has anyone ever beena lien holder on a car? owner financing?
07-29-2009, 03:49 PM
#21
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You can't "fudge" a sales price, Texas uses the Presumptive Value program and they use the VIN# in a database. It spits out what Texas feels the car is worth, sight unseen, and you pay the 6.25% sales tax on 85% of that presumed value.
http://www.txdot.gov/drivers_vehicle...tive_value.htm
Personally, I think sales tax on used cars is stupid as hell anyways. I would never say I agree to our dumb laws all the time. But, I'm also not trying to make a buck off of some chump by bending the IRS loopholes around in my favor. Saving yourself a buck is socially acceptable every time, but trying to exploit other people is generally frowned on. You are trying to make a business/profit from exploiting a loophole, and doing so repeatedly. That isn't like being frugal about your taxes and saving your own money.
There are indeed ways to "get rich". Some people just have a hard time accepting that it isn't overnight. I started LS1Tech back in 2001. Probably spent an average of 8 hrs a day getting it to where it grew now. Why did it succeed? Because we ran it better than the other sites. I believe in the "Better, Faster, Cheaper" philosophy. If you can start a business that does at least two of those better than your main competition, you have a valid idea to pursue. The problem with 99% of the population is that they are just too lazy or unwilling to do extra after 5pm. Sitting on the couch is easier than trying to figure out more ways to earn income. You have to try things, and fail a few times, in order to succeed. If you don't try, well you never give yourself a chance.
http://www.txdot.gov/drivers_vehicle...tive_value.htm
Personally, I think sales tax on used cars is stupid as hell anyways. I would never say I agree to our dumb laws all the time. But, I'm also not trying to make a buck off of some chump by bending the IRS loopholes around in my favor. Saving yourself a buck is socially acceptable every time, but trying to exploit other people is generally frowned on. You are trying to make a business/profit from exploiting a loophole, and doing so repeatedly. That isn't like being frugal about your taxes and saving your own money.
There are indeed ways to "get rich". Some people just have a hard time accepting that it isn't overnight. I started LS1Tech back in 2001. Probably spent an average of 8 hrs a day getting it to where it grew now. Why did it succeed? Because we ran it better than the other sites. I believe in the "Better, Faster, Cheaper" philosophy. If you can start a business that does at least two of those better than your main competition, you have a valid idea to pursue. The problem with 99% of the population is that they are just too lazy or unwilling to do extra after 5pm. Sitting on the couch is easier than trying to figure out more ways to earn income. You have to try things, and fail a few times, in order to succeed. If you don't try, well you never give yourself a chance.
regarding the bold part: i am trying to make a few more bucks on the sale and I am trying to help out the buyer save a few bucks. why do you say I am doing so repeatedly? this is about being frugal about your taxes and saving your own money.
I agree with your last paragraph. You know that I am allways looking into various business opportunities on the side (this post is not about one of them) and that I put in a lot of time working for myself after my day job. Hopefully it will pay off in a similar time period as yours did. I think it may take a little longer to pay ooff just because I cant dedicate as much time to it because of having a family that needs my time also.
It just sounds like a lot of paperwork and headache for $2k. If the guy can't come up with the money, than I would not sell him the car. It is his responsibility to come up with the rest of the amount, not yours. If he is that desparate to get your car, than he will find some way to come up with the extra money, ie personal loan, credit card advance, etc.
overall its a win win situation.
07-29-2009, 05:03 PM
#23
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lets say you sell them a car for 13k, they will have to pay taxes on the car (lets assume 2k). well if you give the car to them as a gift and they give you a gift of 14.5k you just saved them $500 as they will only have 14.5k into the car as opposed to 15k
you make a little extra money on the sale and they save a few bucks. everyone is happy
you make a little extra money on the sale and they save a few bucks. everyone is happy
07-29-2009, 08:14 PM
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http://www.dot.state.tx.us/txdotefor...vletConfig.xml
the buyer could allways forge the signiture but that would of course be illegal.
07-30-2009, 07:45 AM
#29
I'm not seeing the "win-win" scenario here. I'm seeing the "Brook-win" scenario, like usual. Selling a car to someone that can't afford it, for MORE than you want out of it...lol. BTW, taxes on a $13K car are not $2K. It is only $812. Come on, use that engineering degree to calculate 6.25% for tax. That is assuming the state even feels the car is worth $13K. It is probably worth even less, knowing how you like to price used cars. LOL!
07-30-2009, 07:59 AM
#30
I don't agree with it either but there's a lot of things I don't agree with.
07-30-2009, 08:13 AM
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I'm not seeing the "win-win" scenario here. I'm seeing the "Brook-win" scenario, like usual. Selling a car to someone that can't afford it, for MORE than you want out of it...lol. BTW, taxes on a $13K car are not $2K. It is only $812. Come on, use that engineering degree to calculate 6.25% for tax. That is assuming the state even feels the car is worth $13K. It is probably worth even less, knowing how you like to price used cars. LOL!
this method just offers a person an alternative to lowering the price if someone is a little short on cash to meet the asking price.
