Went to junkyard to scope out my first LSx details - Page 3 - LS1TECH



Generation III External Engine LS1 | LS6 | Bolt-Ons | Intakes | Exhaust | Ignition | Accessories
Sponsored by:
Sponsored by:

Went to junkyard to scope out my first LSx details

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Old 03-05-2017, 10:47 AM   #41
TECH Fanatic
Thread Starter
iTrader: (1)
 
kingtal0n's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: florida
Posts: 1,104
Default

So we start out with a little pressure wash, a little degreasing, a little scrubbing down


That knocked alot of loose dirt free, a good start.



After a little wire wheel they really shined up nice, this is just so I can see what I am working with.



make sure to put oil in the cylinders after any kind of serious wash, and crank the motor over to make all the water come out of the cylinders. I keep doing this, oil, crank, oil, crank, until I see no more water coming out, and only oil.



I mixed up some of joe's special secret sauce



And realized just how tight that balancer bolt was, ha



Cleaned up F-body balancer for installation,



And torqued it with a new bolt




And then... major issue with the exhaust studs. After breaking a bunch of drill bits, and snapped several extractor bits, one of them even inside one of the studs (yikes), I had to dremel it into a fine dust powder... and so I decided to pull the head and bring it to a machine shop. This was 100% my fault for not waiting long enough with the secret sauce, it probably would have been fine if I was more patient... but thats not going to happen! Full Speed A-head!

kingtal0n is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-05-2017, 12:20 PM   #42
TECH Senior Member
iTrader: (7)
 
Project GatTagO's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: The Druid City
Posts: 5,918
Default

Nice work. Clearly this is turning into a build thread. Maybe one of the mods can move it to the conversion forum?

Andrew
Project GatTagO is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-05-2017, 03:18 PM   #43
TECH Fanatic
Thread Starter
iTrader: (1)
 
kingtal0n's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: florida
Posts: 1,104
Default

I will make a new thread for "build thread" activity, eventually. Right now I am still working on the engine "external engine" so I thought this place appropriate. If somebody searches the external engine section for one of the topics thats been covered here, they will miss the info in this thread if it is moved away. My concern is only for the individuals who come searching for these topics, not for myself or visibility.

Right now my biggest lesson and hard learned advice to those looking to buy an LSx engine and start a project for the first time, and use an OEM engine without pulling the head, is this:
1. check to see that all or most of the exhaust studs are able to loosen before you buy the engine, and they are not excessively rusty
2. check the compression of the engine

If you can do those two things before you buy an engine, you could skip ~30 hours of fooling around with exhaust studs and exchanging engines.
kingtal0n is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-05-2017, 04:17 PM   #44
TECH Enthusiast
 
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 602
Default

Saw a few post back you were talking fuel Delivery, don't know if you decided yet, but
the Dorman stuff looks like what I am going to try. This guy had some good info, check
out post #4 Fuel Delivery - S-10
slogo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-05-2017, 05:34 PM   #45
TECH Fanatic
Thread Starter
iTrader: (1)
 
kingtal0n's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: florida
Posts: 1,104
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by slogo View Post
Saw a few post back you were talking fuel Delivery, don't know if you decided yet, but
the Dorman stuff looks like what I am going to try. This guy had some good info, check
out post #4 Fuel Delivery - S-10
thanks for reading, and responding! It is true I do not quite know what will happen yet with the fuel system. I only LOOKED at the fuel rail and it looks like a regular old 3/8" rubber hose will connect to it. So I just figure Ill run a hose from the regulator to the rail and be done with it. If it works fine I will upgrade to a pushloc deal, and clamp the end that ties to the rail with a regular hose clamp. The pushloc line I test fitted seems to be very tight. If not, I will clamp a stainless braided hose or go back to rubber. I dont know why all these people are cutting or flare tooling their lines, it seems strange to me, and I've never done anything like that, so it seems cryptic.
kingtal0n is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-09-2017, 11:47 PM   #46
TECH Fanatic
Thread Starter
iTrader: (1)
 
kingtal0n's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: florida
Posts: 1,104
Default

Some useful info I dug up for my re-assembly process. Hopefully pics in a day or two of that

