where to find torque?
11-03-2008, 06:19 PM
#1
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where to find torque? I dynoed my car and it did 430hp and 383tq with an m6. I want more torque. My current setup is
Fast 92/92
Ls6 stage 1 heads
ms4 cam
42# injectors
lid
pacesetter longtubes
y pipe
slp exhuast
stage 2 clutch
Would it be a good idea to increase the compression. Would a new head gasket that is thinner maybe .30 help any. Shave heads flycut the pistons............ I just want to see that tq go up. I honestly thought it would of been higher. But the dyno shows a smooth pull on the graph up to 6700rpms. I scanned the car and looked at the ve tables and they were pretty rough. This is after I paid 400 dollars for a dyno tune. Dont the tuners usually smooth that out. I did not look at my timing. Bottom line is tq. Hp is a lot easier to get. Tq is what I dont get. I would like to keep this setup for now at least. Any input would be great thanks!
Fast 92/92
Ls6 stage 1 heads
ms4 cam
42# injectors
lid
pacesetter longtubes
y pipe
slp exhuast
stage 2 clutch
Would it be a good idea to increase the compression. Would a new head gasket that is thinner maybe .30 help any. Shave heads flycut the pistons............ I just want to see that tq go up. I honestly thought it would of been higher. But the dyno shows a smooth pull on the graph up to 6700rpms. I scanned the car and looked at the ve tables and they were pretty rough. This is after I paid 400 dollars for a dyno tune. Dont the tuners usually smooth that out. I did not look at my timing. Bottom line is tq. Hp is a lot easier to get. Tq is what I dont get. I would like to keep this setup for now at least. Any input would be great thanks!
11-03-2008, 06:41 PM
#2
When you add the cylinder heads, and cam you greatly decrease you dynamic compression ratio which great decrease torque. You can mill the heads and flycut the pistons and run a thinner gasket but only so much and you will HAVE to run 93 but i could see you picking up an each 30rwtq. You coul also add and x pipe (if you have room) for probably another 7-10rwtq.
11-03-2008, 07:49 PM
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It is a lsa 112. I think the tune could be better. I see autos pushing more torque then me. I threw all this money on this fast manifold too. I feel I could have done without. I thought timing played a big role in torque? Should I take it too another tuner.
11-03-2008, 07:54 PM
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When you add the cylinder heads, and cam you greatly decrease you dynamic compression ratio which great decrease torque. You can mill the heads and flycut the pistons and run a thinner gasket but only so much and you will HAVE to run 93 but i could see you picking up an each 30rwtq. You coul also add and x pipe (if you have room) for probably another 7-10rwtq.
11-03-2008, 08:20 PM
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If you want torque you have the wrong cam. Do a search and you will see the MS4 is not a torque cam. I dought the tuner is your problem in this case. And I wouldn't raise your compression to band aid a poor cam choice.
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11-03-2008, 09:21 PM
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Yeah, get some professional help sorting out your engine. It is available, right *****? You need to tell the engine designer the results you want, not how to get there.
11-03-2008, 10:16 PM
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When you add the cylinder heads, and cam you greatly decrease you dynamic compression ratio which great decrease torque. You can mill the heads and flycut the pistons and run a thinner gasket but only so much and you will HAVE to run 93 but i could see you picking up an each 30rwtq. You coul also add and x pipe (if you have room) for probably another 7-10rwtq.
https://ls1tech.com/forums/showthrea...dcr+calculator
It's basically a way to figure out what compression ratio a cam requires to make good torque without detonation on pump gas. I don't think the MS4 will plug directly into the spreadsheet but you can use some similar comp grinds to get an idea.
11-03-2008, 10:23 PM
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That cam is not well suited as a torque/low end power cam. Its valve events are very favorable in the high end range which is what is was designed for. The overlap and early intake valve closing point will limit the amount of torque that cam can produce.
Your head design and gaskets will make a difference but you dont have much room to work with in terms of chamber size when you run a cam that large so getting a tight quench area is likely out of the question.
I have a medium cam 232/236 on a 112 and I made over 450 RWHP and 415 RWTQ and the car pulls great down low and on top. It doesnt always take a huge cam to make good numbers.
Your head design and gaskets will make a difference but you dont have much room to work with in terms of chamber size when you run a cam that large so getting a tight quench area is likely out of the question.
I have a medium cam 232/236 on a 112 and I made over 450 RWHP and 415 RWTQ and the car pulls great down low and on top. It doesnt always take a huge cam to make good numbers.
11-04-2008, 09:03 AM
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Cam is a top end, horse-power making cam grind. Replace your bottom end with more cubes and you'll get more torque. Other than that, put in a smaller duration cam.
These 346cid's are notorious for "lacking" torque when pulling horses out of it. More HP usually results in a TQ drop, from what I've seen. Obviously, this is not always the case.
These 346cid's are notorious for "lacking" torque when pulling horses out of it. More HP usually results in a TQ drop, from what I've seen. Obviously, this is not always the case.
11-04-2008, 12:53 PM
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Cam is a top end, horse-power making cam grind. Replace your bottom end with more cubes and you'll get more torque. Other than that, put in a smaller duration cam.
These 346cid's are notorious for "lacking" torque when pulling horses out of it. More HP usually results in a TQ drop, from what I've seen. Obviously, this is not always the case.
These 346cid's are notorious for "lacking" torque when pulling horses out of it. More HP usually results in a TQ drop, from what I've seen. Obviously, this is not always the case.
11-04-2008, 01:19 PM
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DCR and Timing my friend. Lots of good advice here.
How much timing are you running through the mid range and top end? Can you post your tune that the Dyno Tune gave you?
How much timing are you running through the mid range and top end? Can you post your tune that the Dyno Tune gave you?
11-07-2008, 11:59 PM
#17
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Ok so what cam would you guys recommend that would work well with the ls6 heads. They are stage 1 cnc ported. The ms4 cam I didnt think was a bad choice. I found something interesting when I scanned my car with hp tuners. My timing was set at 25*. That seems low. On the last dyno run the guy leaned it out. I couldnt exactly tell but it looks to be in the 12.8 a/f ratio. My VE tables were not smooth at all they looked like shitt to be honest and my timing map looked even worse. I paid 400 dollars. Should I get my money back. The car pulled clean too 6700 rpms which is nice. I put the car in speed density and deleted the maf sensor and put a big *** intake tube to meet the fast 92/92 combo and also I installed a slp underdrive pulley. I think I should add timing. Are there any tuners on here that could help me out. Any help would be great I dont know how to post pictures on the threads. I could post my dyno graph if I knew how. Oh and I am putting a th350 in the car with a 3500+ torque convertor so I like the powerband of the ms4 with the ratios in that tranny. But any suggestions on other cams would be great. They are not that hard too change. Thanks for the advice guys it has been extremely helpful.
