stumbo

Me and my brother in law are going to try to build a twin turbo ls1 for his dune buggy. Our original plan was to build a magnacharged setup, however, we decided that a turbo setup would be better due to cost, and ease of install, power, and engine life. Ive got a few questions concerning selecting the correct turbos, and concerning what cam will work well with this engine. First off, the engine will consist of 8:1 diamond pistons, ported heads (about 270 on the intake and 205 on the exhaust), we are planning on using the stock rods and crank. Here are my questions:

• What turbo chargers will work well with a 6k RPM LS1? We were thinking somthing in the T04 family, what housing, and all those other specifics i dont know much about?
• At 8:1 compression on 91 octane, how much boost should we be able to lay down?
• At the above level of boost, how my hp to the crank can we expect?
• Where should we draw the line in order to keep the stock rods and crank in one piece?
• Our engine builder reccomended just using the stock cam, we want to keep our rpm curve the same, would a FI cam work much better in this application? Or would it be a waste of money? If its worth like 20hp, it isnt worth it to us, but if its worth like 40 (without spinning it any higher), we need to know brand and model of what you guys reccomend.
• He estimated $800 to assymble the long block, and about $1200 to port the heads, is this a fair price?
• Is ARP making bolts for the lsx engines, or is GM still the only ones?
• Any advise on some good head gaskets that will stay in one piece?
• Anybody used the TechIII on an engine like this? Would FAST be a better choice?

FYI, this is going into a 2000lb buggy Buckshot Racing
The person who builds the buggy also sells TurboLS1 headers designed just for the buggy, so that isnt a concern .
Thanks, sorry for all the questions, but you guys seem to know what you are talking about, so if you can answer any of my many questions, I would appriciate it!

BIG PD

i read your magnacharged post...a turbo setup...especially a twin turbo setup with cost way more then a supercharger. also i'm not trying to be a jerk or anything, but probably most of the people on here aren't gonna help you out. first of all you don't seem to know very much about these motors...therefore you shouldn't even be trying to build one...no less a tt'd one. second your asking questions like...does arp make bolts for this engine and that shows that you haven't even researched the project other then putting up this post. go research...call some shops that are listed to the right of this post...see what they recommend then ask the people on here if they've had any experience with it. third we don't know what you are trying to build. what hp range? what ci? how much boost? what block are you using? you need to do this right if you are going to do it. you and your brother can't just make a post and ask what we would do and then try to do it yourself. i'm really not trying to be a jerk though, you just need to research a whole lot more. it took me 3 months to pic out the cam i wanted. i've been looking at heads for 2 months now and i still don't know what heads i want. hope that helped good luck with you motor.

stumbo

First off, do you mind telling me why it would cost way more?

Your right, I dont know much about these motors, why do you think I'm here? Please forgive me for getting on a force induction LS1 message board and posting some questions about a force inducted ls1 engine. Last thing i knew, nobody but GM was making connectors for these engines, is it really that hard to answer? Third, this IS part of reasearch, what better way to learn that to ask sombody? Im sorry if this is an expert only message board, and general questions are not allowed.

I answered that in the post, our goal is as much hp as the stock rods and crank can take. The CID should have been obviouse when I said "stock rods and crank". I dont know, how much boost can the stock rods and crank take? And do you think i would have said ls1 if it was a C5R block?

I know you probably didnt want to sound like a jerk, but you did. You need to chill out, read other peoples post, and not jump to conclusions. The entire idea of message boards is to get together with other guys that are interested int he same thing as you, being about to get information directly from other people without having to run around and do a bunch of bs research yourself is the entire idea. I know what you mean by picking out the cam and the heads, ive done the same thing, wasnt happy with the results, and tried again. I was'nt happy until i finally got that 10 second pass. I also understand why you said what you did about doing research, I'm a member to plenty of message boards and I get pissed off at the "I want 800hp, what do I do" or "I want to run 9s on street tires for $3000, what do i do?" posts. I also get pissed off whe people answer questions with stuff like "well, if you use a strong cam, and build your bottom end strong, and give it alot of boost, you should have alot of power". This is a different situation. If we wanted to become turbocharged ls1 experts we would, but we dont need or want to.

