Head Discussion
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Staging Lane
Joined: Nov 2005
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From: In CT
Head Discussion Im going to be building a 383 for my nova this winter and im looking for a hp range of about 450hp. What heads are everyone else using for good flow and still staying in a budget. Go with Aluminum or iron?? also im running GM 64cc angle plug 2.02 heads from the muscle car era on my 355 now. How do these compare to todays tech, and would anyone use these on a 383. They are all rebuilt so its either use em again, or sell for something different. Lemme know what your opinions are! Thanks
it, like everything else, depends on a few factors. Is the car going to be a DD, a street/strip, or just a weekend cruiser. what kind of budget do you have? once you establish exactly what you want to do with it, then you can start picking out parts, its the best way to do it so theres no regrets.
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From: Gainesville, Florida # of drag strips runs: ?!?!?
I'm only one opinion, but I'd go aluminum.
I went from a set of mildly ported World Products Sportsman II iron heads to a set of Canfield aluminum heads. Both 195cc, but canfields had nicer bowls and chambers (only 1 hour clean-up work), and used 2.05/1.60 valves instead of 2.02/1.60. Picked up 2-1/2 tenths in the 1/4, and about .05 of it is in weight savings.
Weight savings, can run a higher compression rating with pump gas on aluminum versus iron (I'm currently at 11:1) without detonation if cooling system and tune are good.
Good luck whatever route you go, there are tons of options!
Derek
I went from a set of mildly ported World Products Sportsman II iron heads to a set of Canfield aluminum heads. Both 195cc, but canfields had nicer bowls and chambers (only 1 hour clean-up work), and used 2.05/1.60 valves instead of 2.02/1.60. Picked up 2-1/2 tenths in the 1/4, and about .05 of it is in weight savings.
Weight savings, can run a higher compression rating with pump gas on aluminum versus iron (I'm currently at 11:1) without detonation if cooling system and tune are good.
Good luck whatever route you go, there are tons of options!
Derek
if you're looking to stay within a budget id say go with some decent cast iron heads, maybe some WP sportsman 2's or dart iron eagles, they can be had brand new and assembled for like $900. i dont know how far the vortec heads can go but i know that SDPC2000.com you can get modified ones for around $600 that have .600 lift springs in them. For best performance i would go with aluminum heads, they will run a lot cooler, and you will save a good amount of weight off the front end, the only negative is the cost, most being $1000 or more a set. hope this helps you out some
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Staging Lane
Joined: Nov 2005
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From: In CT
OK, well im lookin at this and basically im lookin for the best bang for my buck. Im prolly gunna end up goin with the heads I have now...unfortunalty due to budget restraints but I can also save for aluminum or maybe some dart iron eagles or w/e else is good and not that costly. Is it worth porting what I have now?? or just run them how they are? but im thinkin they are gunna kill my numbers if I dont do someting. If anyone has and proven block combos for 450+ hp and TQ in that range that would help me out. How about a 385, or 388 has anyone had luck with those or should I stick with a 383?
Thanks for all the help im just trying to get as much info so i can do it right the first time. Experimentation is great but im workin on a budget so im cautious of everything
Thanks for all the help im just trying to get as much info so i can do it right the first time. Experimentation is great but im workin on a budget so im cautious of everything
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From: Gainesville, Florida # of drag strips runs: ?!?!?
383, 385 and 388 are all the same, just bore size difference (.030, .040 and .060).
Your existing heads are likely okay, but 30+ year old technology compared to today's stuff depending on casting # is of course nowhere near as good. A friend of mine runs a speed shop and we've seen 20-30 rwhp gains from GM casting heads to aftermarket heads, and sometimes even more! A set of 461/462 "camel" or "double-hump" are some of the better cylinder heads from the 60-70s era, but are blown out of the water stock to stock against a set of dart iron eagles or world sportsman II heads. Porting will help, but I'd save the $$ and buy a set of newer heads, but again I'm only one opinion.
