Broke a piston, will royal purple void warranty?
09-07-2012, 02:33 AM
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Broke a piston, will royal purple void warranty? So i managed to crack a piston and the dealer said that it had scored the cylinder wall. they said i need a new engine.
I have an extended warranty in place, but they have asked me for my oil change reciepts and I am having trouble finding them all. Ive gone to all the places i think i may have had it done, and only turned up a couple receipts.
Ive done a few oil changes myself using royal purple 5w30, but for some reason i have a feeling they could try to deny the warranty over it.
Can anyone tell me if Royal purple meets all of GMs specs? I called their 1800 number and the guy i spoke to couldnt tell me specifically if RP met those specs. Is there a list of the oils you can use somewhere?
I have searched for hours and nothing. I want to confirm that it's good to go before handing over a receipt to them.
Further, can anyone give me some insight on what to do in case i find out that RP voids the warranty? can they differentiate used RP from mobil 1, etc. in an oil analysis?
I have an extended warranty in place, but they have asked me for my oil change reciepts and I am having trouble finding them all. Ive gone to all the places i think i may have had it done, and only turned up a couple receipts.
Ive done a few oil changes myself using royal purple 5w30, but for some reason i have a feeling they could try to deny the warranty over it.
Can anyone tell me if Royal purple meets all of GMs specs? I called their 1800 number and the guy i spoke to couldnt tell me specifically if RP met those specs. Is there a list of the oils you can use somewhere?
I have searched for hours and nothing. I want to confirm that it's good to go before handing over a receipt to them.
Further, can anyone give me some insight on what to do in case i find out that RP voids the warranty? can they differentiate used RP from mobil 1, etc. in an oil analysis?
09-07-2012, 06:44 AM
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Who asked you for oil change receipts? The dealer? Are they actually providing the warranty or did they just sell it to you? I'm hoping they're just asking that so you have everything in order in case the agency administering your warranty tries to deny the claim or something.
In any case, the only thing that would void the warranty in this case is you doing something that blew out that piston, and the entity paying the warranty claim is responsible for proving that. That is always the case unless you signed something saying you'd have "XXX" change your oil every "XXX" miles, etc. and retain proof. Motor oil is motor oil. No logical way a particular brand would substantiate a warranty claim's denial.
In any case, the only thing that would void the warranty in this case is you doing something that blew out that piston, and the entity paying the warranty claim is responsible for proving that. That is always the case unless you signed something saying you'd have "XXX" change your oil every "XXX" miles, etc. and retain proof. Motor oil is motor oil. No logical way a particular brand would substantiate a warranty claim's denial.
09-07-2012, 07:02 AM
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I was an assistant manager at a GM dealership so i might be of "some help." First things first.....what year is the vehicle? if its pre 2011 then almost any 5w30 will meet requirements, but they should also be in the service manual. If it's after the 2011 or late 2010 and says DEXOS than you will need to see if the oil used meets GM Dexos requirements. I don't know them all for sure but when they started dexos i know not too many oils complied, there are quite a few now though.
the reasoning for the reciepts, (and even fluid and filter reciepts from personal oil changes) is to make sure that the dealer recommended mileage was followed. If this is an extended warranty, than you will need a good majority 85-90% of them for the approval. Not all extended warrantys are equal, some are very tough to deal with and some are fairly easy, but in your case i'm sure they will send an inspector as most do with any repair over $750. The catch is that you the consumer will have to approve tear down costs to find the root cause of failure, and then the warranty inspector will come in and check it all out and either approve or deny depending on what he/she is looking for. Dealership/inspector relationship also has good pull in the repairs, at least ours did. So yea, long story short.....they arent so concerned with the brand of oil used, they just need reciept proof the oil changed was performed at the proper intervals. Dates work just as well as mileage too.
I hope i answered some of your concerns, feel free to ask anything else you can think of and i'll see if i can help.
the reasoning for the reciepts, (and even fluid and filter reciepts from personal oil changes) is to make sure that the dealer recommended mileage was followed. If this is an extended warranty, than you will need a good majority 85-90% of them for the approval. Not all extended warrantys are equal, some are very tough to deal with and some are fairly easy, but in your case i'm sure they will send an inspector as most do with any repair over $750. The catch is that you the consumer will have to approve tear down costs to find the root cause of failure, and then the warranty inspector will come in and check it all out and either approve or deny depending on what he/she is looking for. Dealership/inspector relationship also has good pull in the repairs, at least ours did. So yea, long story short.....they arent so concerned with the brand of oil used, they just need reciept proof the oil changed was performed at the proper intervals. Dates work just as well as mileage too.
I hope i answered some of your concerns, feel free to ask anything else you can think of and i'll see if i can help.
