"School me" on handling.
"School me" on handling. Guys,
I'd appreciate any help offered. I'm wanting to spend around $700+/- to turn my 99 z28 into a SOLID handling car and still decent at the track.
I don't need, nor expect it to be able to handle like an RX-7 or Porsche or something, but again - just something solid.
Where do I start? I've spent a lot of time reading & studying this, but it's kind of overwhelming.
Do I need springs, coil overs, what?
For starters, I know that I need some subframe connectors.
Thanks for any help/recommendations.
I'd appreciate any help offered. I'm wanting to spend around $700+/- to turn my 99 z28 into a SOLID handling car and still decent at the track.
I don't need, nor expect it to be able to handle like an RX-7 or Porsche or something, but again - just something solid.
Where do I start? I've spent a lot of time reading & studying this, but it's kind of overwhelming.
Do I need springs, coil overs, what?
For starters, I know that I need some subframe connectors.
Thanks for any help/recommendations.
You will need springs shocks etc.
I like the Hal QA1 coil overs, my car handles like its on a rail.
Lower control arms will help, as well as a panhard bar, and some poly urethan bushings, sway bar, anti roll bar. Lowering the car also makes a big improvment in itself.
I like the Hal QA1 coil overs, my car handles like its on a rail.
Lower control arms will help, as well as a panhard bar, and some poly urethan bushings, sway bar, anti roll bar. Lowering the car also makes a big improvment in itself.
On The Tree
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 109
Likes: 0
From: Land O' Lakes, FL
In decreasing order of importance, these are the mods that will improve your handling, IMHO:
- Tires --- sticky tires make all the difference
- Shocks
- Sway bars
- Springs
- PHB --- important if you are lowered to re-center the rear, not so important if you are at stock ride height
LCAs may help with wheel hop on the launch, but unless you are a very hardcore road-racer/auto-Xer, you probably won't notice the difference in flex in the ends under regular or slightly sprited driving conditions.
Also IMO, SFCs should be one of your last chassis mods. Why do you think you need SFCs, if I can ask? Do you actually feel your chassis flexing (I doubt it), or you want to do it first because that is what you read on the forums? Do a search on here and you will see some interesting reading on why SFCs may not be that important...
If I had $700 to spend, I would get a set of Koni Single-Adjustables for the front and Bilstein HDs for the rear, and a 35 mm front sway bar (this would be slightly more than $700, maybe around $800). Koni SAs will let you lower the car a little by using the lower mounting position, and you can lower the rear slightly by removing the rubber isolator and using a heater-hose instead. Bilstein HDs won't be ideal for this (since you will be slightly lowered), but they should be OK. For the drag strip, you can set the front shocks to full-soft also (although I don't know how well Konis work at the strip). I find the stock springs to be OK for handling, so to me they are not high on the list of necessary mods, but would be if again you were serious about handling (i.e. road-race, auto-X). Just my two cents. Good luck.
- Tires --- sticky tires make all the difference
- Shocks
- Sway bars
- Springs
- PHB --- important if you are lowered to re-center the rear, not so important if you are at stock ride height
LCAs may help with wheel hop on the launch, but unless you are a very hardcore road-racer/auto-Xer, you probably won't notice the difference in flex in the ends under regular or slightly sprited driving conditions.
Also IMO, SFCs should be one of your last chassis mods. Why do you think you need SFCs, if I can ask? Do you actually feel your chassis flexing (I doubt it), or you want to do it first because that is what you read on the forums? Do a search on here and you will see some interesting reading on why SFCs may not be that important...
If I had $700 to spend, I would get a set of Koni Single-Adjustables for the front and Bilstein HDs for the rear, and a 35 mm front sway bar (this would be slightly more than $700, maybe around $800). Koni SAs will let you lower the car a little by using the lower mounting position, and you can lower the rear slightly by removing the rubber isolator and using a heater-hose instead. Bilstein HDs won't be ideal for this (since you will be slightly lowered), but they should be OK. For the drag strip, you can set the front shocks to full-soft also (although I don't know how well Konis work at the strip). I find the stock springs to be OK for handling, so to me they are not high on the list of necessary mods, but would be if again you were serious about handling (i.e. road-race, auto-X). Just my two cents. Good luck.
Last edited by fa63; Mar 31, 2006 at 06:48 AM.
