S60 is down!!!
03-22-2011, 05:43 PM
#1
S60 is down!!! I dropped my Camaro off at a shop last Friday because my S60 started making a really bad bearing noise. There must have been half a dozen fbodies there, and there was a big block rail car with a hilborn injection setup, so I figured I took it to the right place.
The noise started while I was on my normal commute, goin 65mph with the cruise control on. I turned the radio down because it sounded like I had big mud tires on, classic "raw raw raw" noise. I figured it sounded like carrier bearings, but when I got it home I went over everything. U joints were fine, as were the wheel bearings. No leaks.
I called Strange and started asking them what they thought the noise could be and they said it sounded like carrier bearings too. They seemed pretty nice on the phone, and even sounded like they would help me out... until I told them that it had 21,000 miles on it and that I got it through MidWest Chassis.
At that point they told me that there wouldn't really be any kind of warranty and that I'd need to contact MWC because Strange wasn't going to deal with me. I was told that I "tried to save some money by going thru someone other than Strange." So far, the customer service at Strange seems questionable to me...
I've got a degree in Management, and have worked in retail management for years, and for the life of me can't figure out why some places would rather argue with customers or refuse to replace something. It's always easier and better for your business if you take care of your customers. But, having said that, I haven't actually tried to get anyone to pay for anything, nor did anyone argue with me. But, I got the general feeling over the phone that if I were to ask for them to reimburse me that they'd tell me to take a hike.
Mid West Chassis, as usual, seemed very nice over the phone (it's been a few weeks since I've talked to them). Their customer service is always outstanding. When I told them about the rear end they were more shocked than anything that I was having problems, because these are some beast rear ends.
Today I talked to the mechanic who's doing the work on it and he said he thinks it's going to be the carrier bearings, based on how it drives. If that's the case I'll be out about $250 if it didn't kill anything else... like the truetrac or the gears themselves. We'll have to see.
Now, I haven't ever had sticky tires on the car, it's probably ~375rwhp, just bolt-ons and a cam and M6 with monster clutch. This car has never been to the drag strip. Period. The 21000 miles that I put on this rear end was done since Dec of 2009.
I'll keep everyone posted as to what actually went wrong, and I doubt I'll end up raising any stink over something like this. I hate that my bullet proof rear end is having problems so soon, especially since I haven't even been rough on it. I kinda thought that Strange would have wanted to do anything to make sure that I was taken care of, especially since so many people are interested in this rear (versus others) for it's strength/reliability.
Dare I say that if I had to do it over again I would have spent the extra and gotten a 9" from Midwest??? I have a feeling that they'd handle this differently if this were one of their own...
21000 miles just seems too early for this crap to be going on. My stock carrier bearings lasted 130k, and that was with me abusing the crap out of some 4.10s that I set up myself... BTW, I'd be doing the work on it this time if I had time. But, that's life.
So, I guess this makes me the first...
Pretty shitty that it went down like it did...with the cruise control on... not coming out of the hole and running a 1.30 60' time, lol.
The noise started while I was on my normal commute, goin 65mph with the cruise control on. I turned the radio down because it sounded like I had big mud tires on, classic "raw raw raw" noise. I figured it sounded like carrier bearings, but when I got it home I went over everything. U joints were fine, as were the wheel bearings. No leaks.
I called Strange and started asking them what they thought the noise could be and they said it sounded like carrier bearings too. They seemed pretty nice on the phone, and even sounded like they would help me out... until I told them that it had 21,000 miles on it and that I got it through MidWest Chassis.
At that point they told me that there wouldn't really be any kind of warranty and that I'd need to contact MWC because Strange wasn't going to deal with me. I was told that I "tried to save some money by going thru someone other than Strange." So far, the customer service at Strange seems questionable to me...
