i keep hearing that a chevy small block can only handle arond 450-500 hp on a stock block until they start to crack, is this true?

 

a good conditin stock block will handle upwards of 900hp

a stock cast crank is good for about 500hp, a forged is a little more, but not much.

 

ok, so a good condition block is what i would need. and a good crank....thats exactly what i needed, thank you

 

no problem.

 

Look into getting a valley girdle. That will strengthen the block especially when you start turning high rpm's. I would look for a good two bolt main, and get the kit to change over to a 4bolt main, for some reason it's actually stronger that way. Do that and the lifter girdle and you'll have all the strength you need!

 

A stock block with 2482 cpas on it should be good to 500 horse, Our best 010 block with billet caps we only rate at 600 horse.

And Dart rates there nodular iron block at only 900 horse so its hard to believe that a stock block is good for 900 horse and be safe or dependable. HMMMM

 

Here is a pic of a block we rate at only 600 horse

 

I was wondering how the frick a stock block would hold be capable of containing 900 horse....

 

WHY? they've been doing it for years. 2-bolt 400's have been making 550-600hp and holding up...and they are weak.

 

I'm not claiming to be an expert (like some ppl do), I've just never heard of a stock block withstanding 900hp for an extended period of time.

I'd assume that if you wanted to gamble using a stock block, you'd use block rock and quality rotating parts (but you know what "they" say about assuming things....)

Personally, I wouldn't want to invest in high quality/dollar parts and then stick them into a production block. I'd rather spend the coin and have peace of mind...

 

yeah 900hp is kinda steep...really steep. but I was just saying that a stock block will handle 600hp or more no problem. Even 700hp.

 

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Yes we did have 1000 HP on stock blocks. They were filled, and that was big N2O.
We had no choice back then. They were all we had. Did they last, not usually, but that's the price of running low 8's at 3200 + lbs. I would never try any of the stuff we did back when I started now. I would take CNC's advice, no reason to make crap up.

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That's what I was saying...

 

i've built 1200+ hp stock block small blocks for years.Built a stock block 400 for my own personal car that lasted for 3 seasons running mid 8's in a 3300lb 10.5 tire car.block had no grout or anything else special,just splayed caps.Most of the secret to the block holding the power is having the proper tune up.
We build a 500hp pump gas 383 on 2 bolt mains with studs.After several years of these engines in service,we have never had any issues.I also have a 800hp pump gas nitrous 383 package that we use a stock block with splayed caps.
I agree that the block is the cornerstone to any engine,but anything under 1000hp a stock block is fine and your money would be better spent elsewhere.

 

We build a lot of engines and if I told my customer who spends big money for 600 to 700 horse engine that we were going to use a stock block I think they would look for another shop to do there work.

As I said before its hard to believe that a stock GM block is as good as a Dart Little-M block with nodular iron caops and they only rate that block at 900 horse and a stock block is good for 1000 horse HMMMMMMM and how dependable is that stock block at 1000 horse.

 

The stock block is very dependable at 1000hp,never any failures due to the block in over 200 engines of 1000+hp.I guess we look at things a little different if you consider a 600hp engine a big money engine.
the reason the little m block with nodular caps is rated at 900 hp is due to the junk caps,what is the same block rated at with splayed billet caps?

 

To an old-fashioned average joe like me (married to a stay@home wife, 2 kids under the age of 3, etc), a 600hp engine is a good chunk of change (especially when you factor in the cost of the rest of the car). I'm not talking about using "junkyard" parts where you're wondering if your engine's going to hold up, I'm talking quality parts from reliable companies.

Maybe you're used to dealing w/ guys who make a substantial amount more than I do a year (I'm not close to living paycheck to paycheck, in case you were wondering). No, I'm not trying to poke the bear, just humbly stating my opinion.

 

Well a GM block has junk main webbing, thin decks the bulk heads in the front and rear of the block is junk compared to Dart block.

We supply a lot of 010 blocks to engine shops all over the country and Canada as we are set to do block blue printing including cam tunnel blue printing and ALL the shops we deal with would never build a 1200 horse engines a use a stock block.

