Hello LS1tech.com community,

I am considering selling my 1999 Firehawk (base car is a trans am). #340 out of approx 720 built that year.
Not mint, but pretty darn excellent. 32,168 current mileage. Bright red with dark gray (pewter) interior. T-tops, etc
Will give a thorough listing of the work I have done since purchasing the car in 2019 when I list it for sale.

Was going to wait until the spring to post a for sale listing as I don't have an urgent need for the sale and late fall, early winter isn't the best time to sell a sporty car regardless of vintage, but thought I'd try to gauge interest before putting her in storage for the winter in case there is someone who has been looking for one.
Attached a lo rez pic for those who may be interested.

Appreciate the input.
Thanks.
Gusser

 

SWEET!!!! You are smart to wait until the Spring. The economic outlook could be better by then. Right now you could get somewhere in the $20's with those 32k miles. Low $20's if many owners and no history. High $20's with a detailed history, just a few owners, and no issues. Looking at your photo I'm guessing the latter. The title must be clear of course.

 

^^^^ I agree.

This one owner automatic 2000 FireHawk w/23k miles at auction today on BaT is probably a fair indicator of the market and interest level at the moment. Still has 24 hours to go so the price should go up etc but $10,000 at the moment seems like a late fall winter time is coming price point to me.

 

Thanks for your input NC01TA. I've noticed an uptick in the value of our cars and have seen some auctions get big $ for low mileage Firehawks, but I'm not considering an auction. I will wait until spring. Perhaps some sanity will return to our leadership by then and the economy will start to recover.

for the record:
1. I purchased the car from the original owner
2. Title is clear
3. No CEL (which wasn't always the case. Resolved easy fix)
4. Anything that was failing (stock speakers/subwoofers all replaced where needed) or tend to fail (both power window motors, power antenna motor) has been replaced with new parts.

I went through the car with a fine tooth comb upon purchase and have made the car as aesthetically pleasing and maintenance-free as possible.
i.e. I replaced the stock rusty rotors with Power Stop e-coated rotors and had the braking surface machined clean.
Also from Power Stop, red powder-coated calipers. No more dull oxidation on the unprotected aluminum stock calipers.
A big expense was the rechroming and repair (of one) of the 17" 5-spoke chrome wheels from SLP/American racing as they were horribly corroded.
I had the work done by Pauls's Chrome plating in PA. (Highly recommended!) One wheel also needed a repair that required some welding. The results are outstanding.
I also have another pair of wheels provided by the original owner which he had purchased "just in case" as these wheels are pretty much unobtainium. They are solid but also corroded and would need re-chroming.

All stock rubber brake lines were replaced with braided stainless steel versions.
New Goodyear all seasons installed to replace the original Firestone Firehawk tires.
Much more to add.
I will create a comprehensive list when I post for sale.

A friend suggested I bring the car to some of the many cruise nights we have in the area with a for sale sign on the window. It should generate some interest and dealing with an enthusiast face-to-face may eliminate the hassle of no-shows and lowball offers.
Cruise season is over but will start up again in April. I can wait.
I will still list my 'Hawk here as this community knows these cars and will appreciate my efforts more so than most.

Why am I selling my pride and joy? I was successful in my goal to bring this 'Hawk to its full potential. Being a low mileage car that was gently used both by the original owner and myself was instrumental in reaching that goal. It is now a fine example of the genre even though nearly 24 years has passed since she was built.
I am now retired and I am not as keen to be crawling around under a project car as I was when I was younger. My 2-post lift I have helps a lot, but I am to the point I just want to do basic maintenance on a later model car.
To just get in, turn the key/push the button and enjoy some spirited driving on the back roads and some day trips with the Mrs. is appealing as I get older.

I have been waiting for C7 corvette prices to drop to more reasonable levels, and there is an indication they are, so time to move up the ladder a bit.
I don't need to sell the Hawk to buy the 'vette, but the proceeds from the sale will allow me to put some savings back.

