Subframe Connectors - Overhyped or worth it?
04-30-2006, 09:35 PM
#21
Got a buddy with T-Tops on his z28 he runs 10.9's WITHOUT SFCS......But then again I know another guy who runes high 11's maybe low 12's. And cracked his windshield due to not having them... Id say 50/50 people say it handles much better and theyre not that expensive so hell I dont see why not put em on.
04-30-2006, 09:56 PM
#23
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....also get BOXED SFC's...not round tube....better for lifting car and boxed anything is stronger than a small tube. 
04-30-2006, 10:37 PM
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I would never have a F Body without them.. I have some that are like the SLP boxed double diamond type, bought them from a guy that used to make them on here(spectacle solutions). Before the SFC's my car would travel on the highway bad enough to be dangerous and after I have had zero problems. No rattles at all and can feel a huge difference in flex on the highway when hitting dips and uneven road surfaces, before the SFC's the car felt like it was twisting.
04-30-2006, 11:04 PM
#25
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well i ordered BMR SFC and i have heard nothing but priase from everyone that HAS them...mine are in the garage waiting for install
also i have a vert
and in that case it is a MUST and there is no better value then spending the money to make the Frame of the car last you can replace everything else in the car but it all strats from the frame and you cant have it bent or cracked on it
-Josh
also i have a vert
and in that case it is a MUST and there is no better value then spending the money to make the Frame of the car last you can replace everything else in the car but it all strats from the frame and you cant have it bent or cracked on it-Josh
05-01-2006, 10:54 AM
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Overhyped or worth it for *what appplication* (of the vehicle)?
Drag racing with lots of power and sticky tires? Yes, worth it.
Daily driving? Just extra weight - overhyped.
Auto-X, RR in a street car? Just extra weight - overhyped.
The noises heard are the interior bits being shaken on their mountings and flexing because they are cheap material, from the shockwaves transmitted to the cabin from the crap stock shocks.
The body does flex - but then, the C6R flexes too. All cars have a torsional stiffness measurment, nothing is inflexible. However, these cars do not flex enough to have it cause the problems people cite, nor enough to slow the car down on a course.
That said, it's hard for a car to ever be "too stiff", and they do give piece of mind for that reason, so they aren't a waste of money per se - unless it bumps you into a higher class than you can compete in.
Many people do "notice a difference". But then, sugar pills work on many people too.
I still have the crap stock shocks unfortunately, but I did get SLP SFCs installed (because I am paranoid about metal fatigue and want the car to last for 100 years or so lol), and I found NO difference at all. My driveway is on an angle, and I have to turn to go in or out. My 84 T-Top T/A always twisted, I could hear the ice in the tops break. My 02 doesn't. And all the noises that were there before, are still there - because the shock is transmitted to loose parts that rattle against one another. Cheap interior, not weak frame.
Drag racing with lots of power and sticky tires? Yes, worth it.
Daily driving? Just extra weight - overhyped.
Auto-X, RR in a street car? Just extra weight - overhyped.
The noises heard are the interior bits being shaken on their mountings and flexing because they are cheap material, from the shockwaves transmitted to the cabin from the crap stock shocks.
The body does flex - but then, the C6R flexes too. All cars have a torsional stiffness measurment, nothing is inflexible. However, these cars do not flex enough to have it cause the problems people cite, nor enough to slow the car down on a course.
That said, it's hard for a car to ever be "too stiff", and they do give piece of mind for that reason, so they aren't a waste of money per se - unless it bumps you into a higher class than you can compete in.
Many people do "notice a difference". But then, sugar pills work on many people too.
I still have the crap stock shocks unfortunately, but I did get SLP SFCs installed (because I am paranoid about metal fatigue and want the car to last for 100 years or so lol), and I found NO difference at all. My driveway is on an angle, and I have to turn to go in or out. My 84 T-Top T/A always twisted, I could hear the ice in the tops break. My 02 doesn't. And all the noises that were there before, are still there - because the shock is transmitted to loose parts that rattle against one another. Cheap interior, not weak frame.
