C5 caliper-only conversion
While searching for something else, I found my old review of the LGM kit ...
https://ls1tech.com/forums/suspensio...-comments.html
https://ls1tech.com/forums/suspensio...-comments.html
Work around? Yes ... As long as I kept decent depth rear pads, the knockback wasn't as bad. But once the pads got below 50%, it started getting bad once again.
There is an interesting read over on FRRAX about axle bow and rear pad knock back.
I may be wrong, but I don't think you'd be able to fit C5 rotors in an f-body caliper, since they're 1/4" thicker...don't know if there's enough play with brand-new pads to get the caliper on the rotor. Also, you'd be using the weaker caliper of the two.
I'm just pondering again, but the entire C5 setup might be better than the f-body setup due to the caliper being mounted further away from the center axis of the rotor, meaning it's going to have more stopping power due to leverage, even though both calipers use roughly the same pads.
I'm just pondering again, but the entire C5 setup might be better than the f-body setup due to the caliper being mounted further away from the center axis of the rotor, meaning it's going to have more stopping power due to leverage, even though both calipers use roughly the same pads.
I believe you've got the right idea. Although the C5 calipers might have a slightly smaller piston which decreases braking power, when you move it out farther on a C5 rotor it adds that power back through increased leverage which brings you somewhere back around stock braking power-and I would think even more than stock F-body. Would have to do some searching or calculations to find out for sure. Even if the C5 caliper/rotor combo did not have any more stopping power than the F-body setup, it's larger mass and directional rotors act to keep the brake system cooler.
I had no idea that there would be this kind of a mounting difference between the two rotors. I think there are some who have used C5 rotors w/ the F-body caliper. For example, see here: https://ls1tech.com/forums/suspensio...-brackets.html
I believe you've got the right idea. Although the C5 calipers might have a slightly smaller piston which decreases braking power, when you move it out farther on a C5 rotor it adds that power back through increased leverage which brings you somewhere back around stock braking power-and I would think even more than stock F-body. Would have to do some searching or calculations to find out for sure. Even if the C5 caliper/rotor combo did not have any more stopping power than the F-body setup, it's larger mass and directional rotors act to keep the brake system cooler.
I believe you've got the right idea. Although the C5 calipers might have a slightly smaller piston which decreases braking power, when you move it out farther on a C5 rotor it adds that power back through increased leverage which brings you somewhere back around stock braking power-and I would think even more than stock F-body. Would have to do some searching or calculations to find out for sure. Even if the C5 caliper/rotor combo did not have any more stopping power than the F-body setup, it's larger mass and directional rotors act to keep the brake system cooler.
Yet more pondering...I've seen it said that the f-body, C5, and C6 calipers are all interchangeable. It looks like (same as the C5), the C6 caliper is the same stock part number used across all the C6 variants. Is it known if the C6 calipers also use the smaller piston like the C5 did?
Last edited by Element; Aug 22, 2010 at 09:36 PM.
I have the full c5 z06 conversion on my camaro, consists of enginereed velocity brake brackets, corvetter abutment brackets, c5 calipers, c5 rotors and russell stainless lines.
On my firebird I just want bigger rotors to cut down on cost and should technically be a better stopping system.
On my firebird I just want bigger rotors to cut down on cost and should technically be a better stopping system.
Ok I just put on my c5 caliper on today and everything lined up great I used the f-body pads though but I recomend buy slider pins for the c5 caliper cuz cuz the bolt holes are thinner than the f-bodys.
Now I have one question.
Seeing as how my calipers were sticking do to slider pins my rotors have gotten warped, so my question is if I buy a 13" rotor and a c5 calier bracket will this just bolt up, or do I need to buy the umi bracket? I know I will probably need longer brake line.
So to in short .... will a c5 caliper, STOCK bracket, and rotor bolt up to an fibody?
Now I have one question.
Seeing as how my calipers were sticking do to slider pins my rotors have gotten warped, so my question is if I buy a 13" rotor and a c5 calier bracket will this just bolt up, or do I need to buy the umi bracket? I know I will probably need longer brake line.
So to in short .... will a c5 caliper, STOCK bracket, and rotor bolt up to an fibody?
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Verdad Gallardo The stock abutment bracket for a C5 attaches to the C5 knuckle, placing the caliper the proper distance from rotor center.
That attachment point on the F-Car has a differnt measurement ... F-Car has 12" rotors and the C5 has 13" rotors.
