, I have done it, at the very least run ethonal (like 108 octane or somethng)
$100? Thats chump change man hahaha.
If you really are going cam only and think you will be making 1,000hp then yeah you need to get out of the sun, a built motor then ok.
I still think that you have it stuck in your head that BBC's weigh as much as an M1A2.....
12-31-2008, 04:48 PM
#88
Now if everyone wants to see what a truley all out BBC head can do...
Those Sonny's symmetrical Pro Mod-Series heads:
615 cfm on the intake at 1.100"
Can be yours for a little under 10k.
Id like to see someone try and make a symmetrical LS head and make it flow that
I double dog dare you.Those heads are going on a TT motor with around 672 CUI... well over 3,000 HP.
12-31-2008, 06:11 PM
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What would be cool would be a comparison of a 427 BBC with a LS7. Build both with modern, aftermarket CNC heads, roller valve train, same compression etc and see what the dyno says.
LS7 Advantages: Fuel injection, weight, size and fuel consumption.
BBC Advantages: Larger bore, better exhaust flow with raised port heads, strength of components, price.
My money is on the BBC on the dyno, LS7 for car that gets driven on a frequent basis.
LS7 Advantages: Fuel injection, weight, size and fuel consumption.
BBC Advantages: Larger bore, better exhaust flow with raised port heads, strength of components, price.
My money is on the BBC on the dyno, LS7 for car that gets driven on a frequent basis.
12-31-2008, 06:46 PM
#90
Now is that because the larger turbos magically blow up engines, or is it something like a fueling issue?
Now if everyone wants to see what a truley all out BBC head can do...
Those Sonny's symmetrical Pro Mod-Series heads:
615 cfm on the intake at 1.100"
Can be yours for a little under 10k.
Id like to see someone try and make a symmetrical LS head and make it flow that
I double dog dare you.Those heads are going on a TT motor with around 672 CUI... well over 3,000 HP.
12-31-2008, 07:15 PM
#91
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12-31-2008, 07:38 PM
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BBC vs LSx Amen to the 496 as a budget BBC.Especially with the cast cranks out there for $300. It is easy to make 600 FWHP with an almost stock bottom end and still squirt a 200 shot or so. I have an EFI 621 that should be between 1000 & 1100 at the crank but you still loose 15-18% to the wheels so I'm around 900RWHP, give or take. This is at nearly 15:1 comp. I have 20K plus in parts but, asthe man said "BBC but not a part in it came from Chevrolet.
In hindsight I would have built a twin turbo no question. I'm sure all here have seen the LSX that made 2050hp in the mag story. $$$$$ but it can be done. I think these LS based motors are the hot ticket for just about all short of serious drag cars. Gen 1 SB's can't touch em for mileage vs power. I ahve put together enough 406 gen1's to see these are way better for street/strip cars and personally I think they are the most fun.
In hindsight I would have built a twin turbo no question. I'm sure all here have seen the LSX that made 2050hp in the mag story. $$$$$ but it can be done. I think these LS based motors are the hot ticket for just about all short of serious drag cars. Gen 1 SB's can't touch em for mileage vs power. I ahve put together enough 406 gen1's to see these are way better for street/strip cars and personally I think they are the most fun.
01-01-2009, 09:11 AM
#94
Now is that because the larger turbos magically blow up engines, or is it something like a fueling issue?
Looks like oiling issues.
LSx heads are symmetrical. If they were made for a 5" bore spacing, had a 2.550" intake valve, and over 5.0 square inches in the ports, an LSX head could flow over 600cfm too.
Looks like oiling issues.
LSx heads are symmetrical. If they were made for a 5" bore spacing, had a 2.550" intake valve, and over 5.0 square inches in the ports, an LSX head could flow over 600cfm too.
You would also need the Bore for it.... so in the end guess what it will be???? A BBC!!!!!!!!!!!