Now to compare apples to apples are you an engine builder that an completely machines a block to blue print or are you guys just engine assemblers who depend on others to do your machine work??

As I have been in these debates before only to find that I am dealing with guys who just bolt parts together out of boxes and is not a true engine builder.

A 1000 horse engine is not a big money engine HMMM

Post on this site that you are building 1200 horse engines using stock blocks and see how far you get on this site http://speedtalk.com/forum/

I don't think GM rates there Bowtie block at 1000 horse and you are doing it with a 200 stock block I wonder why GM even built a Bowtie block!! I can tell you know more then the engineers at GM and Dart.

Call Dick Maskins the owner of Dart and tell him his Dart Little-M block with Nodular iron caps is junk compared to a stock GM block and knowing Dick I am sure he will fill you in.

We deal with a couple hundred blocks a year and have a good idea what works after 28 years of building high performance engines and so do most of the shops we deal with.

And we deal with probably 500 emails and phone calls a year on block and part failuars again we have a pretty good idea what works and what doesn't.

I really don't find your info very factual but only mislead people thinking a stock block is better then a Dart.

Here is a pic of a 400 block that was in the 600 horse range and after a half a season it failed and destroyed the lower end and I am sure the Dart block that you say is junk is still living after 3 years or so of running. The only reason he ran the block was because his friend told him he would never break it. HMMM. I wish I kept every pic sent to me of broken caps,broken main webbing of stock blocks.

 

Wow,i wasnt trying to get into a pissing match here.But now your questioning my integrity.I just wish you would give ALL the facts instead of a skewed version.
I do agree that the stock block is weaker than the Dart block,it defiently has thinner decks and weaker bulk heads,but then i have built 2000+hp out of the Dart block.And i wasnt misleading people to think the Dart block was weaker than the stock block-but your not comparing apples with apples.You talk about the Dart block with nodular caps being rated at 900 hp,i asked what the same block was rated at with billet caps.Alot more,because the nodular caps are the weak link.It seems weird that you need billet caps on the stock block for 600hp but you would use nodular caps for 900hp on the dart block.
I'm sure that whatever the manufacturers rate something at is the max hp it will take.They dont use a 10-1 safety margin to cover their ***.Those 1200hp rated Lunati billet rods is my turbo motor havent been holding 2500hp for 2 years now.
Thats a nice pic you put up there-i think i saw it somewhere else.A couple thing you should note when showing that pic is that its a factory 4 bolt 400-the factory 4 bolt 400 webbing is the weakest block of all-i wouldnt have tryed to build 600hp using that.The other point is that most people put too much timing in 400's and they detonate and take the mains out-but i'm sure thats the blocks fault-right.
90 percent of block failures occur due to improper build procedeures or improper tuning.But the block gets the blame because thats what broke.And i'm sure the Dart block is still working because of the greater margin for error.I mean if i put a billet crank in a 400hp engine i'm sure it wont break either.
I'm not knocking the shops you deal with but you say they are engine builders that you supply blocks to,then you say in the next sentence that real engine builder do their own machine work-which is it?
now as far as us-we are real engine builders and we do our own machine work.We have an RMC V40 4 axis cnc for machining blocks to within .0001 of and inch,Sunnen SV10 diamond hone,Serdi,Hines balancer,superflow 1020 flow bench,cam pro plus for measuring cams,Superflow 902 dyno,Shenck engine dyno for endurance testing,Dyno jet chassis dyno,and a few other small items.
And the last thing,I said a 600hp engine wasnt a big money engine-not 1000hp-so get it right.The reason i say that is not to belittle a 600hp engine and the cost of one-because that is the backbone of our business.Its because thats one of our normal build street engine.383,pump gas,hydraulic roller,inexpensive 1200.00 Brodix heads.600hp shouldnt be that expensive of an engine if built properly.But what the hell to i know,I've only been building drag race,circle track,offshore marine,street,mud bog engines for 15years now.And my customers would trust me enough,due to reputation,that if i said a stock block would be fine-that would be good enough for them.

Thanks,and have a nice day.

Shawn Miller

 

One is a LS1tech sponsor, the other is not.....HMMMMMMM.