09-07-2012, 08:28 AM
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I was an assistant manager at a GM dealership so i might be of "some help." First things first.....what year is the vehicle? if its pre 2011 then almost any 5w30 will meet requirements, but they should also be in the service manual. If it's after the 2011 or late 2010 and says DEXOS than you will need to see if the oil used meets GM Dexos requirements. I don't know them all for sure but when they started dexos i know not too many oils complied, there are quite a few now though.
the reasoning for the reciepts, (and even fluid and filter reciepts from personal oil changes) is to make sure that the dealer recommended mileage was followed. If this is an extended warranty, than you will need a good majority 85-90% of them for the approval. Not all extended warrantys are equal, some are very tough to deal with and some are fairly easy, but in your case i'm sure they will send an inspector as most do with any repair over $750. The catch is that you the consumer will have to approve tear down costs to find the root cause of failure, and then the warranty inspector will come in and check it all out and either approve or deny depending on what he/she is looking for. Dealership/inspector relationship also has good pull in the repairs, at least ours did. So yea, long story short.....they arent so concerned with the brand of oil used, they just need reciept proof the oil changed was performed at the proper intervals. Dates work just as well as mileage too.
I hope i answered some of your concerns, feel free to ask anything else you can think of and i'll see if i can help.
the reasoning for the reciepts, (and even fluid and filter reciepts from personal oil changes) is to make sure that the dealer recommended mileage was followed. If this is an extended warranty, than you will need a good majority 85-90% of them for the approval. Not all extended warrantys are equal, some are very tough to deal with and some are fairly easy, but in your case i'm sure they will send an inspector as most do with any repair over $750. The catch is that you the consumer will have to approve tear down costs to find the root cause of failure, and then the warranty inspector will come in and check it all out and either approve or deny depending on what he/she is looking for. Dealership/inspector relationship also has good pull in the repairs, at least ours did. So yea, long story short.....they arent so concerned with the brand of oil used, they just need reciept proof the oil changed was performed at the proper intervals. Dates work just as well as mileage too.
I hope i answered some of your concerns, feel free to ask anything else you can think of and i'll see if i can help.
Do your best to provide anything they ask for and hopefully you don't have any problems. In the event you do, e.g. your warranty claim is denied, just go see a lawyer. Yes it will cost you a 500 dollar retainer, most of which will be spent on 2 hours of the lawyer's time writing a letter but that will generally solve the problem and it's better than paying $3K or more for the new engine.
If the part was covered under warranty, and you didn't do something to directly cause the part to fail (and no, changing oil at 3975 miles instead of 3000 doesn't qualify) then they must cover the repair. You don't have to prove anything.
Look here for more info: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnuso...s_Warranty_Act
09-07-2012, 02:45 PM
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Hey guys, thanks for the replies.
So the warranty claim sent out an independent adjuster yesterday and my service advisor just called and said that the warranty company does not want to pay "because your vehicle has been modified"
because of intake/flowmaster and aftermarket wheels.
I said BS they are going to have to cover it whether they like it or not.
I mentioned Magnuson Moss and told him that my lawyer is going to go around and around with them until they cover it.
Give me some more ammo to use against these crooks please! paid 2500 for an ext warranty and now they try to tell me to go F myself...
If i get completely screwed over i am going to pick up my ride on a flatbed and tow it to a guy who can build me a cammed 418 or 427 stroker. It seems the cost would be the same as a factory replacement.
Can they sleeve the ls3/l92 block?
So the warranty claim sent out an independent adjuster yesterday and my service advisor just called and said that the warranty company does not want to pay "because your vehicle has been modified"
because of intake/flowmaster and aftermarket wheels.
I said BS they are going to have to cover it whether they like it or not.
I mentioned Magnuson Moss and told him that my lawyer is going to go around and around with them until they cover it.
Give me some more ammo to use against these crooks please! paid 2500 for an ext warranty and now they try to tell me to go F myself...
If i get completely screwed over i am going to pick up my ride on a flatbed and tow it to a guy who can build me a cammed 418 or 427 stroker. It seems the cost would be the same as a factory replacement.
Can they sleeve the ls3/l92 block?
09-07-2012, 03:07 PM
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There's nothing to go around with them about. Your lawyer will send them a "stop letter", with a deadline to uphold their commitment. If they don't, the next step is a lawsuit, at which point you no longer need to worry about legal fees, as they'll be liable for those. These ********* get away with this crap because they figure, correctly, that people won't bother with a lawyer or going to court. It's hard to imagine how intake or exhaust (wheels?!) would crack a piston, but it doesn't matter. The burden is on them to prove this caused the part to fail and if they can't, they are liable for their commitment. Call your local bar association and they will refer you to an attorney who specializes in magnuson moss cases. They will usually charge 20 to 50 bucks for this, which covers the cost of your consult. You're right. You paid 2500 bucks for peace of mind and reliable transportation. Don't let the slimy **** suckersget away with it. Its worth 50 bucks and an hour of your time.
