Castrol Synthetic 5-50 wt Oil
12-25-2007, 02:27 AM
#2
You know, I'm sure that there will be some better educated opinions on this, but I have to believe that the folks at the factory knew what they were doing. They specified given oil types based on research and maximum engine longevity.
I'm sticking with the factory recommendation. Then again, I live in California and never see a sub-zero temp.
I'm sticking with the factory recommendation. Then again, I live in California and never see a sub-zero temp.
12-25-2007, 02:57 AM
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You know, I'm sure that there will be some better educated opinions on this, but I have to believe that the folks at the factory knew what they were doing. They specified given oil types based on research and maximum engine longevity.
I'm sticking with the factory recommendation. Then again, I live in California and never see a sub-zero temp.
I'm sticking with the factory recommendation. Then again, I live in California and never see a sub-zero temp.
DH
German Castrol is 0W30.
12-25-2007, 11:24 AM
#6
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You can buy it at Beamer dealerships at different weights. They make GC 5W-30, etc....but the only one you can find at retail that I've ever seen is 0W-30 at Autozone. It also shows the best wear results according to Patman.
I can't imagine EVER using 5W-50 oil and I never would. It would have to be one hell of a motor to need that kind of thickness. Why in the hell are you seeing such high oil temperatures? You'd need a very hot running motor with BIG clearances inside that sees pretty much nothing but high performance applications to justify that kind of oil viscosity IMO, but what do I know?
To need a 50 weight oil, the motor needs to have large clearances. Otherwise, a thicker oil won't get into all the tight nooks and crannies. This will leave parts of the motor oil starved and can lead to premature failure. That's why I love 0W oil - for startup. Motors are oil starved at startup and the thinner the oil, the faster it gets to the tight areas and provides the best lubrication. If you know your motor has large clearances, a 50 weight oil would probably be fine, but if it's a precision motor and there are small clearances, the 50 weight oil is going to kill it quicker by not getting to the tight areas.
I can't imagine EVER using 5W-50 oil and I never would. It would have to be one hell of a motor to need that kind of thickness. Why in the hell are you seeing such high oil temperatures? You'd need a very hot running motor with BIG clearances inside that sees pretty much nothing but high performance applications to justify that kind of oil viscosity IMO, but what do I know?
To need a 50 weight oil, the motor needs to have large clearances. Otherwise, a thicker oil won't get into all the tight nooks and crannies. This will leave parts of the motor oil starved and can lead to premature failure. That's why I love 0W oil - for startup. Motors are oil starved at startup and the thinner the oil, the faster it gets to the tight areas and provides the best lubrication. If you know your motor has large clearances, a 50 weight oil would probably be fine, but if it's a precision motor and there are small clearances, the 50 weight oil is going to kill it quicker by not getting to the tight areas.
12-25-2007, 04:24 PM
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You can buy it at Beamer dealerships at different weights. They make GC 5W-30, etc....but the only one you can find at retail that I've ever seen is 0W-30 at Autozone. It also shows the best wear results according to Patman.
I can't imagine EVER using 5W-50 oil and I never would. It would have to be one hell of a motor to need that kind of thickness. Why in the hell are you seeing such high oil temperatures? You'd need a very hot running motor with BIG clearances inside that sees pretty much nothing but high performance applications to justify that kind of oil viscosity IMO, but what do I know?
To need a 50 weight oil, the motor needs to have large clearances. Otherwise, a thicker oil won't get into all the tight nooks and crannies. This will leave parts of the motor oil starved and can lead to premature failure. That's why I love 0W oil - for startup. Motors are oil starved at startup and the thinner the oil, the faster it gets to the tight areas and provides the best lubrication. If you know your motor has large clearances, a 50 weight oil would probably be fine, but if it's a precision motor and there are small clearances, the 50 weight oil is going to kill it quicker by not getting to the tight areas.
I can't imagine EVER using 5W-50 oil and I never would. It would have to be one hell of a motor to need that kind of thickness. Why in the hell are you seeing such high oil temperatures? You'd need a very hot running motor with BIG clearances inside that sees pretty much nothing but high performance applications to justify that kind of oil viscosity IMO, but what do I know?