SO tell me PD, is it really that big of a deal to ask a few general questions and ask for some advise on selecting a turbo and a cam?

Best regards,
Stumbo

BIG PD

ok...i'm just gonna reply with...i think you should use a Garret T45 to kick in at 2,000 rpms and a Garret T66 to kick in at around 4,500 rpms. get a big intercooler too. for a cam i'd run something like a 220/230 keep the lift low... bout .520/.540 and definetly a 114 LSA. stock bottom end would pry take up to 16psi safely...not quite sure...the limits haven't been tested out quite yet. however get some forged pistons (i would) get them dished and run around 8.5:1 compression. they do have arp bottom end stuff: main bolts, rod bolts, they have studs too. for heads if you running a tt setup...i would personally spend the extra and get 2.08 intakes and 1.60 exhausts unless you can get bigger exhaust valves. i know you can but i don't remember where. for a fuel system get you'll need i'd say 42lb...maybe 50lb injectors, aeromotive 1000hp fuel pump, lots of braided line. you'll need a boost controller...hks i think makes a good one. think they make blow off valves too...you'll need 2 i think with a TT...? i'd go ahead and go with a FAST computer setup...no way stock one will keep up. oh and wheelie bars for the dune buggy...i'm being serious. sorry for being rude earlier, but i'm glad you know what i mean about the "how do i make 1000 hp on my dads car and make him not notice it" kinda crap. if your serious about this though, then good luck and take videos i wanna see a tt on a dunebuggy. it'd be badass.

stumbo

Thanks dude, I feel like I was kinda harsh too, I dont blame you for your first post, I probably would have done the same.

BTW, if we had a wheelie bars, we couldnt do this:


So, on with the question, does anybody have some side by side evidence of a TRUE hp gain by going from a non-FI cam to a FI cam? Or is it maybe all hype?

Mike 01WS6

The turbo setup is going to cost much more that that magnacharger. More technical parts and much harder to tune exactly right. The magnacharger will function much like the turbo. The boost comes on at low rpms and holds it through the power band. Only, you will have absolute zero lag. By the way, you said stock crank and stock rods...but that does not necessarily indicate your cid. You could have over sized pistons, running an all-bore motor; I think that was what Big PD was getting at. The magnacharger would be much simpler and come with a lot less headaches. Just slap it on and go. You may have to upgrade your fuel system as well. Just look at Lingenfelter's mangnacharged vette for an idea of power numbers.

SS00Blue

I've got a bone stock '00 LS1 (which means I don't have the later LS6 intake) and it's taking 7lbs. and giving me around 485/525 rear wheel (Dynojet) numbers.

I'm going to lower compression heads and LS6 intake, and I'll turn up the wick to 10-12 lbs. which I expect will give me 550-600. Then I'll go through the shortblock and add forged pistons and ARP rod bolts. I wouldn't go higher than that without them.

With pistons/bolts there is a higher limit. One young man is running 700/700 with twin 38s (I think) on a Mustang dyno, which is more like 750/750 on a dynojet. That's stock block/forged pistons/aftermarket rods.

Very impressive.

As for a cam, I'd stay with a lower lift single pattern with 116LSA. A lot like the stocker. These cams just seem to work best with turbos.

If you want drivability, stay with twins smaller than 44s. I wouldn't go too far north of 51s unless you want to wind the motor really tight. I don't think you really need large turbos with twins. The car will get really lazy and you'll be just on the leading edge of the efficiency "island".

Hope it helps.

SC-

gogogadgetcar

I'm building TTLS1 myself. The turbo's I'm going with are PT52's from PTE. I asked for a pair of turbo's that would be effective from 600 -1000rwhp and this is what they recomened. I was oringinaly thinking of trying t04e "50"s or maybe 60-1's but decided on the PT52. Use ARP head studs. As of now I'm planning on using the FAST system, but this has'nt been set in stone yet. Don't know much about cams but for a turbo I think you want larger exhaust duration than intake. Hope this helped

Gary

Malicious

iTrader: (1)

If you know the right people you can build a reliable turbo set up for tons cheaper than any supercharger setup. Just my opinon, have seen it 3 times already on cars that are running REALLY good with custom turbo set ups instead of something you may buy from someone else