You're not in the military are you?
You're not in the military are you?
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09-07-2012, 07:12 PM
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OP, I'm gonna apologize for writing novels in your thread, but this subject in particular infuriates me.
The extended service contracts people buy with used cars are not an extension of the factory warranty. They have no affiliation with the automaker ("certified" used vehicles are sometimes an exception) at all. They are underwritten by smaller businesses who exclusively sell automotive service contracts. I would expect the big 3 to be familiar with Magnuson-Moss and honor their warranty without much fuss, unless it's shown you raced the car or otherwise abused it. These service contracts are sold as aftermarket "accessories" by the dealership, in exchange for a piece of the action on every contract sold. Here's how it works:
You buy car at dealership, and are frogmarched to the finance guy, who talks you into paying more, putting more down, whatever, then you're frogmarched to the accessory guy, who tries to sell you undercoating, rustproofing, clearbra, window tinting etc. Then, he feeds you a bullshit story about how his car's (same car as yours) ecu **** the bed. It's not covered under your powertrain warranty! It's a 5000 dollar part! Your car will be junk! OR... you can buy this extended warranty and you're covered. You come here, we fix it, they pay us... no problem. They assume you're like most Americans and don't have lots of cash on hand, so they sweeten the deal by offering to roll it into your loan. They show you that it only adds 20 bucks to your monthly payment. They avoid mentioning the actual cost.
But your used car WILL break, right? It is a good deal, isn't it? In fact, how do these people even make money doing this? See the OP's last post for your answer. The whole thing is predatory and dishonest and makes me want to puke.
Fact is, they did sell you a service contract. These contracts are almost never worth the cost, because they pull this **** every time, and its not worth paying a lawyer to get your cv boots replaced. This situation happens to be different, and it's worth doing what it takes to make them put their money where their mouth was.
The extended service contracts people buy with used cars are not an extension of the factory warranty. They have no affiliation with the automaker ("certified" used vehicles are sometimes an exception) at all. They are underwritten by smaller businesses who exclusively sell automotive service contracts. I would expect the big 3 to be familiar with Magnuson-Moss and honor their warranty without much fuss, unless it's shown you raced the car or otherwise abused it. These service contracts are sold as aftermarket "accessories" by the dealership, in exchange for a piece of the action on every contract sold. Here's how it works:
You buy car at dealership, and are frogmarched to the finance guy, who talks you into paying more, putting more down, whatever, then you're frogmarched to the accessory guy, who tries to sell you undercoating, rustproofing, clearbra, window tinting etc. Then, he feeds you a bullshit story about how his car's (same car as yours) ecu **** the bed. It's not covered under your powertrain warranty! It's a 5000 dollar part! Your car will be junk! OR... you can buy this extended warranty and you're covered. You come here, we fix it, they pay us... no problem. They assume you're like most Americans and don't have lots of cash on hand, so they sweeten the deal by offering to roll it into your loan. They show you that it only adds 20 bucks to your monthly payment. They avoid mentioning the actual cost.
But your used car WILL break, right? It is a good deal, isn't it? In fact, how do these people even make money doing this? See the OP's last post for your answer. The whole thing is predatory and dishonest and makes me want to puke.
Fact is, they did sell you a service contract. These contracts are almost never worth the cost, because they pull this **** every time, and its not worth paying a lawyer to get your cv boots replaced. This situation happens to be different, and it's worth doing what it takes to make them put their money where their mouth was.
09-08-2012, 01:37 AM
#11
On a side note, if I were going to 'mod a car I wouldn't even bother with an extended warranty, because you know that even if all you do is get a set of wheels or an air freshener they'll label your car as an abused race car and deny your claim-not worth the hassle. 'OP, good luck and hang in there...
09-09-2012, 07:51 AM
#12
pistons dont just chip for no reason , when you do get it back together get someone to scan it for you with hp tuners/efi live etc...you must have an underlying condition that caused this that you will need to diagnose so it doesnt happen again.