To need a 50 weight oil, the motor needs to have large clearances. Otherwise, a thicker oil won't get into all the tight nooks and crannies. This will leave parts of the motor oil starved and can lead to premature failure. That's why I love 0W oil - for startup. Motors are oil starved at startup and the thinner the oil, the faster it gets to the tight areas and provides the best lubrication. If you know your motor has large clearances, a 50 weight oil would probably be fine, but if it's a precision motor and there are small clearances, the 50 weight oil is going to kill it quicker by not getting to the tight areas.
Well I was running 15-50 Mobil1. Which seemed fine in the summer. And I do track my car. 30 minute roadcoarse sessions will heat up the oil even with oil coolers to near 300* even in a stock Z06 (I have seen it)
I just switched to Mobil1 0-40 because the weather is in the low 50* and I noticed the cold start up oil pressure was taking a few seconds to register. my oil pressure is down 5 psi with this oil at idle and under 3000 rpm.
So this is why I am questioning a 5-50. Want to know how cold startup would be and if it will provide track temp protection and oil pressure. The 0-40 should provide same oil pressure/protection as ANY 40 wt ...... right?
This is a new 416 from SCDP, AFR 225 heads, cadilac racing lifters, and Smith Brother restrictive pushrods.
Any advise will be considered !!!
Thanks,
DH
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12-25-2007, 09:36 PM
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12-26-2007, 12:29 PM
#9
I hope you can overlook the fact that I compared your "non-factory" engine to those designed by the engineers in Detroit. I'm sure we could argue the point as to how different your engine really is from a factory build. However, the main point I was trying to make was that the people at the factory have statistics, research, and experience which lead up to their recommendation. I wouldn't start randomly throwing oil in my engine without having some degree of justification.
12-26-2007, 02:07 PM
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Actually, the 5W-40 is BC (Belgian Castrol).
To the O.P.;
I would NOT use ANY oil with that much spread in viscosity. Ideally, you want to use something with as little viscosity spread as possible to meet your engine's needs. Reason being that the manufacturers add A LOT of polymeric viscosity index improvers to oil in order for it to work over this large range. This leads to ALL kinds of problems with shearing/breakdown/thickening/sludge, etc., etc.
Even Red Line (and other high ester base stock content oils), must add V.I. improvers to anything over a 25 point spread, such as their Euro 5W-40, whereas they DO NOT have to add these to ANYTHING else in their lineup.
All of this is spelled out/explained on bobistheoilguy.com mentioned above, and will be confirmed by our resident oil expert (also on BITOG), Patman.
To the O.P.;
I would NOT use ANY oil with that much spread in viscosity. Ideally, you want to use something with as little viscosity spread as possible to meet your engine's needs. Reason being that the manufacturers add A LOT of polymeric viscosity index improvers to oil in order for it to work over this large range. This leads to ALL kinds of problems with shearing/breakdown/thickening/sludge, etc., etc.
Even Red Line (and other high ester base stock content oils), must add V.I. improvers to anything over a 25 point spread, such as their Euro 5W-40, whereas they DO NOT have to add these to ANYTHING else in their lineup.
All of this is spelled out/explained on bobistheoilguy.com mentioned above, and will be confirmed by our resident oil expert (also on BITOG), Patman.
12-26-2007, 03:25 PM
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Actually, the 5W-40 is BC (Belgian Castrol).
To the O.P.;
I would NOT use ANY oil with that much spread in viscosity. Ideally, you want to use something with as little viscosity spread as possible to meet your engine's needs. Reason being that the manufacturers add A LOT of polymeric viscosity index improvers to oil in order for it to work over this large range. This leads to ALL kinds of problems with shearing/breakdown/thickening/sludge, etc., etc.
Even Red Line (and other high ester base stock content oils), must add V.I. improvers to anything over a 25 point spread, such as their Euro 5W-40, whereas they DO NOT have to add these to ANYTHING else in their lineup.