I've got a degree in Management, and have worked in retail management for years, and for the life of me can't figure out why some places would rather argue with customers or refuse to replace something. It's always easier and better for your business if you take care of your customers. But, having said that, I haven't actually tried to get anyone to pay for anything, nor did anyone argue with me. But, I got the general feeling over the phone that if I were to ask for them to reimburse me that they'd tell me to take a hike.
Mid West Chassis, as usual, seemed very nice over the phone (it's been a few weeks since I've talked to them). Their customer service is always outstanding. When I told them about the rear end they were more shocked than anything that I was having problems, because these are some beast rear ends.
Today I talked to the mechanic who's doing the work on it and he said he thinks it's going to be the carrier bearings, based on how it drives. If that's the case I'll be out about $250 if it didn't kill anything else... like the truetrac or the gears themselves. We'll have to see.
Now, I haven't ever had sticky tires on the car, it's probably ~375rwhp, just bolt-ons and a cam and M6 with monster clutch. This car has never been to the drag strip. Period. The 21000 miles that I put on this rear end was done since Dec of 2009.
I'll keep everyone posted as to what actually went wrong, and I doubt I'll end up raising any stink over something like this. I hate that my bullet proof rear end is having problems so soon, especially since I haven't even been rough on it. I kinda thought that Strange would have wanted to do anything to make sure that I was taken care of, especially since so many people are interested in this rear (versus others) for it's strength/reliability.
Dare I say that if I had to do it over again I would have spent the extra and gotten a 9" from Midwest??? I have a feeling that they'd handle this differently if this were one of their own...
21000 miles just seems too early for this crap to be going on. My stock carrier bearings lasted 130k, and that was with me abusing the crap out of some 4.10s that I set up myself... BTW, I'd be doing the work on it this time if I had time. But, that's life.
So, I guess this makes me the first...
Pretty shitty that it went down like it did...with the cruise control on... not coming out of the hole and running a 1.30 60' time, lol. 
03-22-2011, 05:52 PM
#2
Sucks to hear...I'll be doing a full rebuild of my Strange 12-bolt this year (hopefully). I will not, however, be dealing with Strange on this one. They seem to make decent products, but their customer service sucks, which is why I went through a distributor to begin with.
03-22-2011, 06:02 PM
#3
you know its crappy that they acted like that but there is two things here. one is its a performance car part. VERY VERY few places even have a warranty for parts on a car with any modifications. second working at the dealer i have seen plenty of rears fail with less than 10-15k on them t56 you name it.
this is also why if I do have a problem (knock on wood) I will go through central racing parts to handle any issues. carl has proven to be a stand up guy.
this is also why if I do have a problem (knock on wood) I will go through central racing parts to handle any issues. carl has proven to be a stand up guy.
03-22-2011, 08:08 PM
#4
I suppose you're right. It's a performance part being used in a moddified car. That's partially why I am not really expecting anyone to do anything about it. It's almost embarassing to ask. Im anxious to see what the problem actually is.
I guess I just wanted to post this up as an FYI. I don't think there was anything I could have done to prevent it either. I followed the break-in procedures, changed the fluid as recommended, and refilled with the recommended fluid. I never did a burnout with it, only grabbin gears... and never from a stand-still (tires suck), only from a roll. Usually I practiced the art of grandma'ing my way into 24mpg on the highway. Maybe I should have treated it like crap, lol.
I guess I just wanted to post this up as an FYI. I don't think there was anything I could have done to prevent it either. I followed the break-in procedures, changed the fluid as recommended, and refilled with the recommended fluid. I never did a burnout with it, only grabbin gears... and never from a stand-still (tires suck), only from a roll. Usually I practiced the art of grandma'ing my way into 24mpg on the highway. Maybe I should have treated it like crap, lol.
03-22-2011, 09:44 PM
#6
Ive been a bit skeptical of the axle bearings used in many aftermarket rears some are ball bearing and others are roller but I often see the term green bearings used.
I thought my s60 would have ball bearings but turned out they used roller so I feel a little better about it. and the inside is open so im sure the gear lube gets to them on turns just fine.
