Springs!! Help me out
08-14-2009, 06:23 PM
#21
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You were told by who? The "every 5" on the sidewall is not a measure of height, it is a the height of the sidewall when compared to the tread width. A "50" has a sidewall height that's 50% of the tread width, a "30" has a sidewall that's 30% of that the treadwidth.
You are trying to pick springs based on some pretty random tire sizes, and that's just wrong. Now, unlike some others that will blow smoke up your tail-pipe I can't and won't say "run my springs" because frankly you shouldn't be picking springs to compensate for weird tire sizes. If you run a really, really tall tire, you'd need some pretty slammed springs to make the car look at all right but that leaves you with no suspension travel.
I know you found some Hypercoil springs... Good luck with those, they tend to be more than 1.2" drop, and are very, very stiff springs especially in the rear, and need a lot of damping to control them (i.e. better shocks).
You are trying to pick springs based on some pretty random tire sizes, and that's just wrong. Now, unlike some others that will blow smoke up your tail-pipe I can't and won't say "run my springs" because frankly you shouldn't be picking springs to compensate for weird tire sizes. If you run a really, really tall tire, you'd need some pretty slammed springs to make the car look at all right but that leaves you with no suspension travel.
I know you found some Hypercoil springs... Good luck with those, they tend to be more than 1.2" drop, and are very, very stiff springs especially in the rear, and need a lot of damping to control them (i.e. better shocks).
The springs arrived today and do appear to be quite stiff. I don't mind a stiff ride and currently the ride on the car is SUPER soft. I think it will be a interesting change. I don't believe any of you have the perfect answer for me but I think I am going to get them installed anyways and hopefully be able to get the fender well work done.
I just wish some of you were giving me useful answers instead of arguing over sidewall heights. I provided pictures people! I don't need a lesson on calculating sidewall sizes.. I already made the mistake of getting too high of a profile (it really isn't that tall in person) and must deal with the consequences. Hopefully a tire shop can give me some feedback.
08-14-2009, 06:30 PM
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If anyone is still confused, just use this to check: http://www.miata.net/garage/tirecalc.html
You can pretty much compare tire sizes and figure what profiles you should be using.
The profile number is a ratio of the width. A 245/40/17 will have a shorter sidewall than a 275/40/17
You can pretty much compare tire sizes and figure what profiles you should be using.
The profile number is a ratio of the width. A 245/40/17 will have a shorter sidewall than a 275/40/17
08-14-2009, 06:40 PM
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Original tires: 235/50/16 Tire Diameter: 25.3''
New Tires: 245/45/18 Tire diametere: 26.7''
Now from the looks of it to approximate my old tire diameter I wanted a 40 profile (damn tire shop). It is too late for that... The car is sitting 1.4'' taller than it used to be. I want to drop it about 1.2'' So for this to make sense to you guys, on a STOCK tire setup the car would be getting dropped 2.5'' total. That sounds steep to me which is why my setup would most likely be rubbing. What do you guys think? These springs are so nice looking haha I want to put them on ugggg...
These numbers are from that tire size calculator link.
New Tires: 245/45/18 Tire diametere: 26.7''
Now from the looks of it to approximate my old tire diameter I wanted a 40 profile (damn tire shop). It is too late for that... The car is sitting 1.4'' taller than it used to be. I want to drop it about 1.2'' So for this to make sense to you guys, on a STOCK tire setup the car would be getting dropped 2.5'' total. That sounds steep to me which is why my setup would most likely be rubbing. What do you guys think? These springs are so nice looking haha I want to put them on ugggg...
These numbers are from that tire size calculator link.
08-14-2009, 07:28 PM
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I was also told that the front spring installation would take a good bit longer then the rear. I can easily see that the rear can handle the drop. It really is the front I am worried about.
Would it be a fix to my problem to put springs in the rear and keep the front stock until I can find some lt1 front springs??
Just throwing some ideas out there for you guys. Lowering the rear would be cheap and effective. Its the front that is costly and will create problems. If I do lower the front I think I will have to remove all splash guard plastic in the wheel well
Would it be a fix to my problem to put springs in the rear and keep the front stock until I can find some lt1 front springs??
Just throwing some ideas out there for you guys. Lowering the rear would be cheap and effective. Its the front that is costly and will create problems. If I do lower the front I think I will have to remove all splash guard plastic in the wheel well
08-14-2009, 11:41 PM
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Original tires: 235/50/16 Tire Diameter: 25.3''
New Tires: 245/45/18 Tire diametere: 26.7''
Now from the looks of it to approximate my old tire diameter I wanted a 40 profile (damn tire shop). It is too late for that... The car is sitting 1.4'' taller than it used to be. I want to drop it about 1.2'' So for this to make sense to you guys, on a STOCK tire setup the car would be getting dropped 2.5'' total. That sounds steep to me which is why my setup would most likely be rubbing. What do you guys think? These springs are so nice looking haha I want to put them on ugggg...
These numbers are from that tire size calculator link.