05-01-2006, 11:03 AM
#28
Good post HPP.
They are not MANDATORY, at all. Are they a bad idea? No. I sell them (various brands) and I wouldn't if they were useless. However, they are used too soon and for the wrong reasons. They should NEVER be on the top of the list on any car that's not a really high HP drag car on sticky tires. Notice I said on the TOP of list, they are on the list but further down, meaning AFTER other things that are much more pressing.
People..... just look at the responses. Some say madatory. Some say no difference. Ever seen somone put good shocks on the car and not all agree that it was a move for the better? Didn't think so.
You want SFC's? Call me, I'll sell them to you for a good price. But I won't do it happily if there are bigger fish to fry first, and I'll tell you that.
They are not MANDATORY, at all. Are they a bad idea? No. I sell them (various brands) and I wouldn't if they were useless. However, they are used too soon and for the wrong reasons. They should NEVER be on the top of the list on any car that's not a really high HP drag car on sticky tires. Notice I said on the TOP of list, they are on the list but further down, meaning AFTER other things that are much more pressing.
People..... just look at the responses. Some say madatory. Some say no difference. Ever seen somone put good shocks on the car and not all agree that it was a move for the better? Didn't think so.
You want SFC's? Call me, I'll sell them to you for a good price. But I won't do it happily if there are bigger fish to fry first, and I'll tell you that.
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Results matter. Talk is cheap. We are miles beyond the success anyone else has had with the 4th gens, and C5, C6, C7 Corvettes,
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13 SCCA Pro Solo Nationals Championships
2023 UMI King of the Mountain Champion
05-01-2006, 05:28 PM
#29
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Originally Posted by Sam Strano
Good post HPP.
They are not MANDATORY, at all. Are they a bad idea? No. I sell them (various brands) and I wouldn't if they were useless. However, they are used too soon and for the wrong reasons. They should NEVER be on the top of the list on any car that's not a really high HP drag car on sticky tires. Notice I said on the TOP of list, they are on the list but further down, meaning AFTER other things that are much more pressing.
People..... just look at the responses. Some say madatory. Some say no difference. Ever seen somone put good shocks on the car and not all agree that it was a move for the better? Didn't think so.
You want SFC's? Call me, I'll sell them to you for a good price. But I won't do it happily if there are bigger fish to fry first, and I'll tell you that.
They are not MANDATORY, at all. Are they a bad idea? No. I sell them (various brands) and I wouldn't if they were useless. However, they are used too soon and for the wrong reasons. They should NEVER be on the top of the list on any car that's not a really high HP drag car on sticky tires. Notice I said on the TOP of list, they are on the list but further down, meaning AFTER other things that are much more pressing.
People..... just look at the responses. Some say madatory. Some say no difference. Ever seen somone put good shocks on the car and not all agree that it was a move for the better? Didn't think so.
You want SFC's? Call me, I'll sell them to you for a good price. But I won't do it happily if there are bigger fish to fry first, and I'll tell you that.
---they reduce FLEX a hell of alot. F-Body's without them are NO fun to drive. Unless you like a loose feeling car.. 
Along with other suspension pieces the car is greatly improved.
05-01-2006, 05:49 PM
#30
Be suprised.....
All the stuff in your sig, and no shocks. Car was designed as a convertible to start with, and is NOT A FLEXY FLYER. However stock shocks allow impacts to get into the body that should not and DO NOT with quality dampers. In those cases SFC's "help" because they don't let the chassis quiver as much. But the way I see it, those things should have been stopped long before they got to the chassis.
F-bodies without them are no fun to drive.... Funny I've always had fun in my car and others without them. Cars without them have won every SCCA F-Stock and ESP autocross championship in history (3 of which are mine, and even more are cars I setup). There are also cars with over 350k miles of abuse on them, sans SFC's and aren't rattle traps.