I thought my s60 would have ball bearings but turned out they used roller so I feel a little better about it. and the inside is open so im sure the gear lube gets to them on turns just fine.
03-22-2011, 09:55 PM
#7
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(Haven't driven the T/A in a while due to rear being down)
However, with the truck, I find the more I beat the ever living snot out of it, the less often stuff breaks. The times that I have figured I'd take it easy on it, something always breaks.... odd.
However, with the truck, I find the more I beat the ever living snot out of it, the less often stuff breaks. The times that I have figured I'd take it easy on it, something always breaks.... odd.
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03-23-2011, 04:28 AM
#8
I wouldn't make excuses about no warranty or its a performance part. Its designed and marketed for what you use it for and is built accordingly. Just sounds like you got a lemon out of the bunch. Another thing you don't pay stock prices for performance another reason it should still have some form of warranty. I tend to shy away from things or businesses that won't stand behind their product and strange has done this for years, that's why a lot of shops deal with moser
03-23-2011, 05:55 AM
#9
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It sounds to me like there might have just been a flawed bearing in the bunch. It is disheartening that happened. I wish you luch in the long run and hopefully this doesnt cost you more than stated. I will pray this doesnt happen to me.
I know you stated that you would have gone with the 9 inch but in all reality this stuff can happen. It has happened with the 9", 12 bolt as well. Sometimes there is just a flaw in these parts there are plenty of threads out there on it.
I know you stated that you would have gone with the 9 inch but in all reality this stuff can happen. It has happened with the 9", 12 bolt as well. Sometimes there is just a flaw in these parts there are plenty of threads out there on it.
03-23-2011, 10:17 AM
#10
Did you grease the housing ends, they have grease fittings some people dont know about if they had a shop install it. Or its easy to over look them if you had the brakes already installed kinda covering them up.
Who did you talk to? Ed at strange stood behind some warranty work for me over the years. I would try to talk to him, maybe you got someone that sucks. 2 weeks ago i talked to Chris in sales about missing hardware on a brake kit. (one nut, one bolt, one sleeve) I opened 15mins before, In sealed boxes, drop shipped right from them. The other side was complete, basically told me to go pond sand. "thats a problem for were you bought them from, have them take care of it" (on order of $2K+ of strange parts) I bought the stuff from racecraft, mark there is the best and knows his stuff, he said hell take car of me after calling strange about it.
And didn't know what housing end they used on my s60 i also bought from them, had all my paperwork order/part numbers form him to tell me. "you have measure it and look it up yourself" Thats kinds hard to do when its in the car with brakes and tires on it.
I want to order a $700 set of rear brakes from you, to fit my $2,280 S60 read end from you. I would think you would be happy to look it up what parts you use, to make a sale.
Who did you talk to? Ed at strange stood behind some warranty work for me over the years. I would try to talk to him, maybe you got someone that sucks. 2 weeks ago i talked to Chris in sales about missing hardware on a brake kit. (one nut, one bolt, one sleeve) I opened 15mins before, In sealed boxes, drop shipped right from them. The other side was complete, basically told me to go pond sand. "thats a problem for were you bought them from, have them take care of it" (on order of $2K+ of strange parts) I bought the stuff from racecraft, mark there is the best and knows his stuff, he said hell take car of me after calling strange about it.
And didn't know what housing end they used on my s60 i also bought from them, had all my paperwork order/part numbers form him to tell me. "you have measure it and look it up yourself" Thats kinds hard to do when its in the car with brakes and tires on it.
I want to order a $700 set of rear brakes from you, to fit my $2,280 S60 read end from you. I would think you would be happy to look it up what parts you use, to make a sale.
Last edited by studderin; 03-23-2011 at 10:25 AM.
03-23-2011, 07:01 PM
#11
Yeah I talked to Ed. I asked if it had some kind of warranty and he said that it did, and even made it sound like he would work the system a little bit to stand behind it... but this was before he found out that it had 21k on it and that I got it from MWC. The tone totally changed and then it became "their" problem.
