Indepedent Rear Suspension (IRS) in a 4th Gen
07-05-2012, 04:40 PM
#61
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Back halfing would be more difficult, even if you got one for a fourth gen. Using a subframe for a different car would increase the difficulty because the rails wouldn't match exactly the location of the existing structure, and might interfere with other items, like the fuel tank for example.
There are advantages, ease of install just doesn't seem to be one of them.
To me, a jig that squares the rear end up, a datum on the car that's square to the frame, and a four post lift would be the easiest method to do the install.
There are advantages, ease of install just doesn't seem to be one of them.
To me, a jig that squares the rear end up, a datum on the car that's square to the frame, and a four post lift would be the easiest method to do the install.
Nice job doing your research though and being informed! It seems to be rare at times
07-05-2012, 05:07 PM
#63
There have been a few noble attempts in the past, but no-one seemed to be able to get one produced. I would LOVE to see a successful C5 kit for the 4th/3rd gen. (kinda makes me wish that I waited before starting my swap)
RANDOM: I wonder what front suspension could be used as a viable swap to get AWD in one of these cars?
RANDOM: I wonder what front suspension could be used as a viable swap to get AWD in one of these cars?
07-05-2012, 05:35 PM
#65
I dont know about the awd but I have always wondered about that too. Probably something from the Syclone's or Typhoons would be the closest you'd ever find in the GM family. Possible the old Toranado's...? Otherwise I imagine you would have to look to a foreign auto maker for a platform.
Might be easier to just hang f body sheet metal on some other car lol!
Might be easier to just hang f body sheet metal on some other car lol!
07-05-2012, 07:32 PM
#66
Lee and Driver_10 are spot on. Yes the obvious simplicity of the suspension component install is great; however foresight tells you that it will be more trouble than it is worth. Another point is that rear cradle you have pictured appears to be aluminum but it may be SS; if this is true it will be incredibly difficult to mate with our car due to the difficulty and process required of welding steel to aluminum. In the end the answer is there is currently no kit for what we have done, however Lee is in the process for the C4 and I soon will be for the C5/C6; patients is the key.
Nice job doing your research though and being informed! It seems to be rare at times
Nice job doing your research though and being informed! It seems to be rare at times
Do you think the kit can possible be made to run along the side where normally the Subframe connectors go to stiffen up the entire body?
07-05-2012, 08:50 PM
#67
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.There have been a few noble attempts in the past, but no-one seemed to be able to get one produced. I would LOVE to see a successful C5 kit for the 4th/3rd gen. (kinda makes me wish that I waited before starting my swap)
RANDOM: I wonder what front suspension could be used as a viable swap to get AWD in one of these cars?
RANDOM: I wonder what front suspension could be used as a viable swap to get AWD in one of these cars?
. It will be another 1-2 years for my C5/6 kit but if you properly setup your control arms (how you are already doing it is perfect) then you will be extremely happy with your current project!As a heads up as well it is going to take Lee awhile to come up with the C4 Kit as he is a busy guy and will be doing this on the side. Same goes with me making the C5/C6 kit, it will be more intricate as well thus taking more time. On top of that I can only work on the project during my extremely short breaks between rotations. Conclusion: it will be awhile but both will most likely be done.
07-06-2012, 05:15 AM
#69
Wasn't a serious inquiry. There's no way to do it with a v8 in the engine bay. I was curious to see feedback.
07-12-2012, 10:18 PM
#70
I know this is a on going older thread. But the LS1GTO forum is going nowhere with this subject.
I have an 05 GTO. As you all may know, you can put a ton of band-aids on those 3 point GTO IRS systems. But in the end you still have the same issues. 1) your stuck to a certain wheel and tire width. 2) the gear selections for the diff sucks. 3) replacement parts cost out the rear end (pun intended!).
At first I was thinking of working in a Ford 8.8 Cobra IRS. I saw a killer install on the Trucks Rolling Thunder build. but then I ran across this thread and now I'm thinking C4 maybe even C5 (I have C5 parts and frame sections on hand).
I just don't know the feasibility of making those work and I really don't have enough of my own data to make an informed choice. So I need some assistance.
Not trying to steel anyone's thread here either. I this needs to be moved let me know.
Thx,
Kev
I have an 05 GTO. As you all may know, you can put a ton of band-aids on those 3 point GTO IRS systems. But in the end you still have the same issues. 1) your stuck to a certain wheel and tire width. 2) the gear selections for the diff sucks. 3) replacement parts cost out the rear end (pun intended!).
At first I was thinking of working in a Ford 8.8 Cobra IRS. I saw a killer install on the Trucks Rolling Thunder build. but then I ran across this thread and now I'm thinking C4 maybe even C5 (I have C5 parts and frame sections on hand).