I sell them. I'm sick and tired of hearing how they are required. NOTHING IN THE WORLD IS REQUIRED, and I've got plenty of proof that cars will last, handle and not fall apart without them.
All the stuff in your sig, and no shocks. Car was designed as a convertible to start with, and is NOT A FLEXY FLYER. However stock shocks allow impacts to get into the body that should not and DO NOT with quality dampers. In those cases SFC's "help" because they don't let the chassis quiver as much. But the way I see it, those things should have been stopped long before they got to the chassis.
F-bodies without them are no fun to drive.... Funny I've always had fun in my car and others without them. Cars without them have won every SCCA F-Stock and ESP autocross championship in history (3 of which are mine, and even more are cars I setup). There are also cars with over 350k miles of abuse on them, sans SFC's and aren't rattle traps.
I sell them. I'm sick and tired of hearing how they are required. NOTHING IN THE WORLD IS REQUIRED, and I've got plenty of proof that cars will last, handle and not fall apart without them.
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Results matter. Talk is cheap. We are miles beyond the success anyone else has had with the 4th gens, and C5, C6, C7 Corvettes,
10 SCCA Solo National Championships, 2008 Driver of they Year, 2012 Driver of Eminence
13 SCCA Pro Solo Nationals Championships
2023 UMI King of the Mountain Champion
www.stranoparts.com --814-849-3450
Results matter. Talk is cheap. We are miles beyond the success anyone else has had with the 4th gens, and C5, C6, C7 Corvettes,
10 SCCA Solo National Championships, 2008 Driver of they Year, 2012 Driver of Eminence
13 SCCA Pro Solo Nationals Championships
2023 UMI King of the Mountain Champion
05-01-2006, 07:17 PM
#32
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Originally Posted by Sam Strano
Be suprised.....
All the stuff in your sig, and no shocks. Car was designed as a convertible to start with, and is NOT A FLEXY FLYER. However stock shocks allow impacts to get into the body that should not and DO NOT with quality dampers. In those cases SFC's "help" because they don't let the chassis quiver as much. But the way I see it, those things should have been stopped long before they got to the chassis.
F-bodies without them are no fun to drive.... Funny I've always had fun in my car and others without them. Cars without them have won every SCCA F-Stock and ESP autocross championship in history (3 of which are mine, and even more are cars I setup). There are also cars with over 350k miles of abuse on them, sans SFC's and aren't rattle traps.
I sell them. I'm sick and tired of hearing how they are required. NOTHING IN THE WORLD IS REQUIRED, and I've got plenty of proof that cars will last, handle and not fall apart without them.
All the stuff in your sig, and no shocks. Car was designed as a convertible to start with, and is NOT A FLEXY FLYER. However stock shocks allow impacts to get into the body that should not and DO NOT with quality dampers. In those cases SFC's "help" because they don't let the chassis quiver as much. But the way I see it, those things should have been stopped long before they got to the chassis.
F-bodies without them are no fun to drive.... Funny I've always had fun in my car and others without them. Cars without them have won every SCCA F-Stock and ESP autocross championship in history (3 of which are mine, and even more are cars I setup). There are also cars with over 350k miles of abuse on them, sans SFC's and aren't rattle traps.
I sell them. I'm sick and tired of hearing how they are required. NOTHING IN THE WORLD IS REQUIRED, and I've got plenty of proof that cars will last, handle and not fall apart without them.
350k MILES and not rattle traps and no sfc's...hmmmm. 
wow. 
05-01-2006, 07:41 PM
#33
Ah, Monroe.... so you don't really have any shocks worth a damn. Explains a lot. And the car with 350k miles, belongs to a friend of mine and has been autoxed, drag raced taken to track events since new ('96 1LE), even trophied at Solo2 Nationals a couple of times.