My current 475 hp combo is this (guessing 475 based on weight and rwhp #s):
# 3970010 350 4-bolt main block .060 over (388 cubes, but most people know what a 383 is so I tell them that instead)
Eagle cast crank, SIR rods
TRW forged pistons flat tops (approx 11:1 compression)
Crane solid cam 518/536 lift 230/238 duration @ .050
Canfield aluminum 64 cc heads (195cc 2.05/1.60 valves), no porting
Victor Jr. Intake with no porting
750 Holley HP double pumper carb (a 650 double pumper std Holley is about a tenth slower if both are properly tuned, and about $250-300 less)
1-3/4 Hedman headers
3" Magnaflow full exhaust with tailpipes
372 rwhp at tires N/A, times in sig at 3500 lbs on pump gas.
Derek
Your existing heads are likely okay, but 30+ year old technology compared to today's stuff depending on casting # is of course nowhere near as good. A friend of mine runs a speed shop and we've seen 20-30 rwhp gains from GM casting heads to aftermarket heads, and sometimes even more! A set of 461/462 "camel" or "double-hump" are some of the better cylinder heads from the 60-70s era, but are blown out of the water stock to stock against a set of dart iron eagles or world sportsman II heads. Porting will help, but I'd save the $$ and buy a set of newer heads, but again I'm only one opinion.
My current 475 hp combo is this (guessing 475 based on weight and rwhp #s):
# 3970010 350 4-bolt main block .060 over (388 cubes, but most people know what a 383 is so I tell them that instead)
Eagle cast crank, SIR rods
TRW forged pistons flat tops (approx 11:1 compression)
Crane solid cam 518/536 lift 230/238 duration @ .050
Canfield aluminum 64 cc heads (195cc 2.05/1.60 valves), no porting
Victor Jr. Intake with no porting
750 Holley HP double pumper carb (a 650 double pumper std Holley is about a tenth slower if both are properly tuned, and about $250-300 less)
1-3/4 Hedman headers
3" Magnaflow full exhaust with tailpipes
372 rwhp at tires N/A, times in sig at 3500 lbs on pump gas.
Derek
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Staging Lane
Joined: Nov 2005
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From: In CT
Wow your combo isnt that technical and you make awesome numbers and your track time is fast! Mines in the 13's now but 11's would be sweet. Thanks for the info ill deff look into it more.
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From: Gainesville, Florida # of drag strips runs: ?!?!?
Originally Posted by jumpmanmb87
Wow your combo isnt that technical and you make awesome numbers and your track time is fast! Mines in the 13's now but 11's would be sweet. Thanks for the info ill deff look into it more.
Good luck!
Derek
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The Iron Eagles aren't a bad head, but for the extra few $$ I would suggest going with the Platinums. They are a lot better than the old Iron Eagles. Another real good head for the $$ is Edelbrocks vortec heads. Both will make and easy 450hp with a hydraulic flat cam. The Canfields are a great head too. Very slight clean up work on a set with the CNC chamber on a 10.5-1 350 with a small solid flat cam just made 470hp. We did a 383 with the Dart Pro 1 180's, 10.6-1 with Lunati's 241-249 VooDoo cam and got 497hp and 490ft.lbs. Another set untouched on a 383 with Comps 230-236 Xtream made 460hp. The RHS Topline heads aren't a bad head either if you can find a good deal on them, they are compairable to the Iron Eagles.
The only heads I would stay away from is the World Products heads. With porting their as good as most, but out of the box arent much better than a stock Vortec flow wise.
But thats just my 2 cents.
The only heads I would stay away from is the World Products heads. With porting their as good as most, but out of the box arent much better than a stock Vortec flow wise.
But thats just my 2 cents.
if ur going for budget i would go with a set of vortec's get 2.02/1.60 valves get them cut down to put a big spring in them and get them ported i had these on my 400 and it ran damn good. if ur going for HP then id get a set of AFR's i have these now and they r the ****. i had iron eagles on a 355 i had and i hated them i almost couldn't give those away
Thread Starter
Staging Lane
Joined: Nov 2005
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From: In CT
Sounds good..So ill be looking around for some heads now that i have some customer reviews! maybe ill just get a pair and throw em on my 355 with the next size cam to see how they run then i can save up more $$$ to build the 383. Thanks for the insight
Im really leaning towards the iron eagle platniums or the the pro 1 heads lemme know what everyones thoughts are or should I get something else. AFR's are outta the picture because of price but these darts really arent that bad.