01-01-2009, 11:27 AM
#95
A BBC is not a Hemi port, nor is it a symmetrical port, nor does it have a 5" bore spacing, so Sonny's head isn't technically a BBC either! If there was a 5" bore space LSX, what I just described would be closer to an LSx then Sonny's head is a BBC.
01-01-2009, 03:20 PM
#96
LOL, symmetrical port is generally considered a different port layout than a Hemi port layout, hence why Sonny Leonard has them seperated as such.
A BBC is not a Hemi port, nor is it a symmetrical port, nor does it have a 5" bore spacing, so Sonny's head isn't technically a BBC either! If there was a 5" bore space LSX, what I just described would be closer to an LSx then Sonny's head is a BBC.
A BBC is not a Hemi port, nor is it a symmetrical port, nor does it have a 5" bore spacing, so Sonny's head isn't technically a BBC either! If there was a 5" bore space LSX, what I just described would be closer to an LSx then Sonny's head is a BBC.
Agreed the heads are not really any 1 head but if you can make it work on an engine then go for it.
You can put a LS top end on a SBF. See my point?
I was talking CUI... when you get big enough pretty soon it will have to turn into a BBC.
http://www.sonnysracingengines.com/sar932.html
Get a LS to 932, you can't never will. In the end like people have said you are hurt by the CUI limit with the LS/SBC and I will not hold my breath for the day I see a LS/SBC make 2,200hp N/A!!!!!!!
01-01-2009, 04:33 PM
#98
Know how much effort it took to get the BBC in my 83???
A small amount of banging on the trans tunnel, different headers, factory k-member was moded a bit to clear a deap oil pan.
The factory radiator shroud can be modified to hold a big radiator with a small amout of sheet metal and pop rivets.
All the plugs are a dream to get to.
I would not say it fits easier. Id say its about the same.
From what I hear its harder to get an LSX into an older third gen then a newer. This may only be with the wiring/fuel injection though.
A small amount of banging on the trans tunnel, different headers, factory k-member was moded a bit to clear a deap oil pan.
The factory radiator shroud can be modified to hold a big radiator with a small amout of sheet metal and pop rivets.
All the plugs are a dream to get to.
I would not say it fits easier. Id say its about the same.
From what I hear its harder to get an LSX into an older third gen then a newer. This may only be with the wiring/fuel injection though.
01-01-2009, 04:52 PM
#99
He has Symmetrical port and Hemi port heads, 610/615 pretty much 15k for the Hemi's.
Agreed the heads are not really any 1 head but if you can make it work on an engine then go for it.
You can put a LS top end on a SBF. See my point?
I was talking CUI... when you get big enough pretty soon it will have to turn into a BBC.
http://www.sonnysracingengines.com/sar932.html
Get a LS to 932, you can't never will. In the end like people have said you are hurt by the CUI limit with the LS/SBC and I will not hold my breath for the day I see a LS/SBC make 2,200hp N/A!!!!!!!
Agreed the heads are not really any 1 head but if you can make it work on an engine then go for it.
You can put a LS top end on a SBF. See my point?
I was talking CUI... when you get big enough pretty soon it will have to turn into a BBC.
http://www.sonnysracingengines.com/sar932.html
Get a LS to 932, you can't never will. In the end like people have said you are hurt by the CUI limit with the LS/SBC and I will not hold my breath for the day I see a LS/SBC make 2,200hp N/A!!!!!!!
01-01-2009, 06:54 PM
#100
I love the ls series engine but some of you can't seem to understand that it's just an evolution of the SMALL block . These engines have utilized previously race features into a factory package for improvments in efficiency and power . Capn Smokey , compare the 500 cui lsx to a 500 DRCE 2 or 3 , I don't think there is even remotely any comparison . The DRCE still uses a layout resembling the original porcupine head . Is there an ls that resembles it's original design that approaches that level of power or efficiency ? The ls7 sb was designed 40 years after the zl1 , do you think efi would be the only change ? The ls engines are the result of development from many avenues , do you think it's just a coincidence that a Pro Stock engine builder help design GM's LSX block ?