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Results matter. Talk is cheap. We are miles beyond the success anyone else has had with the 4th gens, and C5, C6, C7 Corvettes,
10 SCCA Solo National Championships, 2008 Driver of they Year, 2012 Driver of Eminence
13 SCCA Pro Solo Nationals Championships
2023 UMI King of the Mountain Champion
www.stranoparts.com --814-849-3450
Results matter. Talk is cheap. We are miles beyond the success anyone else has had with the 4th gens, and C5, C6, C7 Corvettes,
10 SCCA Solo National Championships, 2008 Driver of they Year, 2012 Driver of Eminence
13 SCCA Pro Solo Nationals Championships
2023 UMI King of the Mountain Champion
05-01-2006, 08:15 PM
#35
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Originally Posted by Sam Strano
Ah, Monroe.... so you don't really have any shocks worth a damn. Explains a lot. And the car with 350k miles, belongs to a friend of mine and has been autoxed, drag raced taken to track events since new ('96 1LE), even trophied at Solo2 Nationals a couple of times.
05-01-2006, 08:21 PM
#37
not being pissy, being truthful. I won a National championship in 2002 in an 1982 Z28 that doesn't to this DAY have SFC's.
I'm sorry it my disagreement and making my point come across as rude. But I'm sick and tired of these statements of absolution. You MUST have this, you have to do that. You have lousy shocks, and my guess is you had worse shocks (stock) when you installed your SFC's. I have no doubt you saw a difference, but you all act like we are driving tin foil down the road and it's just not true.
The car in question is all stock. A new set of Koni's went on around 200k miles, it's on it's 3rd clutch and 2nd k-member (stock GM one broke, but the body didn't). OE springs, some new bushings and such...
I'm sorry it my disagreement and making my point come across as rude. But I'm sick and tired of these statements of absolution. You MUST have this, you have to do that. You have lousy shocks, and my guess is you had worse shocks (stock) when you installed your SFC's. I have no doubt you saw a difference, but you all act like we are driving tin foil down the road and it's just not true.
The car in question is all stock. A new set of Koni's went on around 200k miles, it's on it's 3rd clutch and 2nd k-member (stock GM one broke, but the body didn't). OE springs, some new bushings and such...
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www.stranoparts.com --814-849-3450
Results matter. Talk is cheap. We are miles beyond the success anyone else has had with the 4th gens, and C5, C6, C7 Corvettes,
10 SCCA Solo National Championships, 2008 Driver of they Year, 2012 Driver of Eminence
13 SCCA Pro Solo Nationals Championships
2023 UMI King of the Mountain Champion
www.stranoparts.com --814-849-3450
Results matter. Talk is cheap. We are miles beyond the success anyone else has had with the 4th gens, and C5, C6, C7 Corvettes,
10 SCCA Solo National Championships, 2008 Driver of they Year, 2012 Driver of Eminence
13 SCCA Pro Solo Nationals Championships
2023 UMI King of the Mountain Champion
05-01-2006, 08:24 PM
#38
I give up. EVERYONE NEEDS THEM. Call me, I'll sell you all you want. Screw honesty, just gets me a bunch of crap.
UMI, SLP, Hotchkis, Edelbrock, Competition Engineering.... what kind do you want?
UMI, SLP, Hotchkis, Edelbrock, Competition Engineering.... what kind do you want?
__________________
www.stranoparts.com --814-849-3450
Results matter. Talk is cheap. We are miles beyond the success anyone else has had with the 4th gens, and C5, C6, C7 Corvettes,
10 SCCA Solo National Championships, 2008 Driver of they Year, 2012 Driver of Eminence
13 SCCA Pro Solo Nationals Championships
2023 UMI King of the Mountain Champion
www.stranoparts.com --814-849-3450
Results matter. Talk is cheap. We are miles beyond the success anyone else has had with the 4th gens, and C5, C6, C7 Corvettes,
10 SCCA Solo National Championships, 2008 Driver of they Year, 2012 Driver of Eminence
13 SCCA Pro Solo Nationals Championships
2023 UMI King of the Mountain Champion
05-01-2006, 08:26 PM
#39
Originally Posted by Abidar
I had a wreck over the summer and my car "would have accordianed" and been totalled if I didn't have them.