Im really leaning towards the iron eagle platniums or the the pro 1 heads lemme know what everyones thoughts are or should I get something else. AFR's are outta the picture because of price but these darts really arent that bad.
Last edited by jumpmanmb87; Aug 23, 2006 at 02:30 PM.
I have the Iron Eagle Platinum 230cc heads. I had to have them CNC'd to get the flow numbers that I needed out of them. The baseline flow for the heads was 284CFM. This is way below what Dart will tell you they flow. Mine now flow 320@.700 and 333@.800. Also, if you go with the 230's, you will have to run offset shaft mount rockers with a cam that has any decent lift. My stud mounted rockers came off of the valve before I got to my full lift (.712). I also had to machine the pushrod holes to clear my pushrods. Other than that they are good. If I could do it all over again I would go with the AFR's. For the extra $400 they would be worth it.
I have a set of Dart 215cc Pro 1's for sale. They have only about 2-3 hrs of run time on them. They have the 2.08 int valves and 1.6 exh valves and have solid flat tappet valve springs. I am asking $1100 for them plus shipping. The heads will be fully vatted and then re-assembled. I can send pics of them after I have them vatted if you would like.
Christmas sale!!
Originally Posted by 1997bird
I have a set of Dart 215cc Pro 1's for sale. They have only about 2-3 hrs of run time on them. They have the 2.08 int valves and 1.6 exh valves and have solid flat tappet valve springs. I am asking $1100 for them plus shipping. The heads will be fully vatted and then re-assembled. I can send pics of them after I have them vatted if you would like.
I will reduce my cylinder head price for Christmas to $1050 with shipping. PM if you are interested.
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Those Dart 215 Pro 1's would be sweet on a street 383 with a cam in the 235-245 duration range. Hyd. Roller of course with roughly .600"lift
I have the 230cc Pro 1's on my 396 with a .620" 254 Dur. @ .050" solid roller and shift at 7000... 3350lbs ran 122mph so far with more to go. that was with gearing for nitrous,etc.
you'd make a lot more than 450hp though...
I have the 230cc Pro 1's on my 396 with a .620" 254 Dur. @ .050" solid roller and shift at 7000... 3350lbs ran 122mph so far with more to go. that was with gearing for nitrous,etc.
you'd make a lot more than 450hp though...
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I do not know your budget but the Trick Flow 215 is a killer head for the money. They flow a little under 300cfm out of the crate with just a sand roll. I highly recommend them for a 383 engine although you will need a little compression to get them to work, 11:1 should do it!
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I think I would go with the AFR heads. Buy good heads first. A pair of AFR heads on a $500 caprice 350 roller short block should make that power. The 383 should easily do better. Buy good AFR heads before spending $ on anything else. Better investment. My friend's 57 Chevy has a 9 to 1 350 with a 220/230 .525/.525 hyd roller cam and AFR 195 heads. Runs 12.00 in the quarter and lifts the front tires at the starting line with an automatic 4000 stall and 4.11 gears.
As far as the old angle plug heads goes, I have run low 13's with stock 1.94 cammel humps (462) and a 218 at .050 cam with only 9.0 to one on a 350 in a 4 speed 55 Chevy. Your slant plug heads are a little better than those. They are probably 292 castings. They are similar to my Bowtie heads only they are most likely torquier. In a 9 to 1 compression application, I ran high 12's all motor in my 55 Chevy with those and the old "30/30" cam. I had a TH350 with 2800 stall and 4.11 gears. Seems you could do better with a little more lift and a little less duration. You can get a cam like that for $130 or so. Just to keep the money spent in perspective compared to the benefit.
Have Fun.
Henry
As far as the old angle plug heads goes, I have run low 13's with stock 1.94 cammel humps (462) and a 218 at .050 cam with only 9.0 to one on a 350 in a 4 speed 55 Chevy. Your slant plug heads are a little better than those. They are probably 292 castings. They are similar to my Bowtie heads only they are most likely torquier. In a 9 to 1 compression application, I ran high 12's all motor in my 55 Chevy with those and the old "30/30" cam. I had a TH350 with 2800 stall and 4.11 gears. Seems you could do better with a little more lift and a little less duration. You can get a cam like that for $130 or so. Just to keep the money spent in perspective compared to the benefit.
Have Fun.
Henry
