Alternate Headlight Lifters?
05-07-2011, 09:32 PM
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Alternate Headlight Lifters? So, like many people I'm sure, I'm getting a bit tired of the noisy, high maintenance headlight motors. I'm thinking about looking into fabbing some hydraulic/pneumatic lifters to swap in. I don't know how plausible it is, but if anyone has any info/thoughts, I would appreciate any help. I will try to keep this thread updated if I make any progress.
05-08-2011, 10:02 AM
#2
Hey! Me too!
I found these the other day and so far they are making me happy. https://ls1tech.com/forums/stereo-el...ght-doors.html Easier to change the gears and they are quieter than the old ones, but... I expect that will change with age.
IMO - These are the best option we have for a balanced set of features. I suppose one could use a linear actuator or pneumatics to control the doors, but finding a linear actuator that is quieter, will stand up to freezing/hot temperatures, vibration, water, etc. would be difficult and expensive. I'm not sure pneumatics would be a low maintenance solution, either.
The thing these motors do well, is adjust to wear over time. (Until they break.) It may seem weird that every time we turn on the car, the motors dance back/forth but it fixes THE big problem that pop-up headlights had way back when. Motors would start to wear and bind up and you'd have cars all over the road with limp lights or one stuck up and the other down. Ours are continually adjusting, so they either work or they don't. There's really no in between.
In the end, I think there are two flaws with the motors as designed:
- We can't change the gears with the motor on the car. (At least the new cardone design has screws to take the cover off to get to the gear - yea!)
- The motor casing attachment to the plastic gear housing sucks. As the tabs wear down the motor housing "hops" off the gear housing, which leads to gear stripping. (It seems that many gear failures are due to this.) I got to thinking the other day that a worthwhile project might be to come up with a metal gear casing that can be welded or more firmly attached to the motor casing. In addition to being more durable, it might also bring down noise. Is there anyone with a CNC machine in the house???
I found these the other day and so far they are making me happy. https://ls1tech.com/forums/stereo-el...ght-doors.html Easier to change the gears and they are quieter than the old ones, but... I expect that will change with age.
IMO - These are the best option we have for a balanced set of features. I suppose one could use a linear actuator or pneumatics to control the doors, but finding a linear actuator that is quieter, will stand up to freezing/hot temperatures, vibration, water, etc. would be difficult and expensive. I'm not sure pneumatics would be a low maintenance solution, either.
The thing these motors do well, is adjust to wear over time. (Until they break.) It may seem weird that every time we turn on the car, the motors dance back/forth but it fixes THE big problem that pop-up headlights had way back when. Motors would start to wear and bind up and you'd have cars all over the road with limp lights or one stuck up and the other down. Ours are continually adjusting, so they either work or they don't. There's really no in between.
In the end, I think there are two flaws with the motors as designed:
- We can't change the gears with the motor on the car. (At least the new cardone design has screws to take the cover off to get to the gear - yea!)
- The motor casing attachment to the plastic gear housing sucks. As the tabs wear down the motor housing "hops" off the gear housing, which leads to gear stripping. (It seems that many gear failures are due to this.) I got to thinking the other day that a worthwhile project might be to come up with a metal gear casing that can be welded or more firmly attached to the motor casing. In addition to being more durable, it might also bring down noise. Is there anyone with a CNC machine in the house???
05-08-2011, 01:02 PM
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I did see that thread. My only issue with that is that it doesn't seem to make it any more reliable, just easier to fix when it breaks.
What I've found so far is this: McMaster-Carr sells "washdown" air cylinders, which are water- and chemical-resistant for around $120 per piece, and I've sourced a 12V 150psi air compressor with a 1.5 gal tank for about $150 that normally is used for an air horn. I'm still looking into the mounting issue.
What I've found so far is this: McMaster-Carr sells "washdown" air cylinders, which are water- and chemical-resistant for around $120 per piece, and I've sourced a 12V 150psi air compressor with a 1.5 gal tank for about $150 that normally is used for an air horn. I'm still looking into the mounting issue.
05-08-2011, 02:07 PM
#4
Those are cool. Much shorter than electronic actuators. It looks like they sell mounting brackets for the cylinders, so I'd expect mounting them wouldn't be so bad. Aside from changing the motion of the doors, coming up with a new control module will be a nice little electronics project in itself. (but definitely do-able)
An air system would be a great excuse to install airbags for the suspension, locomotive horn under the hood, etc. Do you think that air cylinders would be less maintenance than changing out a gear ever couple of years? (I've never worked with them and don't know how long the seals would last.)
An air system would be a great excuse to install airbags for the suspension, locomotive horn under the hood, etc. Do you think that air cylinders would be less maintenance than changing out a gear ever couple of years? (I've never worked with them and don't know how long the seals would last.)
05-08-2011, 06:08 PM
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I honestly don't know about the maintenance of an air system like that, which is part of my motivation for posting here. But even if it were a similar maintenance period, I think it would be worth it to have such a cool mod.
As for a control module, between my roommates and myself, we have 2 mechanical engineers, 2 computer science/software engineers, and an electrical engineer. If we can't figure it out, I'm not confident that it could be done
The only thing I'm still unsure of would be the mounting. More updates hopefully to come.
As for a control module, between my roommates and myself, we have 2 mechanical engineers, 2 computer science/software engineers, and an electrical engineer. If we can't figure it out, I'm not confident that it could be done
The only thing I'm still unsure of would be the mounting. More updates hopefully to come.