All of this is spelled out/explained on bobistheoilguy.com mentioned above, and will be confirmed by our resident oil expert (also on BITOG), Patman.
To the O.P.;
I would NOT use ANY oil with that much spread in viscosity. Ideally, you want to use something with as little viscosity spread as possible to meet your engine's needs. Reason being that the manufacturers add A LOT of polymeric viscosity index improvers to oil in order for it to work over this large range. This leads to ALL kinds of problems with shearing/breakdown/thickening/sludge, etc., etc.
Even Red Line (and other high ester base stock content oils), must add V.I. improvers to anything over a 25 point spread, such as their Euro 5W-40, whereas they DO NOT have to add these to ANYTHING else in their lineup.
All of this is spelled out/explained on bobistheoilguy.com mentioned above, and will be confirmed by our resident oil expert (also on BITOG), Patman.
I currently put in the 0-40 wt Mobil1 and it definately reaches operating oil pressure quickly evn at 45 degrees this morning. But it is 5 psi short on idle up to about 2500 rpm when hot.
I think I am going to switch to Redline 10-40. It is still over the 25 point spread but the base of the oil is better....right? I just don't know if it will be thin enough on these cold mornings. How much thinner do you think 10-40 is than 15-50 ?????????
DH
12-27-2007, 02:23 PM
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Just how cold does it get where you are at the times you will be cold starting the car??
It can get VERY cold where I am and I use Red Line. What I do is mix 4 qts. of 5W-30 with 2 Qts. of 10W-40 (or 5 to 1 if it's a winter oil change interval). Red Line is one of the few oils you can safely and confidently mix different viscosites together without even thinking twice about it.
This is due to the ester blend base stocks they use being so compatable between the various viscosities, AND the fact that they use NONE of the afforementioned V.I. improvers in any of their weights EXCEPT for the Euro 5W-40. Their techs told me the 5W-40 is the only weight they have that he would possibly hesitate to mix with their other weights, due to their having to add some V.I. improvers to make that spread.
It can get VERY cold where I am and I use Red Line. What I do is mix 4 qts. of 5W-30 with 2 Qts. of 10W-40 (or 5 to 1 if it's a winter oil change interval). Red Line is one of the few oils you can safely and confidently mix different viscosites together without even thinking twice about it.
This is due to the ester blend base stocks they use being so compatable between the various viscosities, AND the fact that they use NONE of the afforementioned V.I. improvers in any of their weights EXCEPT for the Euro 5W-40. Their techs told me the 5W-40 is the only weight they have that he would possibly hesitate to mix with their other weights, due to their having to add some V.I. improvers to make that spread.
12-27-2007, 04:19 PM
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Just how cold does it get where you are at the times you will be cold starting the car??
It can get VERY cold where I am and I use Red Line. What I do is mix 4 qts. of 5W-30 with 2 Qts. of 10W-40 (or 5 to 1 if it's a winter oil change interval). Red Line is one of the few oils you can safely and confidently mix different viscosites together without even thinking twice about it.
This is due to the ester blend base stocks they use being so compatable between the various viscosities, AND the fact that they use NONE of the afforementioned V.I. improvers in any of their weights EXCEPT for the Euro 5W-40. Their techs told me the 5W-40 is the only weight they have that he would possibly hesitate to mix with their other weights, due to their having to add some V.I. improvers to make that spread.
It can get VERY cold where I am and I use Red Line. What I do is mix 4 qts. of 5W-30 with 2 Qts. of 10W-40 (or 5 to 1 if it's a winter oil change interval). Red Line is one of the few oils you can safely and confidently mix different viscosites together without even thinking twice about it.
This is due to the ester blend base stocks they use being so compatable between the various viscosities, AND the fact that they use NONE of the afforementioned V.I. improvers in any of their weights EXCEPT for the Euro 5W-40. Their techs told me the 5W-40 is the only weight they have that he would possibly hesitate to mix with their other weights, due to their having to add some V.I. improvers to make that spread.