07-30-2009, 09:04 AM
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Why not just give it up for 13k and end it instead of making this person jump thru hoops? Or you could just hold out for the 15k of course.
Originally Posted by aggiez28
his finances are his business.
07-30-2009, 09:17 AM
#33
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How is it win-win? The buyer is still having to come up with 15k + taxes no matter what. If he were to only pay 13k the taxes would be 812.50, so we are up to 13812.50, plus the 2k he is going to owe you (are you charging interest on the 2k?)... up to 15812.50. If he would have paid the full price the tax would have gone up 125, a savings of 0.7% out of the whole deal....
Why not just give it up for 13k and end it instead of making this person jump thru hoops? Or you could just hold out for the 15k of course.
Not if you are 'loaning' him $2,000. You need to make sure he is able to pay, thats why the banks have loan applications and approvals/denials.
Why not just give it up for 13k and end it instead of making this person jump thru hoops? Or you could just hold out for the 15k of course.
Not if you are 'loaning' him $2,000. You need to make sure he is able to pay, thats why the banks have loan applications and approvals/denials.
plus you are mixing up the 2k figure I used with the actual tax amount. you can mix assumed numbers with real work figures. you need to use one or the other. either one will work for this example, just dont mix them.
Why not just give it up for 13k and end it instead of making this person jump thru hoops? Or you could just hold out for the 15k of course.
you could charge interest on the 2k if you wanted. i dont think I would.
07-30-2009, 10:14 AM
#34
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see post number 23. that should clear it up it for you. they will only have to pay $10 tax if the car is a gift.
plus you are mixing up the 2k figure I used with the actual tax amount. you can mix assumed numbers with real work figures. you need to use one or the other. either one will work for this example, just dont mix them.
plus you are mixing up the 2k figure I used with the actual tax amount. you can mix assumed numbers with real work figures. you need to use one or the other. either one will work for this example, just dont mix them.
Originally Posted by aggiez28
if you do that then he is going to end up paying more for the car in total and you will make less on the sale. lose-lose for both of yall. doing it my way you both get a better deal.
you could charge interest on the 2k if you wanted. i dont think I would.
you could charge interest on the 2k if you wanted. i dont think I would.
07-30-2009, 11:26 AM
#35
Brook, if your idea was legit, don't you think all these used car dealerships would already be doing it? Nothing stops them from "gifting" their cars to buyers, and receiving "gifts" of payment from them...except tax fraud and ethics. No biggie, right?
If you have a car for sale for $15K, and the buyer only has $13K, you simply wait for a buyer who does have $15K. Simple. If you are willing to accept $13K, then sell the car. I know, I know, but then you wouldn't get your scam in. How about they write you a check for $20K for your $13K car, and then you promise to refund them the difference? You can even set up an email account in Nigeria. Do it like a pro!
If you have a car for sale for $15K, and the buyer only has $13K, you simply wait for a buyer who does have $15K. Simple. If you are willing to accept $13K, then sell the car. I know, I know, but then you wouldn't get your scam in. How about they write you a check for $20K for your $13K car, and then you promise to refund them the difference? You can even set up an email account in Nigeria. Do it like a pro!
07-30-2009, 11:57 AM
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So what are you ACTUALLY selling the car for? How much is the buyer going to owe you? Lets start talking some real numbers here to see how much you 'save' them. You better get this done before Sept 1 when CSHB 2654 takes effect....
The buyer is already going to be paying more with the interest on the loan they are financing. You most certianly wouldnt be doing any favors as you collect more $$$.
The buyer is already going to be paying more with the interest on the loan they are financing. You most certianly wouldnt be doing any favors as you collect more $$$.
you can use real numbers or just make up numbers, its does not matter for the sake of explaining the way this works. you can save them however much you decide to. you could save them close to 100% of the tax or you could save them 0% if you wanted to.
if you dont think you are doing the buyer any favors then it is obvious that you dont understand the concept yet. there is not much more to say about this.
can you give some details on CSHB 2654?
if dealers started using this loophole it would be a very easy case to get them on fraud due to intent (IMO). individuals selling one car is another story, is this a topic we want to drag through the mud?
no biggie??? is it a biggie to you? it sounds like you are saying it is and so I am guessing you have never fudged the sales price or details on a car sale then. you have allways fully disclosed the true sales price on all transactions.
If you have a car for sale for $15K, and the buyer only has $13K, you simply wait for a buyer who does have $15K. Simple. If you are willing to accept $13K, then sell the car. I know, I know, but then you wouldn't get your scam in. How about they write you a check for $20K for your $13K car, and then you promise to refund them the difference? You can even set up an email account in Nigeria. Do it like a pro
the current buyer may not have enough to buy the car for 15 plus tax but he does have enough to buy it for 15 and no tax (lets say he has 15k cash to spend). you could make the sale happen in 2 ways. (lets assume the tax is 1000 just to have a round number, you can do this with the actual numbers and get the same result) you can sell him the car for 14k and he can pay 1000 in taxes or you could give him the car as a gift and he gives you a gift of 14500. he now only has to pay $10 in taxes and he has saved $490. you could adjust the amount he is it to give you to increase or decrease the amount you save him, that is up to you.
