One of the baddest 6th gens around.. THE BUSTER
08-23-2018, 07:36 AM
#23
TECH Apprentice
08-23-2018, 08:56 AM
#25
A A10, gears and a 7,500 red line is a deadly combo for sure. I don't think the 19' 6th Gens with the A10 are going to come close to the performance of the 5.0's. We don't have the rpm to take advantage. At least stock they won't. Hopefully I will be proven wrong.
08-23-2018, 09:07 AM
#26
The A8's are not having any trouble NA against A10 GT's don't see how a A10 6g would be any worse. or are you saying the performance gains wont be the same as the A6 to A10 GT? Which I don't doubt one bit...I don't think the A10 will do a whole lot more for All Torx and No RPM.
Last edited by kinglt-1; 08-23-2018 at 09:18 AM.
08-23-2018, 09:20 AM
#27
TECH Regular
have some vacation time I need to burn before the end of the year I figure i can drive on Thursday night be in Florida Friday Saturday and leave Sunday morning. Let me see what rooms are going for and that will determine the number of nights I'll stay. I was supposed to be going in a few weeks anyways to see the no prepraces in North Carolina where my in laws are but sct may suffice
08-23-2018, 10:44 AM
#28
The A8's are not having any trouble NA against A10 GT's don't see how a A10 6g would be any worse. or are you saying the performance gains wont be the same as the A6 to A10 GT? Which I don't doubt one bit...I don't think the A10 will do a whole lot more for All Torx and No RPM.
I liken it to putting a 4C in an A8. You can't lock it before 3rd. In most cases we lose mph and make a marginal gain in the 1/4 since the first couple shift recovery points happen after peak power. The 60ft improves yet we don't see the gains of that on the big end like we used to. Once we can lock the converter we get some mph back up top due to it pulling back down 1,500 rpm or so after the shift but the damage is done.
Now take the coyote that can shift at 7,500rpm, it's shift recover will still be before peak power and will be on the climb in the new gear, not the down side. Gears help the lack of TQ those motors have down low. I am not sure of the shift timing and TM Ford uses vs. GM. But GM seems to be the most conservative from what I have seen with A6 and A8's between GM, Ford and Mopar.
08-23-2018, 11:20 AM
#30
My original thoughts were that the 3C would be the ticket for sure. You get an extra 800rpm or slip over the stock converter with out much of the lock up "issues". But I have a customer or two with them in their bolt on cars and I haven't seen the 60fts change a ton. Power with these cars stays a bit flat till around 3,500 or so and then there is about a 50rwtq jump by 4,500. So I am a fan of the 4C hands down for both bolt on cars and cam cars to a point. A 5C or something like that will be needed more now with the direction things are heading. But, I haven't had a 3C car in my hands to dial in at the track. I try not to make decisions without beating the product to death.
08-23-2018, 11:30 AM
#31
10 Second Club
iTrader: (8)
The A8's are not having any trouble NA against A10 GT's don't see how a A10 6g would be any worse. or are you saying the performance gains wont be the same as the A6 to A10 GT? Which I don't doubt one bit...I don't think the A10 will do a whole lot more for All Torx and No RPM.
Furd has always did better gearing. Gm needs to get on that train. The a10 should help the 6gen run out the back with tighter gearing and using a extra gear to get through the qtr. My theory is if you have more tq then you have more tq to multiply....and that's all gearing does is multiply tq.
so if gm does this right with a built in drag mode with no tm the 6gen will come out on top fairly easily.....stock or mod 4 mod
08-23-2018, 12:03 PM
#32
furd totally revamped the s550 because of the *** whooping it was receiving....it's not like this was just a trans change. The 5br0 engine itself got totally reworked...bored, higher compresdion, bigger valves, tuned for more rpm. So that alone gave them a 20-25 hp increase depending on if you want to play the octane for advertising. They're still down on tq.....the 5br0 has to work harder just to make up for that via rpm. So there is alot more to the 18 than just the a10 change.