I just don't know the feasibility of making those work and I really don't have enough of my own data to make an informed choice. So I need some assistance.
Not trying to steel anyone's thread here either. I this needs to be moved let me know.
Thx,
Kev
Last edited by LS1MonteSS; 07-12-2012 at 11:47 PM. Reason: typing sucks!
07-13-2012, 12:34 AM
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I know this is a on going older thread. But the LS1GTO forum is going nowhere with this subject.
I have an 05 GTO. As you all may know, you can put a ton of band-aids on those 3 point GTO IRS systems. But in the end you still have the same issues. 1) your stuck to a certain wheel and tire width. 2) the gear selections for the diff sucks. 3) replacement parts cost out the rear end (pun intended!).
At first I was thinking of working in a Ford 8.8 Cobra IRS. I saw a killer install on the Trucks Rolling Thunder build. but then I ran across this thread and now I'm thinking C4 maybe even C5 (I have C5 parts and frame sections on hand).
I just don't know the feasibility of making those work and I really don't have enough of my own data to make an informed choice. So I need some assistance.
Not trying to steel anyone's thread here either. I this needs to be moved let me know.
Thx,
Kev
I have an 05 GTO. As you all may know, you can put a ton of band-aids on those 3 point GTO IRS systems. But in the end you still have the same issues. 1) your stuck to a certain wheel and tire width. 2) the gear selections for the diff sucks. 3) replacement parts cost out the rear end (pun intended!).
At first I was thinking of working in a Ford 8.8 Cobra IRS. I saw a killer install on the Trucks Rolling Thunder build. but then I ran across this thread and now I'm thinking C4 maybe even C5 (I have C5 parts and frame sections on hand).
I just don't know the feasibility of making those work and I really don't have enough of my own data to make an informed choice. So I need some assistance.
Not trying to steel anyone's thread here either. I this needs to be moved let me know.
Thx,
Kev
07-13-2012, 01:20 PM
#73
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I know this is a on going older thread. But the LS1GTO forum is going nowhere with this subject.
I have an 05 GTO. As you all may know, you can put a ton of band-aids on those 3 point GTO IRS systems. But in the end you still have the same issues. 1) your stuck to a certain wheel and tire width. 2) the gear selections for the diff sucks. 3) replacement parts cost out the rear end (pun intended!).
At first I was thinking of working in a Ford 8.8 Cobra IRS. I saw a killer install on the Trucks Rolling Thunder build. but then I ran across this thread and now I'm thinking C4 maybe even C5 (I have C5 parts and frame sections on hand).
I just don't know the feasibility of making those work and I really don't have enough of my own data to make an informed choice. So I need some assistance.
Not trying to steel anyone's thread here either. I this needs to be moved let me know.
Thx,
Kev
I have an 05 GTO. As you all may know, you can put a ton of band-aids on those 3 point GTO IRS systems. But in the end you still have the same issues. 1) your stuck to a certain wheel and tire width. 2) the gear selections for the diff sucks. 3) replacement parts cost out the rear end (pun intended!).
At first I was thinking of working in a Ford 8.8 Cobra IRS. I saw a killer install on the Trucks Rolling Thunder build. but then I ran across this thread and now I'm thinking C4 maybe even C5 (I have C5 parts and frame sections on hand).
I just don't know the feasibility of making those work and I really don't have enough of my own data to make an informed choice. So I need some assistance.
Not trying to steel anyone's thread here either. I this needs to be moved let me know.
Thx,
Kev
07-13-2012, 03:10 PM
#74
Honestly the only improvement from going from the stock Holden Monaro's V-body platform to the C4 platform would be weight savings. The changes in geometry function wouldn't be that beneficial if at all; to put it simply without going into detail. The C5 platform would be a huge improvement but I am not sure how the differential/transmission assembly will fit in the back on the GTO; I am unfamiliar with them. I know the C5 differential/transmission will fit just fine in the F-body as long as you don't want back seats anymore, and most wanting the conversion do not. To me though the C5 improvements would help out the GTO but it was never really a great track car to begin with because of its weight and size. On top of that it already has a decent IRS platform and this would make the conversion almost a dying cause to me. At least with the F-bodies you have a lighter car, easier to modify for the install, and your going from solid axle to IRS.
My issue is there are limitations on the OE 05 GTO suspension. Yes weight being one of the issues and room for wider tires. The C5 suspension will help in the weight department for starters. Other weight issues I’ll address as I get to them.
I'm really looking for some folks who can brain storm this with me. I tried to do this on the aforementioned site but they are like, “What’s wrong with the factory stuff?”. Really?.. Please!