To be completely honest, I don't know how much I saved by going thru MWC, maybe a little. I wanted to go thru them because Eric had already spent a good bit of time with me over the phone shortly after he began marketing his Fab9. I figured that I should reward his excellent customer service with my business, even if I wasn't buying a product that he made. I still don't think this is their problem, nor would I expect them to have to fight over having this fixed on my behalf.
I still don't know what the problem is though. I did grease the wheel bearings (I love this feature). I feel like if it's a bad set of carrier bearings that it would be pretty petty to try and get someone to pay for it, especially if it means fighting for it. I hate having to drop the cash on it though.
I believe I spoke with Jason at MWC and he said that if it was the carrier, the trutrack, that I should definitely let them know about it because they feel like they could get someone to pay for some part of it in that case. But, I think if I were to get someone to try to pay for a bad set of carrier bearings (even though it's relatively new and unabused) that it would be one big eye-roll and I would be branded as another annoying customer.
I'd like to keep my reputation as a good customer intact with MWC because I could see myself using them again when I'm able to make a bracket car or road race car out of my Camaro. They make some good stuff - in addition to rearends. I wouldn't turn down help tho...
I'll let everyone know what's goin on with it.
To be completely honest, I don't know how much I saved by going thru MWC, maybe a little. I wanted to go thru them because Eric had already spent a good bit of time with me over the phone shortly after he began marketing his Fab9. I figured that I should reward his excellent customer service with my business, even if I wasn't buying a product that he made. I still don't think this is their problem, nor would I expect them to have to fight over having this fixed on my behalf.
I still don't know what the problem is though. I did grease the wheel bearings (I love this feature). I feel like if it's a bad set of carrier bearings that it would be pretty petty to try and get someone to pay for it, especially if it means fighting for it. I hate having to drop the cash on it though.
I believe I spoke with Jason at MWC and he said that if it was the carrier, the trutrack, that I should definitely let them know about it because they feel like they could get someone to pay for some part of it in that case. But, I think if I were to get someone to try to pay for a bad set of carrier bearings (even though it's relatively new and unabused) that it would be one big eye-roll and I would be branded as another annoying customer.
I'd like to keep my reputation as a good customer intact with MWC because I could see myself using them again when I'm able to make a bracket car or road race car out of my Camaro. They make some good stuff - in addition to rearends. I wouldn't turn down help tho...
I'll let everyone know what's goin on with it.
Last edited by KurtRardin; 03-23-2011 at 11:01 PM.
03-23-2011, 07:59 PM
#12
I didnt even see it had 21,000 miles! Thats a ton for a aftermarket part, and a race company too.
I think thats outside anything they could have been defective, you know. No way strange could stay open if they had a 21K warranty. The s60 is porbally the most bolt in/street thing they make. But you know that build carbon fiber brake kits, and spindle mount race only altered struts for pro mods. Stuff like that, there not making replacement parts. If anything maybe Timken has a warranty??
I think thats outside anything they could have been defective, you know. No way strange could stay open if they had a 21K warranty. The s60 is porbally the most bolt in/street thing they make. But you know that build carbon fiber brake kits, and spindle mount race only altered struts for pro mods. Stuff like that, there not making replacement parts. If anything maybe Timken has a warranty??
03-23-2011, 08:39 PM
#13
Yeah I see it more as a Timken problem too. I'm sorta with you about the mileage thing. If there was an issue with them overtorquing the main cap studs (which they've done) or some other build issue then the problem would have shown up sooner... a lot sooner. If it went out with only like 5k on the clock then I would be really pissed... and most likely would be taken care of by Strange.
On the other side of the coin though, if this had been a ZR1 vette with over 630hp out of the box, and the carrier bearings went out at 21k then I'd be beyond pissed if the dealer wouldn't fix it.
