Modifying Your Front Upper Shock Mount
10-31-2008, 11:37 PM
#41
Do you know if the threaded sleeve will work on other shocks like the Ground Control units do?
Do the lower mounts seperate from the shock rod?
I'm thinking about switching to them, but using an air spring. I think I know how to mount it. Plus I believe the IAS shock body is shorter which I like.
Thanks
Last edited by JasonWW; 10-31-2008 at 11:43 PM.
11-01-2008, 12:46 AM
#42
Do you have any pics of your IAS shocks?
Do you know if the threaded sleeve will work on other shocks like the Ground Control units do?
Do the lower mounts seperate from the shock rod?
I'm thinking about switching to them, but using an air spring. I think I know how to mount it. Plus I believe the IAS shock body is shorter which I like.
Thanks
Do you know if the threaded sleeve will work on other shocks like the Ground Control units do?
Do the lower mounts seperate from the shock rod?
I'm thinking about switching to them, but using an air spring. I think I know how to mount it. Plus I believe the IAS shock body is shorter which I like.
Thanks
I took mine apart the day before I installed them(I replaced the 550lb. eibach springs with Hypercoil 600 lb springs). The threaded sleeve looks very similar to the GroundControl sleeves and mounts just like the GC sleeves.
The IAS sleeves should work on other shocks, I 'll just have to measure the shock body diameter first to make sure it's 2" dia.. I'll do that tomorrow .
They do look like they separate, there's a jam nut threaded on the rod end. but I didn't even have to mess with that to remove the spring, so I'm not 100% sure. All I did was loosen the adj. spring seat all the way, then slide the sleeve down the shock body far enough to fully expose the snap ring in the shock grove. Then pop it out of the grove ,slide it off the shock body, followed by the adj.sleeve and then the spring.
I'll take some pictures, and measure the shock body diameter tomorrow, along with taking another look at the lower mount.
Last edited by 99Bluz28; 11-01-2008 at 01:22 AM.
11-01-2008, 02:28 AM
#43
Cool, thanks.
So it came with a 550 and not a 600? I thought 600 was stock.
If the sleeves fit other shocks, I'll sell them, the springs and the hat to recover some of the cost of these shocks. I'll probably sell my GC kit as well.
Something broke in one of my Koni SA's. I can hear it rattle in the bottom of the shock when I shake it. The adjuster won't turn any more so I guess it's related. The other one won't adjust either so I'm going to send them both back to Koni and see if they will repair or replace them for me.
I'm kind of tired of the compromised ride and I think the firm/soft nature of the IAS is more what I'm looking for nowadays. I loved them on my caprice. I could jab the brakes hard and have 0 nosedive.
.
So it came with a 550 and not a 600? I thought 600 was stock.
If the sleeves fit other shocks, I'll sell them, the springs and the hat to recover some of the cost of these shocks. I'll probably sell my GC kit as well.
Something broke in one of my Koni SA's. I can hear it rattle in the bottom of the shock when I shake it. The adjuster won't turn any more so I guess it's related. The other one won't adjust either so I'm going to send them both back to Koni and see if they will repair or replace them for me.
I'm kind of tired of the compromised ride and I think the firm/soft nature of the IAS is more what I'm looking for nowadays. I loved them on my caprice. I could jab the brakes hard and have 0 nosedive.
. Last edited by JasonWW; 11-01-2008 at 02:38 AM.
11-02-2008, 05:19 AM
#47
The spring controls the height.
This modification only effects the shock, the spring (ride height) is not effected.
If you want to lower the car there are plenty of threads on how to do that. Lowering springs, drop spindles, coilovers, modifying the lower spring cup, cutting new grooves in the shock body, etc...
Last edited by JasonWW; 11-02-2008 at 05:33 AM.
11-02-2008, 06:33 AM
#48
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re I am at work so I can't see the pics but if you do this mod on your lowered car will it keep stock ride height shocks from being torn/worn up by the lowered suspension? If I won't have to buy a 800 dollar set of Konis to make my ride handle better looks like a good reason to do this on any lowered DD.