I have spent many years previously into L67's ( sc 3800) and people would chip pistons on occasion , in that case it was usully improper supporting mods with too small an sc pulley causing timing to get pulled excessively from the tune due to detected knock retard.
pulled timing causes heat , which causes expansion and eventually the pistons would chip above the ringland as something had to give.People would say they never heard audible knock but they didnt have too as the tune will pull timing until it senses no knock.Different scenario/platform but something still caused that piston to get stressed to the point of failing and my money is on heat related somehow.It sounds like you have a truck , I have scanned a couple 5.3's and 6.0's that had quite a bit of knock retard showing up stock , I wonder if your intake and flowmaster made it worse (assuming it hasnt been tuned)
as far as the pieces dissapearing out the exhaust that is what typically happened on this other platform so that is probable , but they typically close the spark plug gap from smashing before exiting the exhaust valve was the plug gap closed up in that cyl ?
I have spent many years previously into L67's ( sc 3800) and people would chip pistons on occasion , in that case it was usully improper supporting mods with too small an sc pulley causing timing to get pulled excessively from the tune due to detected knock retard.
pulled timing causes heat , which causes expansion and eventually the pistons would chip above the ringland as something had to give.People would say they never heard audible knock but they didnt have too as the tune will pull timing until it senses no knock.Different scenario/platform but something still caused that piston to get stressed to the point of failing and my money is on heat related somehow.It sounds like you have a truck , I have scanned a couple 5.3's and 6.0's that had quite a bit of knock retard showing up stock , I wonder if your intake and flowmaster made it worse (assuming it hasnt been tuned)
as far as the pieces dissapearing out the exhaust that is what typically happened on this other platform so that is probable , but they typically close the spark plug gap from smashing before exiting the exhaust valve was the plug gap closed up in that cyl ?
09-09-2012, 09:27 AM
#14
You have yet to say what kind of car this is. You can get your money back from the extended warranty, might not be all but it will be pro-rated. It kills me to see people buy an extended warranty on a new GM vehicle when they come with a 5 year 100k miles powertrain waranty.
09-09-2012, 10:11 AM
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Service contracts do fall under the guidelines of the Magnuson - Moss act. They are different, in that the terms can be limited or conditional, based on what was conspicuously presented and agreed upon at its inception. There are a lot more gray areas, but again, worth the cost of a 50 dollar consult with a lawyer, since it could save a few grand. Things like a broken piston are exactly the kind of catastrophic events that provoke people to buy these contracts. The company will have a tough time not covering it. Not really a surprise that they'll try, and hope you just disappear.
09-09-2012, 10:43 PM
#16
it could be alittle worse. my buddy got a modded 05 gto from a dealer and they sold him a warranty and said it would cover anything on the drivetrain if it went down even though they knew it was modded. well his rear just gave out and they told him earlier in the month that it will not cover anything on the car due to the modifications (he had a wire short issue) what pissed us off is they assured him that it would cover the drivetrain, thats why he bought it. they also swapped out a spec stage 3 clutch with a factory clutch before he bought it and told him they replaced it with what went out on the car... hes pushing 491 to the rear
OP, dealers are sneaky and will try to screw you and profit off everything they can. since you were saying the engine is an ls3, its either an 08+ vette, 09 g8 gxp or a new camaro which should still be in the normal factory warranty or 5 years or 100k miles. the wheels shouldnt void the warranty but i could see it being the exhaust that they were most picky about. my other buddy had to put his old exhaust back on just to get his truck serviced
OP, dealers are sneaky and will try to screw you and profit off everything they can. since you were saying the engine is an ls3, its either an 08+ vette, 09 g8 gxp or a new camaro which should still be in the normal factory warranty or 5 years or 100k miles. the wheels shouldnt void the warranty but i could see it being the exhaust that they were most picky about. my other buddy had to put his old exhaust back on just to get his truck serviced
09-09-2012, 11:17 PM
#17
well even if it doesnt goes as youd hope, to hell with a new engine, just send your block to a machine shop, and put a forged rotating assembly in it, and put it back in, and youll be making more power, reliably i might add, and have spent less money. dont let em screw you. i have one too, and I screw them.
09-10-2012, 06:01 PM
#18
again I am drawing my experience from a different platform , but I still part out some 3800 sc cars and have sold many single piston with rings and connecting rod assemblies over the years to people with "chipped" pistons - people drop the oil pan and remove the head on that bank and slide another piston in and go. of course we havent seen what your piston looks like lol
09-10-2012, 08:27 PM
#19
it could be alittle worse. my buddy got a modded 05 gto from a dealer and they sold him a warranty and said it would cover anything on the drivetrain if it went down even though they knew it was modded. well his rear just gave out and they told him earlier in the month that it will not cover anything on the car due to the modifications (he had a wire short issue) what pissed us off is they assured him that it would cover the drivetrain, thats why he bought it. they also swapped out a spec stage 3 clutch with a factory clutch before he bought it and told him they replaced it with what went out on the car... hes pushing 491 to the rear
Either way, the dealer (as shitty as it may be) found a sucker and took him for his money.