Here is a pic of my 'Hawk on my lift soon after purchase. Ready for all fluids and filters to be replaced. This pic does not show the newly chromed wheels, coated rotors and calipers.
This is the garage the car is kept in year-round. Heated and dry.



Thanks for your input sir.
Appreciated.

 

Thanks for your input 99 Black Bird T/A.
I have seen Firehawks sell for less as well, but they were in pretty bad shape. Curious why he's selling a 23k-mile example for so little. I will have to follow this auction and see where it ends up. Hopefully, he has a reserve in place, or else he really needs the cash.

Perhaps, as you say, this is a "late fall winter time is coming" price point. We shall see.
I will wait for the spring before making any effort to sell.

Your thoughts are appreciated, sir.

 

Normally, the rule of thumb is that you will always do better in the spring when selling "special interest" cars such as this, but we're in a precarious situation for that rule at present. Regarding the economy, we are actually at the beginning of the downturn, not near the end IMO. A significant portion of my income is tied to interests rates so I watch them carefully, but I'm on the rare side of folks who profit when rates go high - so things are actually positive for me at present. Here is my (quick) take on what has happened and what's to come:

The Fed acted too aggressively (and held too long) with the slashing of rates at the beginning of the plandemic, and this was compounded by near-blanket government stimulus payments. Many folks, some who didn't even need it, ended up with a bunch of extra cash and access to super cheap refinancing rates (thus more cash), and this fueled much of the hyperinflation we've seen in certain non-essential segments (such as 'special interest' cars). The only way to fix this is to raise rates, just as we're seeing, and the Fed has now made it quite clear that we are nowhere near the end of this cycle. As rates continue to climb, folks don't want to refinance and lose their great low rates, plus the cash-out incentive is less as property values will continue to soften in the face of those higher rates. This path will have to continue for some time before inflation is under control, hence my belief that we are just at the beginning of what will likely have to become a recession to restore balance. And this is why I have been cautioning folks to not overpay for these (or other) "toy" cars over the last 12-18 months, especially if they don't plan to keep them for a long time, because a portion of their price spike is hyper-inflationary and not "real", thus will evaporate as the economy cools.

So, back to why this matters...I don't think that next spring and summer will look like last spring and summer in terms of pricing/value, so I would advise folks to consider this when setting their expectations on a sale price. The "spring boom" that usually happens for cars such as these could easily end up being muted to a level that isn't really any sort of "boom" at all. On the upside, if you're planning to buy a replacement then you, too, will benefit from the tapering of prices - so "underselling" on one doesn't really matter if you can "underpay" for the replacement.

Honestly, it sounds like you already have the car you're looking for then. This is exactly the sort of car that I would find to be fitting for the exact statements that are bolded above. When I think about my own collection, I could see why someone might not want the "old car" hassles of my '71 or '74, but none of that applies to my '98 Z28 which, at just 19k miles, is very comparable to your Firehawk in terms of being "fresh". A C7 is newer and obviously offers improvements in all areas of stock performance, but I don't think it will be noticeably different than your Firehawk in those areas you've listed as most important based on the current condition and status of said Firehawk. Of course, if you just want a C7 then nothing else is going to satisfy but, with everything you've stated above, it sounds to me like your Firehawk has a ton of life to live before hitting any sort of "project car" status again.

 

You make some very good points admin.
Thanks for taking the time to make them. Very informative and helpful.

A couple points on the sale of 'Hawk.
1. I don't expect to make a huge profit on the sale. Whatever the market will bring is fine, within reason. If it doesn't sell for a resonable price, I'll hang onto a while longer. When it does sell, the proceeds will be used to pay down/off the small balance of the loan for the C7.
2. I really had no intention of purchasing a C7, but my daughter, who has become very successful, knows that I'm a car guy (had a C5 I had to sell due to job loss during the banking mess in 2007/2008) and purchased a 2020 C8 convertible in early 2020 (and paid quite a premium for the color she wanted) suggested I look at a 2019 gran sport 2lt at her dealership that was recently traded in on a C8. I sat in it and it fit like a glove.
Then the test drive: the car was fast, smooth with effortless power on tap. I do love the handling of the 'Hawk. Aside from a C5, it was the best bang for the buck back in the day.
But some of our New England roads are pretty bumpy and the Hawk transfers every little bump right to my teeth. The C7 with the magnetic ride control set to weather/touring absorbed those bumps with ease. The difference is night and day. I never knew a sportscar that is capable of track days could ride so smooth on sometimes rough, public road, thanks to the magnetic ride control system.