11-02-2008, 09:36 AM
#49
I am at work so I can't see the pics but if you do this mod on your lowered car will it keep stock ride height shocks from being torn/worn up by the lowered suspension? If I won't have to buy a 800 dollar set of Konis to make my ride handle better looks like a good reason to do this on any lowered DD.
What you might not be understanding is what might actually damage a shock. It's not the lower ride height, it's the stiffer spring that usually is used on a lowered car. The stiffer springs help keep you from hitting the bumpstops so hard. With this upper mount mod you are changing the bumpstop height and allowing the tire to travel higher up into the fender.
The fronts have 6" of total travel. The wheel can move 3" in compression and 3" in droop. When you lower the front ride height 1" the wheel now only has 2" to compress and can droop 4". The 2" of compression is why you need the stiffer springs to stay off the bumpstops as much.
The DeCarbons were made for 300lb. springs. If you put a 500lb. spring on them, it tends to beat them up. I think this is what you were talking about above, right? You do bring up a good point. If you do this mod and lower the car only one inch you really don't NEED a stiffer spring. I know there are a lot of folks only wanting to lower the front a little without spending a lot of money on new parts. My advice would be to do the upper shock mod, then take a cutoff wheel and cut the bottom (big end) part of the stock spring to lower the front ride height about 1". By doing both of these together you will be lower, but still have 3" up and 3" down. So the ride quality should be the same. The spring rate will only go up a little to around 340lb. or so. No big deal.
Thanks for helping me realize this. All my crap is so custom I forget about the guys running stock setups who only want it a bit lower. This will do that and for practically no money spent.
I still recommend having some packers of hand so you can limit how high the tire goes. I wouldn't want you guys to cut your tires on the fender or anything.
Last edited by JasonWW; 11-02-2008 at 10:12 AM.
11-02-2008, 10:16 AM
#50
Oh yeah, keeping the stock shocks is not going to make it handle any better. Sorry.
DeCarbons are crap, no two ways about it. Your going to need those Koni SA's, Bilsteins or the Edelbrocks to make it ride and handle better. If your ok with the stock shocks or just broke, then doing what I suggested above will get you lower for real cheap, but it will still feel like stock.
DeCarbons are crap, no two ways about it. Your going to need those Koni SA's, Bilsteins or the Edelbrocks to make it ride and handle better. If your ok with the stock shocks or just broke, then doing what I suggested above will get you lower for real cheap, but it will still feel like stock.
11-04-2008, 06:36 AM
#51
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re I have Hotchkiss springs !" drop with some SLP takeoff shocks right now. But yes I am trying to keep some more affordable shocks (maybe Sam's revalved Bilsteins) happy on the lowered suspension. It is my understanding that only the Koni's have capablility for the lowered suspension
11-04-2008, 07:29 AM
#52
To be fair.
Generally the Bilsteins, Edelbrocks, and Konis are known to handle the stiffer springs.
It's just that this "new" mod changes all the old rules.
Last edited by JasonWW; 11-04-2008 at 08:20 AM.
11-04-2008, 03:25 PM
#55
How much actual metal did you cut out (height)?
I measured the metal I cut out and it was 1/2" tall.
With my IAS shocks I used a large washer(2" dia., and 3/16" thick), then a small washer(3/32" thick). The reason I did this is because the IAS puts all of the load on the center section of the upper mount. IMO without this large washer the very center section of the mount would probably rip out in no time.
Correction: The large washer is not needed, I'll be removing them this friday.
I adjusted the spring seat 1/4" higher (lower on IAS ) and my front ride hieght is now 1/2" lower at the wheels (around 25 3/4" at center of frt wheelwell arch.) and after driving on rough roads for the last 2 days the ride seems a little smoother on the bumps.
Also I used a dremel and a hacksaw to cut mine!
I measured the metal I cut out and it was 1/2" tall.
