Joezee

your pushing your luck call911.......this thread could get ugly......
I do however admire your devotion to the Lt1....

CALL911

iTrader: (17)

This discussion is not meant to slander anyone, or their year F-body. It is meant to discuss (hopefully with little to no disrespect to anyone) this dispute.

If anyone feels they can continue this debate without slander to anyone, in search of facts, then I ask that you continue to make inputs. If you feel you are more interested in badmouthing or looking to not take this discussion in a proffessional mannor, then please don't ruin it for the rest of us.

Now, I'm still digging for some stock to stock dyno sheets (no luck yet, however it's only a matter of time). Anyone else find any?

slick1851

TPI? Nothing great about it, Shitty intake manifold design slow a **** with boltons....


Read the GM HIGH TECH......



TPIs need to be BUILT with a MINI RAM to do anything special in my book..




NOW A 350 SBC Carb motor, there is nothing wrong with....Im a TPI hater

brejcha

OK guys we are all on the same side. Being an LT1 owner myself I know that if it were stock to stock off the line depends on the driver, but higher up there LS1 FTW. Now with mods on both cars it can go either way. I have seen a modded LT1 walk an LS1 so yea.

But besides the point. We are all owners of some of the greatest cars ever made. Lets not have a big fight over this. Anyways enjoy driving what you have.

CALL911

iTrader: (17)

Thanks for the positive input brejcha.

I tend to believe that the LS1's gain more with similar mods than the LT1. Take putting a whisper lid on an LS1 in comparison with CAI on an LT1. The LS1 will make more of a gain (usually a couple tenths in the 1/4 mile compared to 1 tenth the LT1's usually get).

slick1851

LS1s are going to be faster than LT1 period.....They have put down faster times Stock Vs Stock etc


Now when it comes to modded a LT1 needs a bit more, but its not a slow" car

The LT1s main down fall is the opti spark thats the real problem with them...

brejcha

I am a wanna be gear head. What is the main purpose to the opti and how does it work. Also i have seen like performance optis..what are those.

TonyGXP

I don't know what all the arguing is about, obviously the LS2 is the superior engine.. at almost 5000lbs I ran 13.49 @102 bone stock..

L98 over an Lt1? L98? run of the mill ran high 14's at best, I used to beat my friend's GTA 5.7's with my 84Z28 5.0HO A4 ALL THE TIME.. I ran a Stock LT1 Z28 and he beat me by a pole length... I can't believe the nonsense some of these guys are spreading here...

ChocoTaco369

why do you keep saying this? you're racing dyno graphs. on top of that, the LS1 DOES NOT have 325 ft-lbs from the factory, it has 350 ft-lbs. if you want the numbers of the LS1, get it off the corvette, NOT the f-body as they were underrated to make the corvette look superior in power when, in fact, they were not. you should know this.

the LT1 is not faster than the LS1 anywhere in the powerband. you're thinking of what the "butt dyno" tells you. the torque in the LT1 is lower in the powerband so it simply FEELS more powerful. the low rpm torque makes a powerful feel but it translates into MUCH LESS horsepower. remember, horsepower is a multiplication of TORQUE X RPM's, so the fact that the LT1 makes its torque lower shows is huge disadvantage in horsepower, the actual rating that determines how fast your car is. horsepower is POWER, races are won by a power-to-weight ratio paired with gearing and aerodynamics. the LS1 has a better power-to-weight ratio than an LT1 in ANY RPM along with relatively the same weight and gearing. the LT1 simply cannot hang with an LS1 anywhere. if it does, it's driver error, plain and simple.

torque is a SOTP feel, horsepower is the propellant. the LT1 is NOT faster anywhere, it just feels like it is.

burnzilla

iTrader: (3)

The Tq curve in the LT1 goes well up until 4800Rpms, and the HP curve is strong and climbs good all the way up till 6000 rpm.
The 0-60/80 mph can be very close.

The LT1 was choked out by GM.

Now lets not get this out on control, the LS1 is faster, and revs better up top, but the LT1 is a potent motor and not anything to be taken lightly, especially if modded right.

JKDZ28

iTrader: (14)

Bingo! Well put, you fellas need to listen to Choco

JKDZ28

iTrader: (14)

Your right, the LT1 should not be taken lightly. They are very potent powerplants.

However, a well maintained/driven LS1 "should" take a well maintained/driven LT1 everytime.

sdm1234

iTrader: (8)

actually, torque is force. force is power. horsepower is just calculated forced used to sustain that power over a period of time, because momentum is power. the higher the momentum, the more kenetic energy, therefore, the horsepower is higher, even though the engine is not pulling as hard as it was at it's peak rating. it's all kinda hard to comprehend, but here's a good link to help understand everything. http://vettenet.org/torquehp.html

i'm not saying Choco is wrong, i'm just saying that i don't agree with this:
horsepower is calculation used to measure sustainable torque and remember... torque is applied force, and applied force is exerted energy, which is power.

