SuperSport01

If the front shocks are that bad a set of shocks from the parts store will suffice. I have just never seen shocks affect low speed handling that drastically.

SuperSport01

Its been awhile since ive been under one but IIRC the gap around your front lca bushing is normal. It is like that so the caster can be adjusted.

WhiteStallion00

iTrader: (1)

Thanx. I would think that shocks shouldn't have that drastic an effect at low speed, either, I certainly can't afford to make the wrong call (money-wise), but I don't know what else to do Is the scenario when I had stands under the frame and jacked up the ball-joint the right behavior? The LCA was all the way down, I jacked under the ball joint and the spring barely compressed at all before it lifted the chassis off the stand.

That doesn't seem right to me.

WhiteStallion00

iTrader: (1)

Crap...

I thought I put this in the first post, but I guess not. The bushings on all 4 corners squeak when it rocks. All the bushings in the rear (LCA and sway bar) were replaced in 2008 with Energy Suspension ones, along with the tranny mount and rear shocks. I didn't expect them to be squeaking already. but whatever. I have never torn anything off the front suspension for any reason - all stock parts still on the factory install.

With squeaking all over, I still can't find anything loose, but also wouldn't be able to tell if anything is binding.

All your suggestions are greatly appreciated.

eb110americana

iTrader: (4)

I doubt this is the problem, but with urethane bushings you need to grease them periodically or they will squeak. That's why they have the zerk fittings (little metal nipples) on them. I don't personally have experience with urethane bushings, so maybe someone else can chime in on the proper service interval for lubricating them. This is not hard to do at all, so I'd say get yourself a grease gun with the appropriate grease and see if that helps. Even if it doesn't, it won't be a waste since you need this service anyway.

joecar

Your front bushings are worn out, this allows the LCA's to move in a horizontal plane which allows toe to vary as you drive.

Until you get the bushings replaced, you can temporarily set a little more toe in to see if it drives better.

spook99maro

iTrader: (2)

Might not help but my car drove weird like floating on air. It squeeked when u got in and out as well. I could push the rear end down about an inch with my pinky lol. Turned out my rear shocks where blown. Drove like normal after replacing.

eb110americana

iTrader: (4)

He would be able to shake the tire back and forth when off the ground if this were true, but he can't. He says nothing is loose.

1ltcap

what you're describing almost sounds like a caster issue. either that, or something's loose somewhere.
i'd check all bushings, both front and rear suspensions, and get that alignment checked.

WhiteStallion00

iTrader: (1)

OK guys, you're telling me the things I kinda wanted to hear. I was struggling with it being shocks, especially after someone agreed they shouldn't have much of an impact at low speeds.

I also didn't lie to look of the bushings, but thought it could just be the boots worn out since I can't move anything. BUT, even when off the ground, the suspension is clearly still under load since a jack on the ball joint lifts the car instead of compressing the spring. I wouldn't be able to apply the amount of pressure on the suspension that the car can, so not being able to move anything wouldn't necessarily be proof nothing was loose.

Caster was my very first suspicion, the wheel turns too easy and it doesn't seem that the corners lift as much as they should when moving form lock to lock (yes, I know, not all the way to lock, just before). that will also help explain the sudden jerk once the weight shifts from corner to corner. I think this supports the bad bushings theory since there are times when it feels ok and times when I can't help but think she's trying to kill me (the name Christine has been mumbled a few times).

I don't have a press, but was able to replace the bushings in the rear LCAs using a big socket and hammer, so I'll try that on the fronts unless someone thinks it won't work.

Now for the strange part (as if we haven't already been there in this thread). I borrowed a friend's car to get to work today. She has a pos Ford ZX2. I got halfway down the road and realized that her car was doing almost the exact same thing as mine! Obviously not as severe since it's such a little car, but the same feeling of floating, sliding around corners and unreasonably snappy steering made me wonder for the briefest of moments if this whole thing wasn't just in my head. She claims she doesn't notice the drifting, wobbliness, etc and says the loud road noise is just one of those things about her car (you can almost tell it's dragging a tire sometimes by the noise it makes against the road. You can also feel the car getting bogged down for no apparent reason when changing speed, etc, again, just like mine is doing. On hers, though, it's pretty easy to prove the problem just my looking at the tires

LCA bushings tomorrow. we'll see how she likes that.