Furd has always did better gearing. Gm needs to get on that train. The a10 should help the 6gen run out the back with tighter gearing and using a extra gear to get through the qtr. My theory is if you have more tq then you have more tq to multiply....and that's all gearing does is multiply tq.
so if gm does this right with a built in drag mode with no tm the 6gen will come out on top fairly easily.....stock or mod 4 mod
Furd has always did better gearing. Gm needs to get on that train. The a10 should help the 6gen run out the back with tighter gearing and using a extra gear to get through the qtr. My theory is if you have more tq then you have more tq to multiply....and that's all gearing does is multiply tq.
so if gm does this right with a built in drag mode with no tm the 6gen will come out on top fairly easily.....stock or mod 4 mod
My big concern is with how crappy GM shift logic and TM are. You may waste well over a second just shifting with 6 gears to go through. To further complicate the shifting matter this trans works off of dual on and off drums. So one has to disconnect before the other can connect. That takes time and spikes trans slip. So you are actually off power for quite a bit as far as the trans is concerned going down the track. I would love to put a stock GM trans tune on a MD and let it bang through the gears and see just how much power is actually lost on shifts.
08-23-2018, 01:20 PM
#34
My original thoughts were that the 3C would be the ticket for sure. You get an extra 800rpm or slip over the stock converter with out much of the lock up "issues". But I have a customer or two with them in their bolt on cars and I haven't seen the 60fts change a ton. Power with these cars stays a bit flat till around 3,500 or so and then there is about a 50rwtq jump by 4,500. So I am a fan of the 4C hands down for both bolt on cars and cam cars to a point. A 5C or something like that will be needed more now with the direction things are heading. But, I haven't had a 3C car in my hands to dial in at the track. I try not to make decisions without beating the product to death.
is this ever going to be corrected? I guess I don’t understand
08-23-2018, 01:30 PM
#35
10 Second Club
iTrader: (8)
We will have to see how the gear selection and split pans out. If they can keep the shift recovery to 1,000rpm or less for each gear in a linier fashion and give this car 6K peak power and hold on to 6,500 then we may have a winner. Other than that, I am not sure if it will pan out. I guess you could put the shift points at 6K and utilize all the gears you have to chose from. Or start skipping gears or have it launch in 2nd or something in Track mode.
My big concern is with how crappy GM shift logic and TM are. You may waste well over a second just shifting with 6 gears to go through. To further complicate the shifting matter this trans works off of dual on and off drums. So one has to disconnect before the other can connect. That takes time and spikes trans slip. So you are actually off power for quite a bit as far as the trans is concerned going down the track. I would love to put a stock GM trans tune on a MD and let it bang through the gears and see just how much power is actually lost on shifts.
My big concern is with how crappy GM shift logic and TM are. You may waste well over a second just shifting with 6 gears to go through. To further complicate the shifting matter this trans works off of dual on and off drums. So one has to disconnect before the other can connect. That takes time and spikes trans slip. So you are actually off power for quite a bit as far as the trans is concerned going down the track. I would love to put a stock GM trans tune on a MD and let it bang through the gears and see just how much power is actually lost on shifts.
08-23-2018, 05:40 PM
#38
The stock converter doesn't even lock up till top of 2nd or 3rd at best. The slip of the converter only exacerbates the issue. The only thing I can figure is that it is a time to distance deal. There is some sort of deal in there that is time based I feel that GM did so that the converter couldn't be locked till you were further out or in a gear other than 1st or 2nd. But that is just speculation. It could also be that the lock up command can't over come the slip. I haven't been able to nail it down yet.
09-09-2018, 09:14 AM
#40
Nice car and channel. It's helpful when other people document their good/bad experiences with modding. I have a M6 16 Camaro SS too and have been seriously considering upgrading clutch. Thanks for sharing your journey through video.