Notmyvette

iTrader: (1)

Putting back together (with a deadline) the ls1 for the vette in my sig and cant find the baffle/tray that bolts inside the oil pan...Can I get by without it? I do have the windage tray that bolts to the mainstuds, just not the one inside the pan...I took it out so I could steamclean the pan
thnaks

Hilton

iTrader: (36)

Nevermind, I misread that.

Notmyvette

iTrader: (1)

anyone? I'm about to put it together without it

98RedBird

iTrader: (77)

It was in there for a reason... If you didn't need it the car wouldn't have come with it.

Notmyvette

iTrader: (1)

If I paid good $$$$ for a car I would want a well engineered engine....which is what the baffle contributes too. Engineering the most power for the money, if you can gain 10hp at high rpm from oil not getting thrown back on the rotating assembly by putting in a 50 cent piece of metal in it's going to be done. Is something like that NEEDED? no...kinda like if your car cames with a 6th speed, is it Needed? not at all but it sure is nice.

What I really mean to ask is will I harm anything by not using it? besides giving up a couple hp at high rpm?

lovescamaros28

Why would you want to remove the windage tray? The windage tray prevents oil from becoming aerated by the rotating crankshaft which would cause oil circulation problems.It also can protect motor oil from foaming by preventing oil from sloshing around in the oil pan away from the pickup tube.I would recommend finding some new bolts.

98RedBird

iTrader: (77)

Agreed. I guess I should have elaborated in more detail in my first post.

Yes, the windage tray prevents the hp loss at higher RPM, this is common knowledge, but that is not all it does. It affects performance as well as durability. If you want to know all of the different functions of a windage tray and want to know why you would want to leave it intact on your car, google it. Plenty of information there.

If you absolutely must put it back together without it, as you say you're on a deadline, then I guess you can, but if it were me, I'd re-assemble it the correct way.

Notmyvette

iTrader: (1)

New bolts? I have the bolts for it just not the tray, the owner of the car basically lost it. From what I remember it (might be wrong) it was only a plate that prevented the flinging oil from hitting the oil in the sump, and did not have any vertical plating going down to help the oil from sloshing around. The pan has webs on the inside that seem to be more for that and for strength.

I see it as being helpful but not a requirement....There's millions of cars out there without a windage tray and they certainly don't have oiling problems.....just how I look at it, and plus I do have the one on the main studs which covers a decent area so it's not that bad.

Just in case anybody is misreading it, the windage tray is lost and I'm on a deadline to get the motor in the car, I'm not just taking it out for "less weight" or something so thats the reasoning of this question

00MaroonZ28

iTrader: (3)

Get the windage tray!! Yes, you will need it.

Hilton

iTrader: (36)

I thought he was talking about the windage tray too until I reread the original post. He's got the windage tray. The discussion is whether he needs the small tray that's bolted to the bottom of the oil pan with a hole in the middle of it. It goes beneath the windage tray, two or so inches from the bottom of the pan.

I still don't know the answer. I'm guessing it's for when you drop something in the oil pan that's not supposed to be in there (like an EZ out, don't ask) Probably another layer of protection keeping it from hitting the crank.

lovescamaros28

Do whatever you think your engine can handle.One is the windage tray,and the other is the anti-slosh baffle.

Notmyvette

iTrader: (1)

Yeah it's not what I would call a windage tray, it's a pan that bolts inside the pan above the oil with a hole in it for the pickup tube to go into to. I guess no one read when I wrote "I do have the windage tray that bolts to the mainstuds, just not the one inside the pan..."? Maybe other ls1 pans dont have it? idk but I know the vette pans are different than the others.

I know it's not one of those "if you dont put it in the motor might blow up"....it's a piece of steel....it's so any oil that doesnt get stopped by the windage tray thats bolted to the main caps (which I have), this will prevent any of that oil that made it past the windage tray to get thrown into the oil in the pan and cause foaming/aeration....I agree now the oil might get a little more aerated than with that tray but think about it theres MILLIONS of cars without one. It's not going to blow up without it.

The point of this thread was just to get me aware of any knowledge about that little piece of steel in the pan with the hole in it that I might not know about since I'm new to these motors....I'm going to look around the house some more but if I can't find it then the pans going on without it

PREDATOR-Z

Find one, it is necessary to prevent too much aeration of oil.
Your theory that millions of other motors don't have it is flawed.
This is a LS motor and with its oil pump design it is better not to have air in your oil, that could lead to catastrophic oiling issues and eventualy motor failure.

Notmyvette

iTrader: (1)

The ls1 and my mustangs oil pump has the same oil pump design....g-rotor design or something I forget the name of it, the stang pump is just smaller in size....None of the 289,302, or 351 motors had windage trays in them.

You know I'm not talking about the windage tray on the main caps right? That is its main job to block the oil from hitting the oil in the sump, that one takes most of the beating..

PREDATOR-Z

Yes, you described it well. Windage tray is to prevent crank splashing.
Pan baffle screen is to prevent oil aeration and excessive slush when applying hard Gs in cornering or slalom situations.
I know what you are talking about.

Basicaly, your motor will not be happy if your pump has hickups due to aerated oil, That could lead very quicly to oil starvation on bearings and we both know what that means.

Be patient, look at what a stupid pinched oil ring can do to a LS motor. How much does that ring cost?
Peanuts Vs a new motor, yet it is vital.

Notmyvette

iTrader: (1)

Ok so here's a pic of the vette pan......you can see where the tray bolted down where the 7 bolt holes are....the pan lays inside the oil pan FLAT...so if it's flat how is it going to act as a anti slosh baffle? The oil just sits below it...The only purpose it can serve is as a secondary windage tray..The pan already has webbing in it so the oil to act as the baffles....

JFM-jr

iTrader: (23)

I think the anti slosh comment was with an F body pan in mind. Your reasoning/thoughts seem logical. Tho it's hard to escape the thought that it was put there for a reason by GM engineers. I'd hate to find out why it's there (and needed) the hard way but if you do decide to run it then keep us updated.

PREDATOR-Z

Take a glass of water, fill about 3 inches. Look at it flat, liquid (although slightly concave) looks 3 inch flat.
Tilt the glass at angle, now liquid mark is more on one side than the other. That is why that sheet is in there. To prevent execcessive oil shift and displacement, to keep oil more level, less aerated.

Sorry for the babyish explanation but i just wanted to give you a visual.

RaceDriver

iTrader: (1)

It doesn't really make sense not to replace that part. Just buy one and put it on there.

Yeah, you can get away without it (more so on the Vette than the F-Body because the Vette has baffle walls cast into the pan), but if you track your car at all it will greatly increase the chances of oil starvation and it will also increase aeration and slosh which can rob you of horsepower and cause your engine to burn oil.

Notmyvette

iTrader: (1)

Well im bored so figured I would let whoever's interested that the motors in and runs great...4500k miles so far and no problems, besides bad maf, bad starter and everything else lol but the engine itself is fine. The owner has brought it to redline several times, its an autocar and sometimes it takes a second to shift to the next gear so yea it has even bounced off the limiter a few times...Tune related? or maybe since the trans isnt in best shape idk....either way not my problem since it's not my car and I don't beat on it when I do drive it.

Engine doesnt burn oil, leak oil, or smoke at all.
Figured someone might want to know what happened.

But if it was my car yes I would have just waited and picked one up....
Just at the time there was huge time and money restraints on having this running so it went in with no oil slosh plate