We ended up passing on the car as the asking price was too high and the dealer (supposedly a friend of my daughters) was stubborn, so we walked away. I am finding low mileage Gran sport 1LT's popping up everywhere and the prices seem to be drifiting downward as we approach winter so I believe the end of the year may be a good time to take the leap.

3. There is also a health aspect to this sale. The Firehawks lumbar support is not movable and to disassemble the seat to remove the bladder (can't remove the welding in chasis that it is mounted to) risks damaging the assembly and devaluing the car. There are aftermarket seats that MAY fix the issue, but I'm not willing to take that risk as the attempt may fail.... then what?
Why is this an issue?

I took the 'Hawk out for a nice long ride this past summer during a balmy weekday evening. I was in the seat for over 3 hours. First time I ever took the car out for more than 90 minutes at a time.
I found mostly smooth roads that were a joy to drive on. I had my coffee in the cup holder and was enjoying the fully functional Monsoon audio system, of which I had replaced the rear seat sail panel subwoofers and door panel midrange speakers when I replaced both window motors.
Upon arriving home and parking the Hawk in her garage spot, I exited the car and was happy that the drive didn't cause me any back discomfort.

The next two days I had a throbbing spasm in my right side lower back. I had the same issue with the lumbar support of my Honda Crosstour and a Ford Escape company car, both of which I removed the lumbar supports and resolved the problem. Once the spasm receeded, I still had soreness there for several days afterward. I took the Hawk out a few days ago to add some more 91 octane gas to the half full tank. Drove about an hour total. Got out of the car and felt that same twinge of pain returning.

To save my fingers from the typing, here is what I posted on the Corvetter forum.
It's a bit out of context but hopefully those who read it will get the gist:

Hey Joe. Thanks for your thoughts.

If a good deal on a GS becomes available, I have already resigned myself that the wheels will need to be replaced at some point.

With that in mind, if a nice, low-mileage Stingray with the Z51 option becomes available, that may be in the cards as well, but I do so love the GS's fat butt.

And, in 1LT trim for both models without question....
Why?

Full disclosure: I have an odd back condition. I have no natural curve in my spine. It is flat front to back (anterior to posterior). If I sit in a chair or a car seat that has ANY sort of lumbar support protruding, eventually my back will spasm and I will be in significant pain. I.e. my wifes 2015 CR-v.

My 2015 Honda Crosstour (think accord station wagon) had a significant lumbar support protrusion. I purchase my leftover CT at the end of 2015 only after I found that the lumbar support can be removed relatively easily, leaving a perfectly flat seat back. I have driven the car several hours nearly non-stop with no back issues.
I had a 2017 ford escape as a company car before retiring. Same situation. I removed the lumbar support after realizing I had the same situation happening with the return of the back pain.
I was a medical imaging field service engineer (MRI's and Cat Scanner service and support) throughout New England and spent a lot of time behind the wheel. The removal of the lumbar support in the escape saved me from debilitating back pain.

So... I did a search on C7 corvette owners with back issues on the forum. I found one poster thas the exact condition I have... we cannot tolerate ANY lumbar support protrusions. He did a lot of testing and found the 1LT seats were comfortable and did not aggravate his back even after several hours on the road. The 2/3LT seats, with their added lumbar mass due to the air bladders and supporting media pushed on his back just enough to let him know the upgraded seats were not for him.

