Long tube VS Short Tube headers
03-21-2006, 05:39 AM
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Long tube VS Short Tube headers I'm placing a 2004 GTO LS1 into my 78 Camaro and I've been told the Type III chromex coated headers from Street and Performance were the way to go.
However they're shorties......
Now from what I'm hearing the long tubes are the better route for more HP gains...is there any truth to this??
If so, does anyone have any recommendations for a retrofit into a 78 Camaro in the long tube headers style if that's the better route??
However they're shorties......
Now from what I'm hearing the long tubes are the better route for more HP gains...is there any truth to this??
If so, does anyone have any recommendations for a retrofit into a 78 Camaro in the long tube headers style if that's the better route??
03-21-2006, 12:23 PM
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Yeah, longtubes will definately make more power no matter what. But I don't know anything about fitting them into a 78 camaro. Surely someone makes LTs that fit. Good luck with the swap. That's going to be a sweet car!
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03-21-2006, 02:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Sgt. Spuds
Think of it this way, would you rather have a short *****, or a long one?
Now that's what I call f*ckin' funny.........
An instant "coin phrase"
03-21-2006, 03:47 PM
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Alrighty, sounds like the long tubes are a definite vote.
now I just gotta find the ones that will fit my application.
I've got 2 votes so far in the "Conversion" area thread.
now I just gotta find the ones that will fit my application.
I've got 2 votes so far in the "Conversion" area thread.
03-21-2006, 03:53 PM
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Originally Posted by Aceshigh
Alrighty, sounds like the long tubes are a definite vote.
now I just gotta find the ones that will fit my application.
I've got 2 votes so far in the "Conversion" area thread.
now I just gotta find the ones that will fit my application.
I've got 2 votes so far in the "Conversion" area thread.
What about mid length?
03-21-2006, 03:55 PM
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Originally Posted by Sgt. Spuds
Think of it this way, would you rather have a short *****, or a long one?
You just redeemed all of the dumb things I have seen you post.... That is the funniest comparison ever....
From now on whenever anyone thinks of buying shorties or mid length headers they should be linked to this page... Never again will anyone want to say... "yeah I have shorties"
03-21-2006, 04:34 PM
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There seems to be a lot of misconceptions about headers out there. Long tubes DO NOT make more power than shorties. They make the same power, but make MORE TORQUE than shorty headers do. The reason long tubes make more torque is the longer length primary tubes scavange better at lower RPM and cause the cylinders to empty better. As engine speed increases, the exhaust pulses are more frequent and a shorter runner can accomplish the scavaging affect making the same power as a longer tube.
Yes, long tubes will make your car faster, but they do not make "more power" which would literally mean more horsepower.
Ever notice how Mac headers make the same peak power as long tubes? It's because their shorter tubes are just as effecient up top as the long tubes.
In the above post about shorties picking up zero on a dyno, you're not comparing apples to apples here, put a 3" y-pipe on those shorty headers if you want a fair comparison. That's the other half of the story- the long tubes you're comparing them to would have 3" piping all the way out the back.
Ben Theriot
Yes, long tubes will make your car faster, but they do not make "more power" which would literally mean more horsepower.
Ever notice how Mac headers make the same peak power as long tubes? It's because their shorter tubes are just as effecient up top as the long tubes.
In the above post about shorties picking up zero on a dyno, you're not comparing apples to apples here, put a 3" y-pipe on those shorty headers if you want a fair comparison. That's the other half of the story- the long tubes you're comparing them to would have 3" piping all the way out the back.
Ben Theriot
03-21-2006, 07:51 PM
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Originally Posted by Studytime
There seems to be a lot of misconceptions about headers out there. Long tubes DO NOT make more power than shorties. They make the same power, but make MORE TORQUE than shorty headers do.
Power is a term that can be used to describe torque or HP it depends on your own preference I guess.
Torque to me is more benefiical since it's what moves you off the line.
03-21-2006, 08:12 PM
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Originally Posted by Studytime
There seems to be a lot of misconceptions about headers out there. Long tubes DO NOT make more power than shorties.
Yes, long tubes will make your car faster, but they do not make "more power" which would literally mean more horsepower.
Yes, long tubes will make your car faster, but they do not make "more power" which would literally mean more horsepower.
03-21-2006, 09:03 PM
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Average hp will be higher; however, peak HP will not be higher. Varying factors will have the numbers off by a few units, but they'll be very close to the same value. Yes, I understand the definition of horsepower, and you bring up a good point. I guess I got caught up in only mentioning peak rwhp as this seems to be the only concern for so many posters.
Okay, Lucas. You read my theory. I'm waiting on your intelligent, technical rebuttal. Where's your theory? Tell me why I'm wrong please. 
Ben Theriot
Originally Posted by Lucas'02SS
Not to be rude or anything but you are wrong. Longtubes definately make more HP than shorties.
Ben Theriot
03-21-2006, 09:11 PM
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Originally Posted by Aceshigh
Torque to me is more benefiical since it's what moves you off the line.
Exactly. If only we could express the exacty shape of the torque curve (with a mathematical equation) as easy as we could spout off RWHP!
Yes, I do agree. To a point, torque IS more important. I've ran SBC combos before with shorty and long tube systems on them. That in of its self is another whole thread! Funny how the peaky shorty headers felt faster on the street than the long tubes. From my experience the long tubes provide such smooth power increases across the entire operating range that they feel slower than my shorty headers did. The shorty headers would pull mediocre & then would have great pull to the top of the gear up until the shift point. That explosive topend pull gave the impression that they were faster- it was certainly a wrong impression though.
Ben