Until then, with love
Stuff to do:
Clean the rocker arm pivot bolt threads with a wire brush

clean rocker arms, pivot *****, nuts or bolts, pushrods with solvent

check intake manifold to head with no gasket for weird space due to head decking

check rocker arms where they contact pushrod ends for damage galling roughspots etc

roll each pushrod for straightness
clean oil hole for pushrods

check rocker arm pivot bearings for binding and roughness

check spring installed height

apply moly base lubricant to rocker arm pivot and faces

check the camshaft lift with dial indicator

tap and clean the head bolt holes, use brake cleaner

Deck (head gasket surface) warpage limit 0.003 inch per 6 inches
'
Lobe life 5.3L from 2002:
Intake 0.268 inch
Exhaust 0.274 inch

extra info:
Main bearing oil clearance: V8 engines 0.0008 to 0.0021 inch

crankshaft end play 0.0015 to 0.007B inch

5.3L 98-02 Top compression ring end gap 0.010 to 0.016 inch
5.3L 98-02 Second compression ring end gap 0.017 to 0.027 inch


more stuff to do:
engine valley cover bolts 18ft lbs


Installation of pushrod/rocker:
lube lower end of pushrod and seat firmly into lifter
apply assembly lube to valve stem and upper pushrod end
apply clean engine oil to pivot shaft and bearing of rocker arm and install them loosely

rotate crank until number1 is TDC
3). With the number one piston is at TDC, tighten the intake
valve rocker arms for the Number 1, 3, 4, and 5 cylinders and the
exhaust rocker arms for the Number 1, 2, 7, and 8 cylinders. Tighten
each of the specified rocker arm bolts to the torque listed in this Chapter's
Specifications.
11 Rotate the crankshaft 360 degrees. Tighten the intake valve rocker
arms for the Number 2, 6, 7, and 8 cylinders and the exhaust rocker
arms for the Number 3, 4, 5, and 6 cylinders. Tighten each of the
rocker arm bolts to the torque listed in this Chapter's Specifications.




Intake manifold! : use medium strength threadlocking compound


head and deck:
10 The mating surfaces of the cylinder heads and block must be
perfectly clean when the heads are installed. Gasket removal solvents
are available at auto parts stores and may prove helpful.
11 Use a gasket scraper to remove all traces of carbon and old gasket
material, then wipe the mating surfaces with a cloth saturated with
lacquer thinner or acetone.

If there is oil on the mating surfaces when the heads are installed, the
gaskets may not seal correctly and leaks may develop. When working
on the block, use a vacuum cleaner to remove any debris that falls into
the cylinders.
12 Check the block and head mating surfaces for nicks, deep
scratches and other damage. If damage is slight, it can be removed with
emery cloth
. If it is excessive, machining may be the only alternative.
13 Use a tap of the correct size to chase the threads in the head
bolt holes in the block. If a tap is not available, spray a liberal amount
of brake cleaner into each hole. Use compressed air (if available) to
remove the debris from the holes.
9.17 Cylinder head bolt tightening sequence - all V8 engines
**WARNING:
Wear safety glasses or a face shield to protect your eyes when
using compressed air.
All cylinder head bolts should be replaced with new bolts
14 Position the new gaskets over the dowels in the block (see illustration).
15 Carefully position the heads on the block without disturbing the
gaskets.
16 Before installing the 8mm head bolts, coat the threads with a
medium-strength thread locking compound. Then install the new 8mm
head bolts (bolts 11 through 15).
17 Install new 11 mm head bolts (bolts 1 through 1 0) and tighten
them finger tight. Following the recommended sequence (see illustration),
tighten the bolts in four steps to the torque listed in this Chapter's
Specifications.

Annnnd pictures always help





Knee deep in the jungle soil, run quickly to avoid quicksand
kingtal0n is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-15-2017, 01:37 PM   #47
TECH Fanatic
Thread Starter
iTrader: (1)
 
kingtal0n's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: florida
Posts: 1,104
Default

Today is kinda day off so I will have a chance to upload a bunch of new pics of progress later,

at the moment I am still trying to tidy up the wiring, and I have a couple questions ATM if anyone feels like jumping in the water here...

Questions
1. The VSS on the 240sx normally goes from the VSS sensor -> cluster -> ECU
In the LSx engine, it goes from the VSS sensor -> ECU -> Cluster (It looks like, pin 50 is output speed from ECU)

So my question is, the speedo cluster in my 240sx dash is expecting a 2-wire signal from the VSS sensor, yet the LS ecu only outputs speed to a single wire. I am pretty sure if I take the VSS signal directly off the trans to the cluster like it wants, the speedo will read wrong. So how can I use the single wire (which I heard is customizable in the ECU sometimes) with my 2-wire cluster speedo input? Eh

2. Alternator wiring! Q's (I am using 98-02 Fbody alternator with 5.3L truck harness/ECU)
I notice that "teh web" says I need to wire pin "B" (same as pin "L") To the ECU "generator/alternator turn on signal"
My questions are:
A: can I also wire this pin"B" to my dash-charge lamp indicator light? JW (just wonderin') I know the MIL will trip for low voltage also but I wanted my little dash light to work also lol
B: Will the PCM control the duty-cycle of the alternator? The truck alt uses pin"C" for "field duty" but the camaro Alt doesn't have a wire there in pin "C", and I can't seem to find a def. answer to that, JW

some interesting alternator info:
http://67-72chevytrucks.com/vboard/s...4&postcount=20

Factory camaro alternator question

and a picture i make that shows the pins all around
kingtal0n is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-15-2017, 09:23 PM   #48
TECH Fanatic
Thread Starter
iTrader: (1)
 
kingtal0n's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: florida
Posts: 1,104
Default

This was 3-11-17 progress and explanation, please enjoy cookies










An what do ya know! 175psi across the board!