I did take the blue GS 2LT for a short 20-minute test drive and the seat was very comfortable. But only a multi-hour test drive would tell the true story.
Wouldn't that just suck? To buy my dream car and to find out I can't live with the 2lt seats?
I did bring up my concern with the dealer owner when discussing purchase of the blue GS 2lt pictured at the beginning of this post...he says there are wires (?) that can be cut (?) to relax the tension from the lumbar support that will not damage the seat. I did some research and couldn't find anything to that effect. Perhaps just another salesman adding his own twist to the 10 commandments of used car salesmen to convince me to buy the car? After our latest experience with the dealership owner, I wonder.......

So I have decided not to test that theory with the 2LT seats.
Staying with a 1lt GS or S1lttingray/Z51 combo is my plan.

I so wish my back had a normal front to back curvature, but rather than possibly ruining the car with the installation of aftermarket seats, which risks damaging the air lines and harnesses that control those supports (The bladders are in both driver and passenger seats), I will say goodbye to a great car and hope her new owner will enjoy her as much as I did.

Again, thanks for the input RPM WS6 Very helpful.

 

That stinks with your health issues. I finally sold my 2007 GT/CS in August because the clutch was really bothering my left knee. So many years of ownership and now it's gone, but I am loving my '14 GT (automatic) that replaced it. Just miss the shifting at times. First time in a long time that I have no cars with a manual tranny. I totally understand your situation.
I cringed a bit when I heard about your desires for a Corvette after my own 'been there, done that' Corvette experiences. I owned both a C4 and C6, While the driving experience was awesome in both cars, the lack of space finally swore me off of them forever..Endless wonderful day trips seemed to end in frustration because we couldn't buy something we liked that we had seen during our travels. Since a cooler is always a must for us, that cut down on space as well. A back seat is required now in all our cars, especially ones that fold down like our Trans Am and R/T. I've really never thought of selling my Trans Am as it's just the perfect car for me personally. If space will never be an issue for you, I wish you the best with your Corvette pursuit and sale of the Firehawk.
Our old 1996 C4 and 2009 C6 seen below. Good memories but don't want either one again.


1996 Anniversary


2009 Atomic Orange

 

Thanks for the share.
You're Trans Am is clearly the perfect car for you and your copilot situation.
And thanks for the great pics. Nice Cars!

I hear ya on the manual tranny situation. My left knee is currently good but I sold my autocross 1995 Miata with the stick shift to my future son in law so he could autocross as I knew that a long ago injury may make driving a manual painful and eventually, impossible.
Like you, I do love to row the gears, and will certainly miss that now and then, but the brief test drive of the GS 2lt (in the rain even) with the A8 sold me on the C7 model year. Granted, the first few years had their growing pains. The general consensus is that all the bugs have been completely worked out in the 2019 (final) model year, with the exception of the wider GS wheels, which are prone to bending and cracking without much effort. I have resigned myself that a replacement set will probably be needed in the future. Even a very low mileage car that was babied and well cared for does not exclude the bent/cracked rim risk. It is what it is.
If mine DO bend/crack, I will add my name to the lawsuit list... count on it.

Of all the pleasure/project cars I've owned during our 44 years of marriage, my Mrs. only seemed to enjoy riding in my '71 Cutlass convertible (pic below) with the top down in the fall. (Car totaled when I hit a telephone pole avoiding a deer Fortunately, No injuries). The anemic 350 wasn't conducive to WOT speed runs, so why bother? She was just a cruiser and she certainly got her share of thumbs-ups.
With any other car ((C5-(pic below), Miata, Firehawk and a couple others) just a little push on the go pedal and she starts grabbing the armrest, especially now as she is older and less tolerant of my occasional extra-legal, albeit brief, speed runs.
We don't go on day trips for shopping. She'd prefer to spend time with our grandkids.. especially the newest arrival, a girl who is now 3 weeks old. She is many things, including my soul mate and the best thing that ever happened to me, but she is not a car gal..

And that's fine with me. I prefer solo driving in my sporty cars, especially when the spirit moves to open her up now and then. I don't pack anything so I stop when I get some hunger pangs or need a coffee for the road.

Doing day trips with your partner, I get the need for a cooler to minimize the stops. Sounds like you spend a lot of quality time together in your weekend cars. Very cool!

