COMNBYU

Actually this is what you said-

My buddies LT1 has gone 12.7s at 106 with the same mods as me (full exhaust and a cai), just better tires. Mine will be running similar times shortly. It's not hard at all in an LT1.


"Full exhaust" to me has always meant cat-back. So I'm looking at a cat-back and a CAI.


BUT, after reading what the cars really got done to it now things are starting to sound reasonable. My old LT1 (in avatar BTW) with LT's, true duals dumped, 3.73's, and a CAI went a best of 12.79 @ 105 NA. A good set of headers and open exahust helps those cars a lot.


However that still doesn't refute my original statement. Show me a STOCK LT1 that has run 12.7's. I know that's not the norm for LS1's but I also know that there's no stock LT1 in the world that's gonna run 12.7's.


Again, you can go back to the whole mod for mod thing. Your buddy had several bolt-on parts to run what my car did basically stock. AND, my car had a lot more in it if I had actually gotten a rear/clutch worth a damn in there. I have no doubt that I could have gotten 12.3-.4's easy if I could have actually left hard with the car. But that aside, if you added a few bolt-ons to my old LS1 that your buddy had then you're behind again.



Now, after all that BS I'm done.

Dragframe

iTrader: (14)

Ls1 is a better car.... But from what i have seen, the new mustangs have been CLOSE to them (not beating them) and I beat the new mustangs. So my car must not be much of a slouch... because it is beating the new mustangs and staying somewhat clsoe to the ls1's.

BayAreaSS

iTrader: (10)

I kno a guy that has a 05 GT stang, he went to the track an ran 13.8 and we raced from a 40 roll til like 110 and it wasnt close. The new stangs might hang for one gear but thats about it

urbanhunter44

iTrader: (1)

All that's well and good, but still.. at the end of the day.. for the budget racer.. I paid $5500 for my LT1 with 53k miles on it, and have about $1200 into it, and I'm running these times. I hit my 12.9 last night too, and there's more in it for sure. A nice LS1 ride goes for $15k in these parts. Dollar for dollar the LT1 is a better bang for the buck. That's why I bought an LT1 after I sold my LS1 (sold my 99 A4 Camaro for 13k). Even after modding these rides to catch up initially, they're cheaper to run faster. And I'm a poor **** lol.

I didn't dispute that bolt on for bolt on an LS1 is gonna run faster (once you open the motor it's anyone's game..), or that the fastest stock LT1 (13.6 iirc) is slower than the fastest stock LS1, all I'm saying is that LT1s are right on their heels, and a bolt on LT1 shouldnt have any problems with a stock LS1. LS1 owners are so quick to bash on LT1s (I used to own an LS1, I know) it's ridiculous, especially when they have no concept of how to really race a car. After getting another LT1 my eyes are really opened to how close these cars really are in the 1320.

I consistantly see high 13s out of LS1s at the track, and high 14s out of LT1s.. and everyone talks **** to everyone, especially on this site. I figured I'd post up with some real numbers and knowledge about the often forgotten big brother of the LS1 car.

kyle91z28

iTrader: (1)

I don't know where you guys are from but LT1s aren't anywhere near LS1's around here. Best i've ever seen a stock lt1 m6 run was a 13.9 @ 100. Best i've seen stock LS1 run was a 13.0 @ 108 mph. The average LT1 I see is running exhaust/intake running like 14.0-14.2 @ 98-101 mph. I see most ls1s between 13.2-13.6 @ 104-108. That is a pretty big difference tbh.

ActionJack

This is hilarious! LMFAO


A LT1 hangin with an LS1... Come on. LT1s are cool and we all know that but they are not equal or as close to equal as you guys want to beleive.

My own example, coming from a guy that has gone the 1320 a total of 5 times down the track.

My 3rd time was with stock everything but a K&N Filter and SLP air lid AND throwing a passenger side Catalytic convertor code for restriction. I ran a 13.2 at 104. Have the slip and vid to prove it.


So if a shitty driver like me can run a 1/4 like that with a stock 2001 WS6 A4 (overweight TA) then a 13.6 with a LT1 with a great driver is not so impressive or equal.

Slow Vette

iTrader: (1)

whoever thinks a stock lt1 can hang with a stock ls1 should step away from the crack pipe and come back to reality

COMNBYU

all I'm saying is that LT1s are right on their heels,




I don't know what "right their heels" is supposed to mean. Any way you look at, best possible ET's, avg ET's, or worse ET's, LS1's are consistantly .4+ faster. From my experience .4 is about 4 cars (tenth=a car). IMO 4 cars is not "right on their heels", but to each his own.