New Tires: 245/45/18 Tire diametere: 26.7''
Now from the looks of it to approximate my old tire diameter I wanted a 40 profile (damn tire shop). It is too late for that... The car is sitting 1.4'' taller than it used to be. I want to drop it about 1.2'' So for this to make sense to you guys, on a STOCK tire setup the car would be getting dropped 2.5'' total. That sounds steep to me which is why my setup would most likely be rubbing. What do you guys think? These springs are so nice looking haha I want to put them on ugggg...
These numbers are from that tire size calculator link.
So I'm a little confused.. you said you are getting no rubbing. Why are you worried about rubbing? Are you getting rubbing? So your two choices will be find a way to clear the taller tire and update your speedo if you feel like it, or get stock diameter tires. You'll also have a bit of a longer gear ratio... not sure exactly by how much though.
08-14-2009, 11:48 PM
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Ah didn't notice Sam or anyone asked. Sadly, it is on stock shocks which will get an upgrade soon. I am a noob and didn't know the necessity of doing a full suspension when I bought these springs. I am not too worried about the shocks though I am kinda going on the appearance side of things. Don't get me wrong, handling is very important to me and I want it improved. This stock suspension setup is a joke on these firebirds.
08-14-2009, 11:54 PM
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.7 inch taller... 1.4 is the overall diameter increase. .7 on one side, .7 on the other.
So I'm a little confused.. you said you are getting no rubbing. Why are you worried about rubbing? Are you getting rubbing? So your two choices will be find a way to clear the taller tire and update your speedo if you feel like it, or get stock diameter tires. You'll also have a bit of a longer gear ratio... not sure exactly by how much though.
So I'm a little confused.. you said you are getting no rubbing. Why are you worried about rubbing? Are you getting rubbing? So your two choices will be find a way to clear the taller tire and update your speedo if you feel like it, or get stock diameter tires. You'll also have a bit of a longer gear ratio... not sure exactly by how much though.
The thing is I have a lot of school obligations coming up and don't feel that I have the time to cut out wheel well plastics, bend fender wells and such and was hoping that I could get a straight answer about if my new springs were possible on this setup. With limited funds and time I think I may just drop the rear and see how that goes, if that is an ok idea.. I figured I may lose some handling but as far as I can tell the front springs/shocks/sway are good. It is the rear that bounces all around. So by putting stiff springs on I should hopefully achieve a balanced ride at the moment.
But what do I know...
08-15-2009, 10:11 AM
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Ah didn't notice Sam or anyone asked. Sadly, it is on stock shocks which will get an upgrade soon. I am a noob and didn't know the necessity of doing a full suspension when I bought these springs. I am not too worried about the shocks though I am kinda going on the appearance side of things. Don't get me wrong, handling is very important to me and I want it improved. This stock suspension setup is a joke on these firebirds.
I'm not even talking about performance or looks, I'm talking you will hate to drive the car and it is going to rattle your teeth out by banging into the bumpstops. This also is not good for your car. I'm not saying go buy Konis (although they are the best) but you need to put a shock on the car that will not destroy your ride quality and make your car unsafe. You mentioned above about balancing out w/ the springs? That isn't going to happen. You are fighting a tire height problem w/ springs and you will soon be fighting a shock problem with those springs. There are right and wrong ways to go about this. If you are low on funds you don't need to be lowering.....to do this right you need to look into shocks, PHB at the minimum and look at shocks, springs, TA, and PHB to do it right. And in your case you need to fix your 4x4 height caused by the tires.
You are so dead set on keeping those tires but I highly advise you to fix that problem first. The stock suspension is going to feel like a dream compared to Decarbons on hypercoils. Don't say we didn't warn you.
I have stock suspension (other than TA) on Koni shocks and you can hardly say the suspension sucks. Good shocks make a HUGE difference on these cars. I'm only going w/ springs to get that last bit of control, ride height etc.
Last edited by JamRWS6; 08-15-2009 at 10:18 AM.
08-15-2009, 01:34 PM
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I feel like I am finally gaining some knowledge on suspension setups. Apparently for my price bracket I am looking into SLP bilstein shocks (fav so far) or KYB AGX shocks. As you guys know one is adjustable and one is not. I have seen opposing views on both and not exactly sure which would be best for a hyperco spring setup.
You said I was set on these tires? The problem is I paid and own them. How am I supposed to get rid of them now? I feel as if no one is going to pay what I paid for them and I am not in the business of losing money.
So If I were to purchase some new shocks and put them in conjunction with my springs do you guys think I would be sitting fine on my tire/rim setup? I hope...
Thanks for the input jamrws6. It really opened my eyes and made me do some suspension research on the forums.
You said I was set on these tires? The problem is I paid and own them. How am I supposed to get rid of them now? I feel as if no one is going to pay what I paid for them and I am not in the business of losing money.
So If I were to purchase some new shocks and put them in conjunction with my springs do you guys think I would be sitting fine on my tire/rim setup? I hope...
Thanks for the input jamrws6. It really opened my eyes and made me do some suspension research on the forums.