The occasional cruise night will be the only time I leave the car unattended so I won't be finding anything to buy and lug home in the 'vette. We have some nice roads that have recently been paved (but many more still need it) that are a joy to drive with either the Hawk or any sports/performance car. The only family member that might consider going for a drive with me is my younger daughter with the C8, (see pic below) and she would probably prefer to drive her 'vette while we explore and enjoy the backroads, as would I. Out of all my family members, she gets me the most.....

So as suggested, I will wait until the spring before I post my 'Hawk for sale here and in other outlets. I'll also put a for sale sign in the window and go to some local cruises. We shall see how the market looks next spring before deciding on an asking price.
Until then, an oil/filter change and topping off of the tank with 91 octane along with K100 fuel stabilizer and under the car cover she goes until April.

If anyone sees this post and is interested in more info on the Hawk, PM me.

Thanks again to all for the input. Appreciated.

 

To me the OP's car should bring more than the BAT car. Pewter, though I like it, is not high on the list for most people. Also, I do see that in general a manual transmission car pulls a little more money.

I absolutely love the red Firehawks. The lettering just pops on them. I'd wait till spring to sell but listing now won't hurt. Not like you have to accept low ball offers.
​​​​

 

Agreed on all points. Of course, a manual is probably a bigger draw. But if you're a gray beard like me with potential left knee issues, the A4 is a great option, which sold me back in 2019. She really scoots when press the go pedal. And it's a really good idea to leave the traction control on....
I can wait until the spring.

The BAT car is currently at $17500 with 20 mins to go.

I attached a couple of pics showing before and after of the front and rear rotor/caliper replacement.
Unfortunately, the black coating didn't burn off like it was supposed to and started to squeak at every stop sign/light, so off they came and a quick trip to NAPA to remove the coating on only the braking surface: Problem solved. I also had to use brake cleaner to get off the black coating gumming up the pads.
The BAT car is showing signs of corrosion on the inner barrel of it's chrome wheels. You can't wire brush this stuff away and paint it. Ask me how I know... My wheels have been professionally stripped and completely re-chromed. As good as, if not better, than new.
Hopefully, this will all add up to a better selling price in the spring.

Thanks for your input and advice 440_stroker. Appreciated.

 

For those wanting an A4 the manual is worth nothing.

I think with the items you replaced/fixed and the attention to detail will serve you well. I'd rather a car be like yours than original. Because it's stuff I would want to do anyway and you saved me the time and effort. Hah
I would say $20k should be easy but don't be surprised if with the holidays, winter, and the economy the way it is that nobody bites. As stated, in the spring would be better but the economy may be worse. There will still be buyers out there but in smaller numbers.

GLWTS. Buy that C7 and enjoy both. Though I am not a huge fan of the C7 style there is no discounting it's ride, handling, and overall performance. Multiple friends have them and nothing but solid experiences all around. You'll enjoy any variant of the C7.

 

Of all the cars posted so far in this thread, THIS is the one that gets my attention most:

Terrible shame to hear about what happened to it, but I sure am glad that nobody was hurt. I had a '71 as well, an "S" hardtop with the formal roof line that's similar to a convertible (I think this was called a "Holiday Coupe", as opposed to the fastback version that would have been used for a 442 model). I sold mine in 1997 to get into my first F-body (an '89 Formula 350), but I've always had a soft spot for Oldsmobiles. Just this summer, I finally made a return to the Oldsmobile scene with a '74 Cutlass that I found locally. This is my first A-body from the "lesser" 1973-'77 years, but I have to say that I find it just as much of a pleasure to drive as my '71 had been - actually I like it MORE in some ways. As you mentioned, the Rocket 350s are not anything close to a "rocket" in the acceleration department especially by today's standards, just 200hp with dual exhaust and the later ones like mine are 3900lbs, but they are excellent road/driving cars that I could cruise in for HOURS without fatigue. The power output isn't really an issue for me as I have two other "toys" for when I want a more spirited experience, but for just taking a relaxing pleasure cruise this car is hard to beat:

 

Thanks for the encouraging words.
Yup. You're probably right about the holiday/winter season not being conducive for a timely sale with a decent return for my efforts, not to mention the economy.
Spring it is.