BTW, how do you "know" that the car would have been totalled anyway? You don't. And frankly if it were hit that hard, I'd prefered it have been totalled. MHO
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www.stranoparts.com --814-849-3450
Results matter. Talk is cheap. We are miles beyond the success anyone else has had with the 4th gens, and C5, C6, C7 Corvettes,
10 SCCA Solo National Championships, 2008 Driver of they Year, 2012 Driver of Eminence
13 SCCA Pro Solo Nationals Championships
2023 UMI King of the Mountain Champion
www.stranoparts.com --814-849-3450
Results matter. Talk is cheap. We are miles beyond the success anyone else has had with the 4th gens, and C5, C6, C7 Corvettes,
10 SCCA Solo National Championships, 2008 Driver of they Year, 2012 Driver of Eminence
13 SCCA Pro Solo Nationals Championships
2023 UMI King of the Mountain Champion
05-01-2006, 10:09 PM
#40
Get em Strano!!!!, Steve is a awsome guy and does nothing but help this site. He is always stating the truth; something that is lacking in the world of internet mechanics and engineers. Alot of you dont want to hear that, some even disagree. Regardless of you opnion of him or his thougts he is still trying to help you. Remember that machine shop guy that always told you it is a waste of time to build 305's, remember that...we were all pissy and said f-u i'll show you. Some of us did build stout 305's, some tried and got pissed and quit, some kept building (with a bigger engine) and are alot happier. The point is; he is trying to help.
Does anyone wanna see a ls1 get sold because a know it all spent all their money on a "money pit", no we dont.
I dont know how many of you guys have ordered stuff from him but it should be more. He lives in a region of the country where roads suck and rust kills. If it isnt apparent that he knows his stuff from reading these post I urge you to order something from him. Hell you could even order the sub-frame connectors from him. www.stranoparts.com When you talk to him or his staff you will realize the knowledge they have. And the genuine interest he has. Look at his cars...
He sells suspension; stuff that last longer than the car. How many cam companies owners or reps do you discuss topics with on a day to day basis here at ls1tech How about header companies? Those are probably the two most discussed topics. They are probably the performance parts replaced with the highest frequency!
Point is he doesnt make money of of selling lowering springs and struts over and over. He makes it by people like me that bought one shipment from a guy that offered real world, honest, accurate, researched advice.
I will never buy suspension parts from anyone else. It is like going to Wal-mart to talk with the lady behind the audio/tv/computer/video game counter a indepth question about hard drive refernce speed, or going to a computer store and asking the geek squad.
In summary Steve is just trying to help and give his honest opnion. We need more people like him.
Order from him....it is worth the cost for excellent customer service and product knowledge.
Jimmy Nadeau
Does anyone wanna see a ls1 get sold because a know it all spent all their money on a "money pit", no we dont.
I dont know how many of you guys have ordered stuff from him but it should be more. He lives in a region of the country where roads suck and rust kills. If it isnt apparent that he knows his stuff from reading these post I urge you to order something from him. Hell you could even order the sub-frame connectors from him. www.stranoparts.com When you talk to him or his staff you will realize the knowledge they have. And the genuine interest he has. Look at his cars...
He sells suspension; stuff that last longer than the car. How many cam companies owners or reps do you discuss topics with on a day to day basis here at ls1tech How about header companies? Those are probably the two most discussed topics. They are probably the performance parts replaced with the highest frequency!Point is he doesnt make money of of selling lowering springs and struts over and over. He makes it by people like me that bought one shipment from a guy that offered real world, honest, accurate, researched advice.
I will never buy suspension parts from anyone else. It is like going to Wal-mart to talk with the lady behind the audio/tv/computer/video game counter a indepth question about hard drive refernce speed, or going to a computer store and asking the geek squad.
In summary Steve is just trying to help and give his honest opnion. We need more people like him.
Order from him....it is worth the cost for excellent customer service and product knowledge.
Jimmy Nadeau