With my IAS shocks I used a large washer(2" dia., and 3/16" thick), then a small washer(3/32" thick). The reason I did this is because the IAS puts all of the load on the center section of the upper mount. IMO without this large washer the very center section of the mount would probably rip out in no time.
Correction: The large washer is not needed, I'll be removing them this friday.
I adjusted the spring seat 1/4" higher (lower on IAS ) and my front ride hieght is now 1/2" lower at the wheels (around 25 3/4" at center of frt wheelwell arch.) and after driving on rough roads for the last 2 days the ride seems a little smoother on the bumps.
Also I used a dremel and a hacksaw to cut mine!
Last edited by 99Bluz28; 11-04-2008 at 11:16 PM.
11-04-2008, 09:24 PM
#57
Your wrong about the load on the center part of the shock. Reread what I said about all the weight being on the trapazoid piece. It's impossible for it to "rip out".
You need to get rid of the large washer. All it's doing is preventing the shock from tilting.
As far as you cutting off 1/2", it depends on where you cut. You could have cut it a bit higher. Plus your measuring the wrong thing. Don't forget the add the metal shavings on the ground. You removed a tad more than 1/2". Probably closer to 5/8" removed.
You need to get rid of the large washer. All it's doing is preventing the shock from tilting.
As far as you cutting off 1/2", it depends on where you cut. You could have cut it a bit higher. Plus your measuring the wrong thing. Don't forget the add the metal shavings on the ground. You removed a tad more than 1/2". Probably closer to 5/8" removed.
Last edited by JasonWW; 11-04-2008 at 10:29 PM.
11-04-2008, 11:04 PM
#58
Your wrong about the load on the center part of the shock. Reread what I said about all the weight being on the trapazoid piece. It's impossible for it to "rip out".
You need to get rid of the large washer. All it's doing is preventing the shock from tilting.
As far as you cutting off 1/2", it depends on where you cut. You could have cut it a bit higher. Plus your measuring the wrong thing. Don't forget the add the metal shavings on the ground. You removed a tad more than 1/2".
You need to get rid of the large washer. All it's doing is preventing the shock from tilting.
As far as you cutting off 1/2", it depends on where you cut. You could have cut it a bit higher. Plus your measuring the wrong thing. Don't forget the add the metal shavings on the ground. You removed a tad more than 1/2".
Damn, I know exactly what your talking about, it rest up against the center section of the upper A-arm.
So yeah, I have to totally agree that I'm wrong and also I probably cut off/removed 5/8"of metal from the mount. As far as the large washer it still has room to tilt with the small washer I placed above the big washer, that I made sure of before I mounted the shock assembly back in the car. And I purposely cut off less than 3/4". I figured I could alway still take a little more off later if I wanted too.
I'll be removing the large washers this friday.
Thanks for the correction.
Last edited by 99Bluz28; 11-04-2008 at 11:23 PM.
11-04-2008, 11:50 PM
#59
Now you got it. 
It's such a pain to cut that I'd take off the full 3/4" and then use some packers to limit the compression if need be.
It reduces the droop more and that means you don't have to jack the car up so high to get the tire off the ground.
My only real issue is I can't get my jack under my car by the kickpanel anymore. Now I have to jack it up from the nose using the lower radiator support. I'm going to weld in some new dedicated jacking points in the nose to make things easier. I'm also going to weld in some jacking points in the back right above where the tips would go.
My cars looking crazy low now. I just need to move the gas tank to allow the rear axle to have more room.
It's such a pain to cut that I'd take off the full 3/4" and then use some packers to limit the compression if need be.
It reduces the droop more and that means you don't have to jack the car up so high to get the tire off the ground.
My only real issue is I can't get my jack under my car by the kickpanel anymore. Now I have to jack it up from the nose using the lower radiator support. I'm going to weld in some new dedicated jacking points in the nose to make things easier. I'm also going to weld in some jacking points in the back right above where the tips would go.
My cars looking crazy low now. I just need to move the gas tank to allow the rear axle to have more room.
Last edited by JasonWW; 11-05-2008 at 12:06 AM.