The differnce is built into the knuckle and not the abutment bracket.
So, yes, you will need to snag a set of adaptor brackets to attach the C5 abutment bracket to.
That attachment point on the F-Car has a differnt measurement ... F-Car has 12" rotors and the C5 has 13" rotors.
The differnce is built into the knuckle and not the abutment bracket.
So, yes, you will need to snag a set of adaptor brackets to attach the C5 abutment bracket to.
CMC = Camaro/Mustang Challenge
My on-board video - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iXyhPrzpi4E
C5 calipers having smaller pistons ... yes, they are smaller at 44mm. And in a hydraulic system, it will require more pressure to exert the same amout of force as the stockers.
But I certainly don't have any issue locking up the front tires in racing conditions. So, I am assuming the amount of force I can generate mashing my brake pedal is adequate, even at that reduced clamping force.
In fact, the reduced clamping force allows me to modulate the brake pedal more.
C5 rotors are 12.8" .... C6 rotors are 14". Installing C5 rotors REQUIRES moving to a 17" rim. CMC limits us to running 16" rims.
There are a LOT of pad and rotor choices going to the C5 setup. Not so much for an F-Body.
LGM brackets are a direct bolt-on. Lou actually prototyped these on my old street car.
I've never used the back-side mounting "L" shaped bracket. So I couldn't say what alterations are required. But if that were the route I was going to go, I would remove my LSx based F-Car knuckles and sell them to help off-set the cost of the conversion.
I would then find a set of 93-97 knuckles which would be gimmes because no one wants them. Then alter those and install the brackets.
My on-board video - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iXyhPrzpi4E
C5 calipers having smaller pistons ... yes, they are smaller at 44mm. And in a hydraulic system, it will require more pressure to exert the same amout of force as the stockers.
But I certainly don't have any issue locking up the front tires in racing conditions. So, I am assuming the amount of force I can generate mashing my brake pedal is adequate, even at that reduced clamping force.
In fact, the reduced clamping force allows me to modulate the brake pedal more.
C5 rotors are 12.8" .... C6 rotors are 14". Installing C5 rotors REQUIRES moving to a 17" rim. CMC limits us to running 16" rims.
There are a LOT of pad and rotor choices going to the C5 setup. Not so much for an F-Body.
LGM brackets are a direct bolt-on. Lou actually prototyped these on my old street car.
I've never used the back-side mounting "L" shaped bracket. So I couldn't say what alterations are required. But if that were the route I was going to go, I would remove my LSx based F-Car knuckles and sell them to help off-set the cost of the conversion.
I would then find a set of 93-97 knuckles which would be gimmes because no one wants them. Then alter those and install the brackets.
Also enjoyed the love taps I saw. I guess "rubbin' is racing" huh.
Thanks,
There are series out there that don't require stereotypical "deep pockets".
Rubbing happens, especially in a spec class where it boils down driver talent and driver bank accounts.
Unfortunately for me I'm limited on both ... but still manage to have a helluva good time.
There are series out there that don't require stereotypical "deep pockets".
Rubbing happens, especially in a spec class where it boils down driver talent and driver bank accounts.
Unfortunately for me I'm limited on both ... but still manage to have a helluva good time.
I noticed some of you keep mentioning that the C5 calipers can't clamp as hard as the Fbody ones and are thinking about keeping the Fbody ones...
This is a minimal effect and if you think that you will stop faster with Fbody calipers you are wrong. It will take slightly more brake line hydraulic pressure to apply as much force to the pads with the C5 caliper compared to the Fbody ones. Not much difference though and more than enough to overwhelm the tires as mitchntx posted. More importantly, brake hard repeatedly and the Fbody calipers spread... the C5's are stronger because the are pressure cast not gravity cast like the Fbody ones. All in all, the C5 calipers are better because they survive under sever braking and the Fbody calipers won't.
If you are just driving on the street the Fbody calipers are fine though.
This is a minimal effect and if you think that you will stop faster with Fbody calipers you are wrong. It will take slightly more brake line hydraulic pressure to apply as much force to the pads with the C5 caliper compared to the Fbody ones. Not much difference though and more than enough to overwhelm the tires as mitchntx posted. More importantly, brake hard repeatedly and the Fbody calipers spread... the C5's are stronger because the are pressure cast not gravity cast like the Fbody ones. All in all, the C5 calipers are better because they survive under sever braking and the Fbody calipers won't.
If you are just driving on the street the Fbody calipers are fine though.