Last edited by kingtal0n; 03-16-2017 at 02:04 AM.
kingtal0n is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-16-2017, 11:53 AM   #49
Restricted User
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Ohio
Posts: 4,147
Default

[QUOTE=kingtal0n;19563365]Today is kinda day off so I will have a chance to upload a bunch of new pics of progress later,

at the moment I am still trying to tidy up the wiring, and I have a couple questions ATM if anyone feels like jumping in the water here...

Questions
1. The VSS on the 240sx normally goes from the VSS sensor -> cluster -> ECU
In the LSx engine, it goes from the VSS sensor -> ECU -> Cluster (It looks like, pin 50 is output speed from ECU)

So my question is, the speedo cluster in my 240sx dash is expecting a 2-wire signal from the VSS sensor, yet the LS ecu only outputs speed to a single wire. I am pretty sure if I take the VSS signal directly off the trans to the cluster like it wants, the speedo will read wrong. So how can I use the single wire (which I heard is customizable in the ECU sometimes) with my 2-wire cluster speedo input? Eh

2. Alternator wiring! Q's (I am using 98-02 Fbody alternator with 5.3L truck harness/ECU)
I notice that "teh web" says I need to wire pin "B" (same as pin "L") To the ECU "generator/alternator turn on signal"
My questions are:
A: can I also wire this pin"B" to my dash-charge lamp indicator light? JW (just wonderin') I know the MIL will trip for low voltage also but I wanted my little dash light to work also lol
B: Will the PCM control the duty-cycle of the alternator? The truck alt uses pin"C" for "field duty" but the camaro Alt doesn't have a wire there in pin "C", and I can't seem to find a def. answer to that, JW

1. https://ekwang.wordpress.com/2012/12...0sx-s13-speed/

2A: Yes, you can wire it to your charge indicator. This is how its done most of the time.
2B: Don't overcomplicate it. The alternator can be ran as a 1-wire setup using Pin B. It needs 12v from an ignition source plus ~470 OHMs of resistance, and it will put the alternator at ~90% duty cycle and give you just over 14V. This can either be done by wiring it through the charge indicator lamp, or grabbing a 10 cent 470 ohm resistor and putting it inline with a 12v ignition source going to pin B on the alternator connector.
JoeNova is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-16-2017, 11:53 AM   #50
Restricted User
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Ohio
Posts: 4,147
Default

Not being able to edit posts just made that a mess lol.
JoeNova is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-16-2017, 05:32 PM   #51
TECH Fanatic
Thread Starter
iTrader: (1)
 
kingtal0n's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: florida
Posts: 1,104
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeNova View Post
2B: Don't overcomplicate it. The alternator can be ran as a 1-wire setup using Pin B. It needs 12v from an ignition source plus ~470 OHMs of resistance, and it will put the alternator at ~90% duty cycle and give you just over 14V. This can either be done by wiring it through the charge indicator lamp, or grabbing a 10 cent 470 ohm resistor and putting it inline with a 12v ignition source going to pin B on the alternator connector.
just to clarify, i thought the ECU provided the resisted 12v source. the pinb is wired to the ECU through the engine harness... are you saying i can ALSO wire it to my lightbulb in the dash?or are you saying EITHER the bulb, or the ecu.
kingtal0n is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2017, 08:31 AM   #52
Restricted User
 
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: Ohio
Posts: 4,147
Default

Either. As long as pin B sees 12v with 470 ohms of resistance (which your charge indicator bulb normally has), it'll run at 90% duty cycle.
JoeNova is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-17-2017, 09:17 PM   #53
TECH Fanatic
Thread Starter
iTrader: (1)
 
kingtal0n's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: florida
Posts: 1,104
Default

I am just going to leave it like factory, let the ECU connect to it through the ECU pin 15 on the red plug to pin B on the alternator. If it gives me any trouble I will run it to the lamp in the car and call it a day
kingtal0n is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-18-2017, 01:46 AM   #54
Teching In
 