On the other side of the coin though, if this had been a ZR1 vette with over 630hp out of the box, and the carrier bearings went out at 21k then I'd be beyond pissed if the dealer wouldn't fix it.
03-23-2011, 09:19 PM
#14
Yeah I see it more as a Timken problem too. I'm sorta with you about the mileage thing. If there was an issue with them overtorquing the main cap studs (which they've done) or some other build issue then the problem would have shown up sooner... a lot sooner. If it went out with only like 5k on the clock then I would be really pissed... and most likely would be taken care of by Strange.
On the other side of the coin though, if this had been a ZR1 vette with over 630hp out of the box, and the carrier bearings went out at 21k then I'd be beyond pissed if the dealer wouldn't fix it.
On the other side of the coin though, if this had been a ZR1 vette with over 630hp out of the box, and the carrier bearings went out at 21k then I'd be beyond pissed if the dealer wouldn't fix it.
03-24-2011, 09:58 AM
#15
I hope things go well for you and sorry you are having these issues, keep in touch and if you need help with something let us know. Our hands might be tied for any type of warranty claim but I will try to help you out in other ways in the future.
03-26-2011, 11:30 PM
#16
Okay, the lock that holds the adjuster on the right hand side came off and the carrier shifted over 1/4". Carrier bearing on one side is toast, probably on the other side too. I ordered a new lock from Strange, just a few bucks.
We'll see if it hurt the ring gear... We're pretty much just waiting on the new lock to come in. I wonder how the lock came off???
We'll see if it hurt the ring gear... We're pretty much just waiting on the new lock to come in. I wonder how the lock came off???
03-27-2011, 12:45 AM
#17
Okay, the lock that holds the adjuster on the right hand side came off and the carrier shifted over 1/4". Carrier bearing on one side is toast, probably on the other side too. I ordered a new lock from Strange, just a few bucks.
We'll see if it hurt the ring gear... We're pretty much just waiting on the new lock to come in. I wonder how the lock came off???
We'll see if it hurt the ring gear... We're pretty much just waiting on the new lock to come in. I wonder how the lock came off???
Al in Tucson
03-27-2011, 08:56 AM
#20
I haven't been near the action to take a picture, though I would like to have some for others to see.
I've heard so many different horror stories for every make of rear end (except MWC), like axle tubes being welded on to housings at untrue angles (9"), or ring gear bolts being finger tight (12 bolt), or even main caps being over torqued (S60).
With 21k miles on the clock I would imagine that any stupid problems would have come up by now, but then again, maybe not. Maybe the difference in someone taking their new rear end out and running the crap out of it while brand new (which is what we're buying these things for) and then breaking something with only 3k on it is the same level of stress on certain parts as a daily driver that uses the cruise control for 21k. In other words, maybe the way I use it took longer to find the weak link in it's setup then it would have if all I did with it was race. Or, maybe that's just stupid logic.
I wish I had the time to be doing the work on it. It's driving me crazy, lol. I set up my own gears in my 10 bolt and drove them for years! Oh well.
I've heard so many different horror stories for every make of rear end (except MWC), like axle tubes being welded on to housings at untrue angles (9"), or ring gear bolts being finger tight (12 bolt), or even main caps being over torqued (S60).
With 21k miles on the clock I would imagine that any stupid problems would have come up by now, but then again, maybe not. Maybe the difference in someone taking their new rear end out and running the crap out of it while brand new (which is what we're buying these things for) and then breaking something with only 3k on it is the same level of stress on certain parts as a daily driver that uses the cruise control for 21k. In other words, maybe the way I use it took longer to find the weak link in it's setup then it would have if all I did with it was race. Or, maybe that's just stupid logic.
I wish I had the time to be doing the work on it. It's driving me crazy, lol. I set up my own gears in my 10 bolt and drove them for years! Oh well.
Last edited by KurtRardin; 03-27-2011 at 03:19 PM.