Last edited by aggiez28; 07-30-2009 at 12:33 PM.
07-31-2009, 12:13 PM
#37
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Takes effect Sept 1. Apparently since the new laws came in for taxing what the state deems the vehicle value there has been a spike in vehicle "gifts." Now, because of the legit and ethical people like yourself, in order for you to qualify that the car is a gift you have to bring in a notarized letter detailing the vehicle acquisition and the relationship of the person getting the gift (seeing as how the gift tax was meant for, I dunno, actual gifts)... and it must be a family member or someone very close to the family. If you cant do that then you get to pay the full tax.
07-31-2009, 01:24 PM
#38
Takes effect Sept 1. Apparently since the new laws came in for taxing what the state deems the vehicle value there has been a spike in vehicle "gifts." Now, because of the legit and ethical people like yourself, in order for you to qualify that the car is a gift you have to bring in a notarized letter detailing the vehicle acquisition and the relationship of the person getting the gift (seeing as how the gift tax was meant for, I dunno, actual gifts)... and it must be a family member or someone very close to the family. If you cant do that then you get to pay the full tax.
07-31-2009, 09:14 PM
#39
What if someone makes lifelong friends very easily, could they justify giving a car to every person they know? What if gay marriage gets passed, would the marriage license be cheaper than sales tax? If so, that is a win-win. Not only do you sell a car for more money, but you get a chance at some man ***. That is like mega-win!
08-02-2009, 10:04 AM
#40
your first question: i have allready stated it in a few posts.
you can use real numbers or just make up numbers, its does not matter for the sake of explaining the way this works. you can save them however much you decide to. you could save them close to 100% of the tax or you could save them 0% if you wanted to.
if you dont think you are doing the buyer any favors then it is obvious that you dont understand the concept yet. there is not much more to say about this.
can you give some details on CSHB 2654?
legit? it is a legal loophole. some would say useing loopholes is legit/ethical and others will say its not. it is a free country and people are allowed to give gifts. I am just describing a way to structure a transaction so that it maximizes profits/savings for the seller and buyer.
if dealers started using this loophole it would be a very easy case to get them on fraud due to intent (IMO). individuals selling one car is another story, is this a topic we want to drag through the mud?
no biggie??? is it a biggie to you? it sounds like you are saying it is and so I am guessing you have never fudged the sales price or details on a car sale then. you have allways fully disclosed the true sales price on all transactions.
sure you can allways wait for another buyer to come along. that is allways an option.
the current buyer may not have enough to buy the car for 15 plus tax but he does have enough to buy it for 15 and no tax (lets say he has 15k cash to spend). you could make the sale happen in 2 ways. (lets assume the tax is 1000 just to have a round number, you can do this with the actual numbers and get the same result) you can sell him the car for 14k and he can pay 1000 in taxes or you could give him the car as a gift and he gives you a gift of 14500. he now only has to pay $10 in taxes and he has saved $490. you could adjust the amount he is it to give you to increase or decrease the amount you save him, that is up to you.
you can use real numbers or just make up numbers, its does not matter for the sake of explaining the way this works. you can save them however much you decide to. you could save them close to 100% of the tax or you could save them 0% if you wanted to.
if you dont think you are doing the buyer any favors then it is obvious that you dont understand the concept yet. there is not much more to say about this.
can you give some details on CSHB 2654?
legit? it is a legal loophole. some would say useing loopholes is legit/ethical and others will say its not. it is a free country and people are allowed to give gifts. I am just describing a way to structure a transaction so that it maximizes profits/savings for the seller and buyer.
if dealers started using this loophole it would be a very easy case to get them on fraud due to intent (IMO). individuals selling one car is another story, is this a topic we want to drag through the mud?
no biggie??? is it a biggie to you? it sounds like you are saying it is and so I am guessing you have never fudged the sales price or details on a car sale then. you have allways fully disclosed the true sales price on all transactions.
sure you can allways wait for another buyer to come along. that is allways an option.
the current buyer may not have enough to buy the car for 15 plus tax but he does have enough to buy it for 15 and no tax (lets say he has 15k cash to spend). you could make the sale happen in 2 ways. (lets assume the tax is 1000 just to have a round number, you can do this with the actual numbers and get the same result) you can sell him the car for 14k and he can pay 1000 in taxes or you could give him the car as a gift and he gives you a gift of 14500. he now only has to pay $10 in taxes and he has saved $490. you could adjust the amount he is it to give you to increase or decrease the amount you save him, that is up to you.
DO NOT try and gift this vehicle with a "gift" price of whatever thousands of dollars. You will likely not like the result if they question it (which they probably will).