I was running Mobil1 15-50 because I open track the car and the ZDDP level is good. There wasn't any problem untill the recent cold spell so temps went from mid 60-70 down to below 50 ..... then on cold starts I was getting the low oil pressure message for a couple of seconds. This never happened with my old engine (402) but on this one I put SmithBrother restricted flow push rods as this was recommended to help curb the abnormal amount of oil in the valve cover backing into the fresh air vent when in severe tracking environment. The push rods did not help by the way. So I am thinking (but don't know) that the oil pressure low reading may be partially attributable to this????
Anyways I put in some Mobil1 0-40 and was going to add ZDDP to this. I can feel the diferrence in the oil ... car revs quicker and starts up very smoothly with no valve train noise. So now I am trying to figure out if I should switch to Redline which already has good levels of ZDDP (right?) and is unquestionably a great oil (right??). But I don't know what to order.....the redline site says 10-40 for my application. I just don't want the same issue I was having with 15-50. So how much thinner is 10-40 than 15-50.
The only issue I see with the 0-40 is that my oil pressure is definatley lower. It is 5 psi lower in idle thru 2500 rpm when fully heated.... 25-26 at idle.
I don't have any problems with mixing as you are and adjusting as the climate changes. I don't mind paying more for the Redline as long as its the best!!
Thanks very much for your input
DH
12-27-2007, 05:57 PM
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Red Line has one of the highest ZDDP, phosphorus, and molybdenum levels of any of the non custom blended, off the shelf oils in existance.
Although they now claim an SM API rating (noticed this the last time I bought some) vs. their old SL rating. So I don't know if they lowered their zinc and phosphorus levels to meet the SM standard, or if they just slapped that rating on the same spec oil as before.
I called the techs on this and I got a 'nod nod, wink, wink' response like "don't worry, it still has all of the good stuff in there".
If you don't see much less than 40* F ambient temps, and you are open tracking the car for any length of time, I would just go ahead and run the straight 10W-40 in it. Or you could call their techs and ask their advice giving them ALL of your info/needs/useage/problems, etc. and see what they suggest.
Although they now claim an SM API rating (noticed this the last time I bought some) vs. their old SL rating. So I don't know if they lowered their zinc and phosphorus levels to meet the SM standard, or if they just slapped that rating on the same spec oil as before.
I called the techs on this and I got a 'nod nod, wink, wink' response like "don't worry, it still has all of the good stuff in there".
If you don't see much less than 40* F ambient temps, and you are open tracking the car for any length of time, I would just go ahead and run the straight 10W-40 in it. Or you could call their techs and ask their advice giving them ALL of your info/needs/useage/problems, etc. and see what they suggest.
12-27-2007, 06:50 PM
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Red Line has one of the highest ZDDP, phosphorus, and molybdenum levels of any of the non custom blended, off the shelf oils in existance.
Although they now claim an SM API rating (noticed this the last time I bought some) vs. their old SL rating. So I don't know if they lowered their zinc and phosphorus levels to meet the SM standard, or if they just slapped that rating on the same spec oil as before.
I called the techs on this and I got a 'nod nod, wink, wink' response like "don't worry, it still has all of the good stuff in there".
If you don't see much less than 40* F ambient temps, and you are open tracking the car for any length of time, I would just go ahead and run the straight 10W-40 in it. Or you could call their techs and ask their advice giving them ALL of your info/needs/useage/problems, etc. and see what they suggest.
Although they now claim an SM API rating (noticed this the last time I bought some) vs. their old SL rating. So I don't know if they lowered their zinc and phosphorus levels to meet the SM standard, or if they just slapped that rating on the same spec oil as before.
I called the techs on this and I got a 'nod nod, wink, wink' response like "don't worry, it still has all of the good stuff in there".
If you don't see much less than 40* F ambient temps, and you are open tracking the car for any length of time, I would just go ahead and run the straight 10W-40 in it. Or you could call their techs and ask their advice giving them ALL of your info/needs/useage/problems, etc. and see what they suggest.
DH
