subtlez28

iTrader: (15)

How many of you guys (or gals) R running these Global West tubular upper control arms? Does it make a big difference? R they worth $300? R U happy w del-a-lum bushings?

Link: http://www.globalwest.net/camaro93.h...ol%20arm%20kit

My set-up is in sig.

I plan to add Strano's Springs soon. Will the 1.2" drop make these more necessary to get negative camber?

I set my Camber -1.5 / Castor +4.5 / Zero toe.

I do mostly high speed auto cross, but do not care about points...I just want the best handling street car w/in reason. I run in a pretty flexible class.

Any other input on my combo is welcome!

And b4 U say it...I do intend to call Sam!!

Thanks

RAMPANT

iTrader: (17)

I have them and gained lots of extra adjustment in the front end.

They improved the car, but it is difficult to quantify, since I think my driving was improving at the same time.

Alignment went from 1.0 camber and 3.0 caster to 1.6 camber and 4.5 caster at a stock ride height. The Del alum seems fine, not clunks or rattles, but it was stiff when tightened down, not as free moving as I anticipated. It might be broken in a little now though.

Ironhead

Sam's offset bushings are cheaper.

I had the delrin GW arms. I removed them so I could go back to my stock arms with the offset bushings.

*EDIT* to add LINK

subtlez28

iTrader: (15)

I've read about the offset bushings, but y do you think they r better?
Is it just a points issue? Because again, that is not an issue to me.

As a side note what camber and caster r u running?

Ironhead

Well...define better.

1) They're cheaper than aftermarket arms.
2) They don't increase caster like the GW arms. (not everybody wants to increase their caster)
3) They still get you the camber you're after.

For me, yes, it was a classing issue. I wanted to drop back to ESP.

I've not had the car aligned since the bushing install (set the toe myself) so I have no idea how much caster I have. Somewhere near stock I imagine.

I did borrow a handheld gauge from work and found the car to have at least -1.5° camber per side, maybe a touch more. Keep in mind that this is an LT1 car that can't get as much camber as your LS1 car can get stock for stock.

I know a fellow racer who installed these bushings on his LS1 car. He did get an alignment and reported they were good for a bit more than 0.5°. So whatever you can get stock, add at least another 1/2 degree.

*shrug* I'm happy with the bushings and just thought I'd mention them as an option to aftermarket arms.

JimMueller

iTrader: (9)

I've had the GW del-a-lum UCA's for a a couple years. They were running a special at the time for $269. The nuts/bolts tend to damage the seal regardless which way the bolt is oriented, but my max camber is was -2.25 at stock ride height, no noise whatsoever from the arms.

I believe the offset bushings are designed to give camber flexibility without throwing you into a more competitive class and/or add points (which non-stock UCA's would do in some organizations). Last I checked they cost $175/set.

To replace just the stock bushings (offset or not) you need to melt out the stockers and press in the new pieces. The only other UCA I would have considered is LG Motorsports rod-end adjustables. I didn't buy those because a) the price, b) rod-end noise.

Check out these threads for more info...

http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/index.p...7932&hl=offset

http://www.frrax.com/rrforum/index.p...offset+bushing

subtlez28

iTrader: (15)

Yeah, I know words like better and best can be problematic.

I just want to know the advantages. From what I've read on FRRAX the main advantage of offset bushings are: 1. Cost 2. Points 3. The stock UCA is lighter?
Advantage GW UCA: 1. Easier install (no burning bushings) 2. More pos caster

Again, points are a non issue to me.

I can wrap my head around why neg camber is good, but do not understand caster's role in handling. Can anyone point out if more than +4.5 caster would help, or not, and y?

RAMPANT

iTrader: (17)

Here is a little article that may help.

http://www.tirerack.com/tires-techpage-1/4.shtml

Our cars are way over powered in the power steering department. The first time I drove it at a road coarse I thought I was driving an old Fleetwood! I have done the GW upper arms and a Turn One pump and still has more than enough PS pump in a tight parking lot on R componds.

I also have a Magnum as a DD and when I read the alignement specs I was blown away. It is spec'd at 9.5deg stock. The Europeans seem to design tons into their cars. Very stable at speed and improves tight feel and handling.

Ironhead

Oversimplified.....

More caster = more stabilty at speed, works the PS pump harder, less nimble. Think of a raked out chopper.

Less caster = less stability at speed, easier on the pump, more nimble. Think of a sport bike.

With all that said, my car is perfectly stable at speeds of 100+ mph with almost 1/4" toe out and near stock caster. In theory though, more caster = more stable.

JimMueller

iTrader: (9)

In addition, a little more positive caster will add a little dynamic negative camber in turns. I typically use +5 caster, -1.6 camber, and 3/32 total toe out. My PS pump groaned a lot when I had it at more than +5.5 caster.

subtlez28

iTrader: (15)

Thanks guys 4 the links, advise and simplified info.
I like simple!
Any one else?
Sam?
Mitchntx?
Come on road racers...help a brother out!

subtlez28

iTrader: (15)

Hate 2 do this, but...
ttt

slick1851

I never really see alot of people using it, doesnt mean its bad.....Just not common I suppose.

01badz28

iTrader: (5)

Back from the dead. Are these still being sold - they don't seem to be listed on their website at the moment.

shoemike

iTrader: (25)

they still sell them and they are well worth the $$.
get them and the lower a arm kit as well.

trackbird

iTrader: (4)

Well, I'm none of the guys listed above, but I'll toss in my $.02.

I ran them, I loved them and I only pulled them off of my car because I was selling it. I ran -1.7 camber (my car would go from -1.0 to -2.9 camber with the arms and with a 26.5" front ride height to the fender) and 5.2 castor (my car would go from 5.2 to almost 9 degrees of castor).

The bushings will work and if you're looking for ESP, I'd go with them. If you have no rules to worry about, I'd just buy the GW arms. I was extremely happy with mine.

subtlez28

iTrader: (15)

In my defense you do fall into the "anyone else" and "road racer" groups!
Plus I duplicate posted it on FRAXX, where I believe you chimed in.

Have you sold your GW arms?

I'm getting my strano springs on soon, I'll see how much neg camber I get as is. May end up going w them later.