Join Date: Feb 2017
Posts: 1
Default

Nice job keeping track of everything, i was so confused on what to get when pulling my first lsx swap. If you want to verify wether its a 5.3 or 4.8 just look the vin up on google it should give you info on the truck and tell you specs.
Daniel Martinez is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-19-2017, 09:24 PM   #55
TECH Fanatic
Thread Starter
iTrader: (1)
 
kingtal0n's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: florida
Posts: 1,104
Default

This is 3-12-17
I had a lul in progress from 3-13 to 3-15 while I fooled around more with the harness. I had a couple concerns about the factory switched 12V feeding all of the injectors/coils so I wanted to something a little more robust, at least until I can test the amperage draw of the engine running. I also had to re-wire the injectors and coils to move them opposite sides, for some reason when I got the harness on the engine the way it seemed to want to fit into the 240sx (like an OEM 240sx harness) the cylinder #2 side was on the #1 side and the others were too short to even reach the other, wrong side.

Begin with alt bracket, if you search on the forum there are other members who have done this and show exactly how, I followed their directions with good results, although I know I wasn't perfect because I could tell the bracket wasn't absolutely perfect by the way it torqued down:



here is some of the wiring example I had to do



I compared LS6 to 5.3L valley cover gaskets out of curiosity



Decided to use the truck valley cover after all. The LS6 has a PCV port, or breather, it seems, that runs to the back of the engine. The last thing I want is another hole in the engine somewhere hard to reach.



I wanted to make sure there was no air if possible in the oil system, so I turned it over and watched the air come out of the other side while pouring into the oil pump. I am not sure that was important or necessary; I just figured I would do it anyways.




had to cut the ears off the 4l80e, I used a pretty big grinder to do this. It made a huge mess! Be sure to triple wrap the input shaft, and the dipstick port, and all of the electronics! Then, take a shower! haha there was aluminum in my ears...


Engine should be running in a couple days
kingtal0n is offline   Reply With Quote
Old Yesterday, 12:00 AM   #56
TECH Fanatic
Thread Starter
iTrader: (1)
 
kingtal0n's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: florida
Posts: 1,104
Default

This was 3-17-17

Pan fittings installed



Booted the computer up at home. First, segment swapped a DBC engine/DTC portion, then segment swapped a 4l80 trans sections into my native OS, then upgraded to the 2-bar map. So far invested 2 credits. I backed up the original OS and tune files so I can start over if necessary. I spent most of the day dealing with the computer and trying different things with varied results. HPtuners is new to me so it was and is still a learning curve.



When I loaded the scanner to check the TPS/MAP/IACV, at first it didn't show the TPS, and I got worried that it wasn't working. After a while I figured out why it looked like it wasn't working:



On to the engine, sikky says ya gota cut the rear section of the windage tray off. There doesn't seem to be any interference with the pan, so I have to guess this is for oil flow reasons.




I was really skeptical of the O-ring. So many have torns theirs. I actually wasn't comfortable using this large red one shown in the picture, it was too tight of a fit, and after I tried installing and removing it a couple times I did manage to tear it. I was not surprised; I think some O-rings are better than others as far as fitment goes, or there might be a trick to the installation I haven't figured out yet. I wound up using the one sikky provided, which was slightly larger inside diameter, but seemed to fit snugly also.




Got a look inside the motor since i had to pull the tray anyways



At this point I mostly finished the trans mounts, and I was waiting on the driveshaft (I got it back today) to see if my best guess was close enough for the pinion angle to be correct. I hope to investigate tomorrow but it is supposed to rain, so it might have to wait until friday. Most of the threads I read about this swap involve "hammering the trans tunnel" however, I see no reason to do this yet, unless the trans needs to be raised alot more to get the right pinion angle. It barely fits but it definitely seems to fit without having to hammer a single thing. In fact even the hammering I did around the bellhousing seemed like overkill, there is plenty of room all around, even for those "ears" I took off of the trans.

I am doing all of this in the grass/mud but I am able to put down a plate if I need to pick something heavy up (like a car or engine). I think I will do one more post that leads into the trans/wiring but then that will be it for this "external engine" thread, I will make a new thread for "assembly" of the drivetrain in an appropriate location.

Last edited by kingtal0n; Yesterday at 11:08 PM.
kingtal0n is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Related Topics
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Need some help with a friend's cousin's car HPTuners, pictures inside kingtal0n PCM Diagnostics & Tuning 27 02-24-2017 11:42 PM
Would you pay $227 for this 5.3L Engine kingtal0n Generation III External Engine 26 02-24-2017 11:30 AM
WTB: 1995+ Nissan 240sx (With or without LSx) kingtal0n Vehicles Wanted 1 01-16-2017 12:15 PM


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off



All times are GMT -5. The time now is 03:21 PM.


 
  • Ask a Question
    Get answers from community experts
What's your question?
Send