07-14-2012, 12:02 PM
#75
Well... I vote "C5" if any swap at all. Its leaps and bounds better than the C4 suspension in all catagories except weight reductions.
If you think that you are up to the task of back-halfing the car and possibly cutting into the trans-tunnel/firewall, then Im all for it.
Other than weigh-reduction, I really cant seem to justify swapping in a C4 IRS into a GTO.
As far as feed-back, your in unknown territory so "brain-storming" probably wont yeild anything that hasnt already been discussed in this thread. The best thing to do is to just what the rest of us are doing. Tuck you ears and dive in head first. The ideas will come to you as you start cutting metal.
On another note, I finally got the control-arm brackets ordered. They should be here by Monday of next week. I hope that there is a metal supply house opened today. I want to start building the enforcement and boxing the Fuel cell.
If you think that you are up to the task of back-halfing the car and possibly cutting into the trans-tunnel/firewall, then Im all for it.
Other than weigh-reduction, I really cant seem to justify swapping in a C4 IRS into a GTO.
As far as feed-back, your in unknown territory so "brain-storming" probably wont yeild anything that hasnt already been discussed in this thread. The best thing to do is to just what the rest of us are doing. Tuck you ears and dive in head first. The ideas will come to you as you start cutting metal.
On another note, I finally got the control-arm brackets ordered. They should be here by Monday of next week. I hope that there is a metal supply house opened today. I want to start building the enforcement and boxing the Fuel cell.
07-14-2012, 09:38 PM
#76
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Well... I vote "C5" if any swap at all. Its leaps and bounds better than the C4 suspension in all catagories except weight reductions.
If you think that you are up to the task of back-halfing the car and possibly cutting into the trans-tunnel/firewall, then Im all for it.
Other than weigh-reduction, I really cant seem to justify swapping in a C4 IRS into a GTO.
As far as feed-back, your in unknown territory so "brain-storming" probably wont yeild anything that hasnt already been discussed in this thread. The best thing to do is to just what the rest of us are doing. Tuck you ears and dive in head first. The ideas will come to you as you start cutting metal.
If you think that you are up to the task of back-halfing the car and possibly cutting into the trans-tunnel/firewall, then Im all for it.
Other than weigh-reduction, I really cant seem to justify swapping in a C4 IRS into a GTO.
As far as feed-back, your in unknown territory so "brain-storming" probably wont yeild anything that hasnt already been discussed in this thread. The best thing to do is to just what the rest of us are doing. Tuck you ears and dive in head first. The ideas will come to you as you start cutting metal.
Good luck and I'll be watching for the updates!
07-28-2012, 08:43 AM
#77
"...Then there’s the exciter ring. The 98+ ABS/ASR(TCS) cars came with 47 tooth exciter rings, good news here is so did the 92+ Corvettes. If the car has a 53 tooth four channel ABS unit (97 and earlier) then new rings will need to be made. Costs will vary, but expect to pay around $300 to do so..."
My C4 rear-end is a 92 (not the 96 like I thought before) and Im guessing that I have the 47 tooth wheel?
Is this right?
(BTW... Im swapping a 4-channel abs system into my car)
07-28-2012, 09:05 AM
#78
However, the ABS system in the '96 Corvette (and some 95's) is a Bosch 5.0, and the sensors are pin compatible with the system in the 98+ F-body. '92 corvettes are electrically different.
Get the sensors that allow you to disconnect the corvette's wiring harness from the sensors themselves, and reuse the f-body wiring harness.
I was told to avoid cutting and splicing abs wires, or lengthening the cable by plugging in the corvette cable to the f-body harness, as the rely on a certain electrical signal to work reliably. The ABS (and traction control) works perfectly in my car, and I have panicked stopped and the ABS does work. Traction control works also, but as it always has from the day I bought the car in '02, it bugs me, so I usually turn it off.
Given what you're planning to do with the rear brakes though, I'm not sure I would keep that system. You might be better off with a prop valve.
Last edited by lees02WS6; 07-12-2017 at 09:46 PM.
07-28-2012, 01:46 PM
#79
I have a prop valve since I deleted the original 3-channel system.
I wanted to try swapping the 4-channel c4 network into the car.
Im not using TCS so i wont bother swapping the "engine retard" control module or feed a throttle position signal.
I just want ABS control to make the most pf the braking power on turns without locking.
At present, its all speculation as to whether or not the ABS will function normally without the TCS parts.
I wanted to try swapping the 4-channel c4 network into the car.
Im not using TCS so i wont bother swapping the "engine retard" control module or feed a throttle position signal.
I just want ABS control to make the most pf the braking power on turns without locking.
At present, its all speculation as to whether or not the ABS will function normally without the TCS parts.