Thanx again, guys.

WhiteStallion00

iTrader: (1)

I remember looking before and not being able to find the right grease for the Energy Suspension bushings, in fact, I went to a couple of parts stores and asked for (I think I was looking for a silicone grease?) and no-one knew what I was talking about, they tried to sell me spark plug grease.

What exactly am I looking for to lubricate these bushings and what retail chain can i get it from?

WhiteStallion00

iTrader: (1)

Front suspension has been torn off. Rear (Caster) LCA bushings on both sides were worn and their housings were bent (I haven't gotten them out of the LCAs yet, but I don't think the arms are damaged, just the bushing housings). The UCA bushings on the driver side showed a lot of wear and were kinda weak compared to the passenger side (both are factory installed).

I think we all agree the shocks are trashed, I picked up a set of Monroes from Schucks (don't say it, that's the best I could do right now). Moog bushings going in all 4 arms tomorrow, provided I win the battle of evicting the old ones without a press (had no trouble with the rearend using a hammer and socket, but these are proving to be a bit more stubborn). I also forgot to pick up a spring compressor, so I'm dead in the water at the moment.

I'll report back once everything is installed and test driven. I think I can get the alignment close enough to tell if the problem has gone away. Everything else looked to be in great shape; no fractures, bends, etc, so there's basically nothing left on the frontend to blame except tires and I rotated those as one of the initial tests.

Thanx again for all the help, guys

1ltcap

yup. those will let your arms move more than enough to mess with your caster.

for the springs....do you have access to a normal floor jack? if so, you can let the arm hang down, position the spring in the part of the spring seat that faces inboard, then slowly, and VERY CAREFULLY jack the control arm up. DO NOT POSITION YOURSELF IN THE LINE OF FIRE WHILE DOING THIS in case the spring pops.

WhiteStallion00

iTrader: (1)

Going to Schucks in the morning to get a compressor, thanx for the suicide advise Got any advise about the bushings, I might consider putting myself in danger for that since I don't have an alternative. Doesn't seem these are going to to come out with a hammer and, believe it or not, I have a jawhorse and more clamps than I can use, so a vise hasn't been a priority, I don't have one (almost embarrassed to say that).

WhiteStallion00

iTrader: (1)

Also, what do you think bent the bushing housing?

VinR1

iTrader: (17)

While you're at the part store, rent the bushing c-clamp they have. It'll help

WhiteStallion00

iTrader: (1)

They said they didn't have one, but that just made me realize I DO have a good pulley puller I bet I could make work, thanx

joecar

You can't change the front shocks without a spring compressor.

eb110americana

iTrader: (4)

Glad you found the culprit. I do wonder about the shocks themselves, based on your description of things, if they are seized up somehow. The only thing I can think of that would cause that would be a bent shaft, but that seems very unlikely without some kind of accident. Usually when shocks fail, they go the other way and get soft. Anyway, the solution you came up with is a good one, and from what I hear, putting in a set of 1LE style Moog bushings is a very sensible upgrade for a street car suspension as it's the only way to avoid polyurethane, roto-joint, or spherical rod ends which all are harsher, noisier, and require more maintenance. I'll be using Moog bushings in my stock rear control arms to avoid binding when I change them out soon. I should probably do the same with my front suspension, which is on it's way to looking much like yours, but I like the idea of reduced unsprung weight and stiffer arms...but I'd still get rubber bushings if they offered them.

You mentioned at least once, that you were concerned that the whole thing was "just in your head," and I must admit for a moment there, I was wondering the same thing Glad to see that you found all your efforts were not in vain and now you can focus on a fix.

That seems odd to me too. The only thing I can think is that with the bushing so ripped apart, the collar just banged against the side of the bushing carrier. If the shock is really frozen, then this could have been the only place for the suspension to soak up the forces until the shock finally budged. Still, I hope that the torn bearing or the shocks are the cause and not a symptom of some other part seizing up or binding. Best of luck to you!

1ltcap

it might save you a LOT of time, agony, and frustration, to take the control arms to a local shop, and pay them to press them out/in. most should'nt charge you any more than an hours labor to do them all.