05-09-2011, 12:40 AM
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If im not mistaken Im pretty sure when I changed my moms 99 corvette headlight motor the motor casing was attached to the plastic gear housing with bolts/screws. I would have to double check sometime this week to get the for sure answer.
after a quick google image search I found this and it is infact attached with a bolt, the mounting holes look so close to the fbodies
http://www.isimotorsports.com/produc...18336_zoom.jpg
after a quick google image search I found this and it is infact attached with a bolt, the mounting holes look so close to the fbodies
http://www.isimotorsports.com/produc...18336_zoom.jpg
05-09-2011, 11:01 AM
#7
brutalis - sounds like you have quite a team on board. Why stop with normal headlights? See if you can get the gang to build a 2-position system. 1st position normal lights. 2nd position, the headlight opens up and you fire either incendiary/road rage devices while you are on the road or maybe beers at a tailgate?
94T/A - that's what I was after. Looks like at 2000 the corvettes changed over to the same motor in the F-bodies. (It looks like the motor height and mounting holes are different.) My theory was that the metal cased motors would be more durable. Do you know why you had to change the motor out on your corvette?
94T/A - that's what I was after. Looks like at 2000 the corvettes changed over to the same motor in the F-bodies. (It looks like the motor height and mounting holes are different.) My theory was that the metal cased motors would be more durable. Do you know why you had to change the motor out on your corvette?
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05-09-2011, 11:06 AM
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94T/A - Those motors do look a lot better than ours, but how do they sound? That's one of my biggest quarrels with the motor. I'm tired of hearing grrrrrrrrrrrrrrCLUNK every time I close my headlights 
wssix - Apart from your post being totally broken...
I have contemplated doing a multi-position system, but as far as I can tell, the air cylinders I found don't have any way to do that easily and reliably. They seem to be just a basic in/out piston. I still think I would be wicked sweet to have the air powered headlight doors though. Flip a switch and the doors open up lightning fast with an ominous hiss...
I think it's a very plausible idea. The only thing holding me back right now is funds. If any sponsors want to get in on this.......
wssix - Apart from your post being totally broken...
I have contemplated doing a multi-position system, but as far as I can tell, the air cylinders I found don't have any way to do that easily and reliably. They seem to be just a basic in/out piston. I still think I would be wicked sweet to have the air powered headlight doors though. Flip a switch and the doors open up lightning fast with an ominous hiss...
I think it's a very plausible idea. The only thing holding me back right now is funds. If any sponsors want to get in on this.......
Last edited by brutalis; 05-09-2011 at 11:18 AM.
05-12-2011, 09:21 AM
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Minor update.
I'm thinking that I will use the air piston to not only replace the motor, but alter the movement slightly as well. I plan to fit a set of projectors (and maybe a couple other things) instead of the current lamps and then set the doors to open quite a bit less. Basically, they will only open far enough to reveal the projectors (under 3 inches), giving it a meaner look.
I'm thinking that I will use the air piston to not only replace the motor, but alter the movement slightly as well. I plan to fit a set of projectors (and maybe a couple other things) instead of the current lamps and then set the doors to open quite a bit less. Basically, they will only open far enough to reveal the projectors (under 3 inches), giving it a meaner look.
07-27-2011, 10:46 AM
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Update: This past weekend, the front end of the TA got acquainted with a blind left turner, and the pass side headlight ***'y got destroyed, so now is the time to get started. Keep an eye out for more.
08-12-2011, 07:19 PM
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Update, got my projectors in today, and I have my actuators and a sort of plan formulated. It will be a pretty simple system: The actuators, which are about 2"x2" square and about 4" long, not including the arm, will sit on the impact bar at the far inside of the headlight opening, facing up, so when they extend they will simply push the door up. They have about a 3.5" travel, so just about perfect, nice and simple. Still working on a way to get the projectors mounted (they are bi-xenon, so only one per side), but that should be fairly easy, then I just have to make up a fiberglass surround. The only complicated fab left will be the "push point" where the actuator will contact the headlight. Since the actuator will be mounted solid, I will need to have some sort of bushing in the headlight, but shouldn't pose too big of a problem.
The plumbing is pretty straightforward. I've ordered an ultra-light duty onboard air compressor and 1 gal tank (designed for air horns) and I just need to get a 4 way, 2 position solenoid valve. Will post another update once fabrication gets underway.
The plumbing is pretty straightforward. I've ordered an ultra-light duty onboard air compressor and 1 gal tank (designed for air horns) and I just need to get a 4 way, 2 position solenoid valve. Will post another update once fabrication gets underway.
10-20-2011, 04:55 PM
#13
FWIW, I'm pretty sure the "clunk" is the metal brackets hitting the hard plastic adjuster screws used in an F-body. If you were to put some dampeners/isolators on the adjuster screws (or found a different type of screw with a rubber end) and bracket assembly I bet most of the annoying noise would go away. I managed to make most of the CLUNK go away by putting rubber caps over the hex head adjusters that the headlights rest on when closed. However, the rubber quickly deteriorated because I wasn't using the right type of material. As far as the motor, I'd say some sort of foam/rubber on the motor case and some rubber bolted to the brackets should absorb the vibrations. Quieting the headlights down has been one of my long-term low-priority projects... And yes, my friends C5 Z06 headlights are MUCH quieter.
10-21-2011, 10:00 AM
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Well, as it turns out, I have in fact made some progress, and my headlights are now completely silent. They are also very very bright. Pictures as soon as I can get them finished. For now, enjoy the cliffhanger
10-31-2011, 11:07 AM
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Sorry guys, been really busy with school and personal stuff the past couple weeks, plus the rain doesn't help either... I'll try to get some good pics as soon as possible.