ChocoTaco369

oh, i'm not saying the LT1 is a bad motor. the LT1 is a very good motor, has proven to hold up well past the 100,000 mile marker and can be deadly built up. i'm simply saying stock for stock, it's not match for an LS1 anywhere in the powerband. yes, the LS1 is a superior motor, but what do you expect? it's newer and was DESIGNED to outperform the LT1. you can't hold it against the LT1.

burnzilla

iTrader: (3)

Choco... STOP posting.

The 0-60 times are very close. The LS1 is faster.
A stock LT1 SS M6 could take an early 90-00 LS1 A4 GU2.
Thats an exception to the rule. No need to reply Choco.

ChocoTaco369

yes, torque is force. however, torque is NOT power.

power is measured in Watts. 1 horsepower = 745.7 watts. horsepower is nothing but a larger scale to measure power. horsepower is like an Astronomical Unit. because it would be ridiculous to measure distances in our solar system by feet, they use astronomical units, which is 93 million miles - the distance from the Earth to the sun. it would be ridiculous to rate our engine power by watts. it wouldn't make sense to say our engine has 260995 watts of power. too hard to keep track of.

again, torque is NOT power. watts is power, and horsepower is simply a different scale of measuring watts.

ChocoTaco369

burnzilla, STOP posting. accept the fact that the LS1 is faster than the LT1 at ANY rpm. you have an LT1. that's the only reason why you're arguing this. if an LT1 jumps an LS1 in the 60 foot, it's because of driver error. the LT1 is not faster anywhere in the powerband. say it with me: "the LT1 is not faster than the LS1 anywhere in the powerband". the sooner you accept it, the sooner you can put it behind you.

and a 3.42 geared M6 against an A4 w/2.73's is comparing apples to oranges. if the LS1 f-body is towing a boat, would the race still count? you're comparing two totally different setups. that being said, i still cut a 2.0 60ft with my stock A4 w/2.73's in the dead of summer on street tires. not many LT1's do that.

i'm not saying that an LT1 and LS1 aren't close in the 60 ft or 1/8 mile. yes, they are close right out of the hole, but the LS1 is still faster. whether it's by inches or miles, a win is a win.

CALL911

iTrader: (17)

Put simply, torque is what is going to get you out of the hole, HP is what the car will do in the upper RPM bands. Your MPH in the 1/4 is a good measure of HP car to car.

All this argument is irrelievant until some facts can be shown (instead of opinions). Best I could do so far was find a couple of poor quality stock LS1 to stock LT1 (down to the paper air filters) videos. If anyone has a stock dyno of either or prefferably both cars, this would help support this dispute.

TonyGXP

a well driven 4.6 5spd GT will hang with an LS1 for the first 30 or so MPH, they can hang with me, so does that mean that a 4.6 "shouldn't be taken lightly, especially a lightly modded one"? most vehicles that are "NEAR" each other in a 1/4 mi race are going to be close out of the hole given they both have traction, but like they say, it aint how you start...... this argument is strange in that why would one take pride in winning a 1/3 of a race anyway?? WTF are we talking about? if it makes you fell better I ran an IS350 the other night from a light and he jumped out a car and half until about 40 when I hit second and caught traction, does that mean he's faster? or that he "felt good"?? I highly doubt it when I flew past him like he was in reverse..

ChocoTaco369

let's clarify a few things.

torque is what an engine makes. horsepower, or power in general, is just a calculation of torque. if you want to look at it in terms of what an engine DOES, all it does is create torque.

basically, what you mean to say is the LS1 is far better at creating torque at a high RPM.

now, no one looks at the scenario this way. it's much easier to think in terms of horsepower because you're taking just one variable into effect where when you're looking at torque, you have to look at it along with RPM's. now, that being said, torque is NOT what gets you out of the hole. horsepower still does. it's just very low RPM horsepower. people think low RPM horsepower is torque. it's not. torque is just a measurement of how hard the engine twists. horsepower is taking that twisting at a certain RPM and turning it into wattage.

i'm starting to ramble. the point i'm trying to make is, torque is what an engine makes. horsepower is a calculation of torque at a given RPM. the engine is making torque no matter what, but it's how much torque at an RPM, or how much horsepower, the engine makes that both gets it out of the hole AND gets you going up top. the LS1 is better at torquing down low and MUCH better at torquing up high than the LT1. horsepower isn't what's created up high. the EXACT SAME THING that is created up high is created down low. horsepower numbers are simply higher in the high RPM's for engines because it's torque multiplied by the RPM. don't confuse these terms.