Originally Posted by fa63
If I had $700 to spend, I would get a set of Koni Single-Adjustables for the front and Bilstein HDs for the rear, and a 35 mm front sway bar (this would be slightly more than $700, maybe around $800). Koni SAs will let you lower the car a little by using the lower mounting position, and you can lower the rear slightly by removing the rubber isolator and using a heater-hose instead. Bilstein HDs won't be ideal for this (since you will be slightly lowered), but they should be OK. For the drag strip, you can set the front shocks to full-soft also (although I don't know how well Konis work at the strip). I find the stock springs to be OK for handling, so to me they are not high on the list of necessary mods, but would be if again you were serious about handling (i.e. road-race, auto-X). Just my two cents. Good luck.
Though, I'd switch the rear Bilstiens to "30 series" Koni's (3rd gen rear Koni's) to save a bit of money. Then, see if you can still get a 35mm front sway bar into your budget. Keep the stock springs and have your alignment "tweeked" for better performance. You'll see huge gains from this swap. Later, add a good PHB.
I would have the sub frame connectors be the first mod you do, you are driving a car that has a sub frame. Anytime you nail it the torque of the motor goes through the drivtrain and the car twists. Do this a few times and look at your rear quarter panels.
My car was completly bone stock, and I started to getdimples and creases in the rear quarters from flex.
They should be the first thing you do to tie the frame together.
My car was completly bone stock, and I started to getdimples and creases in the rear quarters from flex.
They should be the first thing you do to tie the frame together.
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On The Tree
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 109
Likes: 0
From: Land O' Lakes, FL
I have 100K+ on all three of my Camaros and none of them have "dimples and creases" in the rear quarter panels, and none of them have SFCs on them. Do you really think that GM would put the car on the market knowing that the rear quarter panels will start deforming anytime you nail the gas? You would have to be making a LOT of horsepower and hooking dead on at the track to get the chassis to twist considerably.
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I have 2 camaros. One a 96 V6 and it has 1LE springs/shocks/sways(with poly bushings/endlinks)/single rod tubular LCAs. The other a 2000Z with KB DD SFC & STB. I have to say the 2000Z feels much better then my 96 did when it was stock. It almost feels like it has bigger sway bars. I can't wait to put Bilstein HDs and sway bars on the Z.
I'm not calling anybody a liar, nor ever will, however I think that those who have the dimples could help others by setting up some sort of "webshots" page and taking some detailed pics of those dimples, then providing a link. A lot of people have mentioned the dimpling, but have not provided an easily accessible link to the dimple pics.
I can easily understand the possibility of forming with high HP drag racing and/or using springs like "sportlines" with stock decarbons and weighing down the rear with loads of stereo equipment, but mine has seen lots of hard drving and I can't find those dimples. I even used sophisticated strain guages to analyse what's happening with the rear panels with my current setup, and setups that are streetable and much more affordable and there is practically no loads that can deform the panels from AX and DD alone, even with hard AX and DD. I'd also like to note that the area of much greater flexibility is really in the central floorpan area between the subframes and not at the rear subframe itself, which is where the quarter panels are behind anyhow. Even the central floorpan is tough enough for what I have right now and I am far from easy on that street car on the webshots page.
I have mine posted from my street Z28 that has seen plenty of AX and open tracking and it has yet to develop any of the dimples (odom is under the actual 150K).
Now for the thread starter, I would like to see if I can clarify what exactly are your trying to do with the vehicle other than just "road and track." What type of track competition are you trying to do? AX, RR, maybe a little of both? I am asking this objectively in order to achieve much more realistic expectations from those who read the threads.
I can easily understand the possibility of forming with high HP drag racing and/or using springs like "sportlines" with stock decarbons and weighing down the rear with loads of stereo equipment, but mine has seen lots of hard drving and I can't find those dimples. I even used sophisticated strain guages to analyse what's happening with the rear panels with my current setup, and setups that are streetable and much more affordable and there is practically no loads that can deform the panels from AX and DD alone, even with hard AX and DD. I'd also like to note that the area of much greater flexibility is really in the central floorpan area between the subframes and not at the rear subframe itself, which is where the quarter panels are behind anyhow. Even the central floorpan is tough enough for what I have right now and I am far from easy on that street car on the webshots page.
I have mine posted from my street Z28 that has seen plenty of AX and open tracking and it has yet to develop any of the dimples (odom is under the actual 150K).
Now for the thread starter, I would like to see if I can clarify what exactly are your trying to do with the vehicle other than just "road and track." What type of track competition are you trying to do? AX, RR, maybe a little of both? I am asking this objectively in order to achieve much more realistic expectations from those who read the threads.