"Buy that C7 and enjoy both. " What started the whole C7 thing was the 3 hour ride in the Hawk that hurt my back. 99% of drivers will find the lumbar support and side bolsters perfect. (See post #7 for the whole story) Those of us with no tolerance to ANY lumbar support find driving the car painful. Otherwise, I would surely consider keeping both.
She will not get many miles on her before the sale next spring.

Btw: The Pewter BAT Firehawk sold for $20,800. Someone got a pretty good deal.

Appreciate your input and advice Stroker.

 

....44 year of marriage....
....Doing day trips with your partner, I get the need for a cooler to minimize the stops. Sounds like you spend a lot of quality time together in your weekend cars. Very cool! ....
^^^ Oh yeah, I found a good one back in 1976. Married 45 years now just like you guys. We live for vacations and day trips here in the NC mountains. Our problem is which car to choose. The wife likes convertibles the best.

 

Apologies for the late reply. Came down with a nasty chest cold.

It was a nice car. I had it for several years. Sometimes it seemed like it was on the lift more than driven as I was constantly upgrading it. I did a firewall-forward resto. It looked like new under the hood when I was done.
I ended up with some whiplash from hitting a telephone pole, albeit at a relatively slow 25mph. My oldest daughter and her Fiance were unhurt (young and flexible). I had visions of the deer crashing through the windshield and killing us so just kept veering to the right... the deer finally stopped but I had already hit the telephone pole. It was a summer evening and was taking the "kids" out for ice cream around 9pm. I no longer drive at night with my "good" car(s) and limit night-time drives with our daily drivers because of this. Now I know why some owners head out of a cruise early if they have a bit of a drive ahead of them. Driving a treasured, valuable car after dark is risky business.

Something noteworthy: several months before the crash, my Olds engine guru friend suggested to not wait and put the 468 engine I bought for the '71 S hard top into the convertible. So we did. No more anemic 350. We figure it had about 525hp and about 600ftlb torque....Lots of power and I had the foresight to put in a posi. She still rode nice but having the extra power was a treat.

I attached a pic of the vert after the crash (it still hurts to look at it). Also a pic of the S with the big block temporarily installed for fitment check (I powder coated the intake in an old oven in my detached garage), a graphic artist's rendition (which I paid a fair price for but took way too long to complete) of my vision for the S/442 a visual reality, and finally, the Veteran Vanity plate I had done for the finished car.
Part of me wishes I didn't bail on the S/442, but as they say, hindsight is 20/20. Ce la vie.
I sold the S as it was a project car and required far more work than the vert. This was back in 2015.

As everyone can see, I have done my fair share of wrenching. I'm to the point in my life a C7 checks all the boxes.
The C7 purchase will not wait for the sale of the Hawk if the right one comes along.

Btw: The pic of the vert doesn't really look that bad, and I had a $20k policy in place but the bent frame and other damage quickly ate up the insured value and they totaled the car. If I had gone to $25k, all would have been good. My motivation went out the window so bought the car back for the appraised value ($4300 or so) and parted out the car.
I have the Hawk insured for $30k just in case. Lesson learned.

Started fresh with the Firehawk in 2019. Had an itch and the Hawk scratched it nicely.
You can take the cars out of the car guy's garage, but you can't take the car guy out of the car guy...or something like that..

Nice score on the '74! The color is very similar to my '71 vert. I'll bet she rides smoooooth.
Looking at your signature, you have some nice choices for a pleasure ride when the spirit moves.

Thanks again for your input. Appreciated.

 

Wow! Nice collection of pleasure cars! Congrats on your nice stable and 45 years with your soulmate.
I would guess any car guy/car girl would love to have the dilemma you two have as to which car to take for a ride!

 

Agreed

 

OP, was your Olds engine guru from Rochester, NY?

I can't remember the guys name but there is an engine builder there my friend used for his W31. That little engine cranked out I think 404 HP and like 420 tq on the engine dyno. Just mild upgrades.