And of course you just had to throw in the fact that you can buy LT1's cheaper. I was unaware we were now cost racing.


I can't speak for anyone else, but I'm not trying to bash on LT1's here. As I've already said I owned one, a relatively fast one. I'm good friends with Joe Overton and friends (he lives/races in my hometown and has the fastest NA LT1 in the country JFYI) and am very aware of what they're capable of.


But the fact is that in either stock/bolt-on form LT1's are not anywhere in the same bracket as LS1's as far as speed is concerned. No need for anyones panties to get in a tangle...that's just the way it is.

burnzilla

iTrader: (3)

I think everyone is making good points here.
.5 is a nice lead. A full second on a quarter mile is lightyears.

We can all agree on that.
I think what urban is trying to say by the heels comment, is that for $1000-$1500, sometimes less, there's your intake, exhaust, and headers.

Its not hard to afford, and a nice Stall/or gears is just another $600, give or take.
Considering the LT1's are choked out so much, you can almost consider the Intake, headers and exhaust as more of a starting point.
LS1's are opened up and they breathe so well, not to mention the head angle and a shitload of other things, hence thier price.

And thats what its all about. $$$
And with big pockets, both engines can make big power.
In stock form the LS1 wins, but its supposed to.

urbanhunter44

iTrader: (1)

Yes good post.

I've owned both cars as well, and from MY experience, they will both run close down the 1320. Average stock times for LT1s would be around 13.8-13.9, average stock time for an LS1 is around 13.4-.5 I'd say (both having decent drivers on street tires). 3 tenths (hell even 4 or 5) is NOT a huge difference. All the LT1 would need to run a mid 13 is a set of tires, and I know that from experience.

Yes LS1s are better motors, and out of the box have much better parts (having a MUCH higher pricetag). But there's no reason a good racer in an LT1 with the right light bolt-ons can't run past a stock LS1 without problems (hell my light bolt on car out-traps a stock A4 LS1). All I'm trying to say is LT1s have MUCH more potential per dollar and to run next to their little brothers than people give them credit for, and that's coming from someone who's owned and raced both cars.

COMNBYU

Ok, no more arguing from me about this. The last thing I'll say is that I just don't agree on how close you think stock LT's/LS's run. I live near two of the best tracks in the country as far as traction and elevation are concerned, and your aparent observation of LT1's is not mine. That's where I have the problem. My A4 car (LT1) was one of the best running ones STOCK that I had ever seen around, it's definately not the norm around here.

These days if a stock A4 LT1 clicks off a 13.8-.9 that's doing pretty damn good. It's more common to see lower 14's out of them. And on the lower end of the spectrum with LS1's I'd say 13.5-.6 is about the slowest I've seen a properly driven stock A4 run. If you're gonna use one of the better ET's for the LT1 (13.8-.9) then you should also use a better ET avg for the LS1, like 13.2-.3. Either way, even comparing the best LT1 ET's to the worser of LS1 ET's, you're still talking about .4. From my eperience 4 cars is about the length of a BUS, and I'd say that's a fair sized gap, but whatever.


From my own personal experience I never got closer than about a Greyhound when I use to run my LT1 against LS1's at the track. And mine ran 13.6's.


We'll just have to agree to disagree...

Dragframe

iTrader: (14)

Ok... i think everyone who thinks a bus is that far ahead is stupid. A bus is not that far ahead.

If you read my first post i state i realize what a ls1 should do. And should as in fact. Now what happened is a cold hard fact also. I never said I beat one... and in the quarter the ls1 probly puts a bus on me. But I think for a ls1 only to put a bus on me in the quarter is not THAT impressive considering my lt1 was stock (and ran a 14.97).

I have time slips.... I have raced... i have seen... it is how it happened... Im not a punk kid telling lies to **** people off.

2001z

iTrader: (32)

Lol you think a buslength isnt that far ahead I have owned both lt1/ls1 and stock vs stock it isnt even close your talking about 60 -80 rwhp more and you think that isnt much . The best i have seen a stock lt1 run is 13.7 and the average is 13.9-14.2.

Dragframe

iTrader: (14)

Like i said... A bus length aint THAT far... you guys act like that is a insermountable length.

And my car runs as I say.. it has 9,000 miles on the motor and the only thing done to it is a rad swap, ignition box, and open exhaust. It is the way it is.