Goal: 500whp with MP112
04-09-2012, 11:05 AM
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Goal: 500whp with MP112 Been working in the GM 3800S/C V-6 world for a few years and have extensive tuning and building knowlege for that engine. New to the LSx world and looking for input. I've been doing extensive reading on cams and heads and such here and have some good answers. 2004 GTO with 5.7L. My goal with the car is a daily driven 500whp and pull 11.5s at the track with no loss in reliability. I already have a MP112 magnacharger and don't currently know what it is dynoing at with all the supporting mods, exhaust, springs, etc. Trying to just step it up a bit.
Was looking at going with 5.3 heads and 58-59cc chambers and smaller head gasket, probably .045 and adding the GT2-3 cam LS1-GT2-3 207/220 .571"/.578" 118.5 which I've read good things about with the MP112.
Things I'm worried about are PVC with the smaller gasket and head milling. Deck height is stock, pistons are stock so far as well. Anything else I need to look at/plan for here. I have HPTuners already, so not worried about getting it dialed in once put together.
Was looking at going with 5.3 heads and 58-59cc chambers and smaller head gasket, probably .045 and adding the GT2-3 cam LS1-GT2-3 207/220 .571"/.578" 118.5 which I've read good things about with the MP112.
Things I'm worried about are PVC with the smaller gasket and head milling. Deck height is stock, pistons are stock so far as well. Anything else I need to look at/plan for here. I have HPTuners already, so not worried about getting it dialed in once put together.
Last edited by superGTO; 04-12-2012 at 10:47 AM.
04-09-2012, 01:57 PM
#2
If I were you I'd keep the 241's that are on the car and port/mill them unless you can get a hell of a deal on the 5.3 heads and have them ported/milled.....either should easily get you to your goal and with that can "should have " plenty of ptv clearance...but I would clay the heads to be sure.
The better you can get the head to flow the cooler your intakeair temp will be and make more power with the same boost.
Is the MP112 a stock 3.8 charger? I have one laying in the garage that I thought about trying on an ls1 some day, but didn't know if they flowed enough.
The better you can get the head to flow the cooler your intakeair temp will be and make more power with the same boost.
Is the MP112 a stock 3.8 charger? I have one laying in the garage that I thought about trying on an ls1 some day, but didn't know if they flowed enough.
04-09-2012, 05:02 PM
#3
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So, you already have the 112 installed and you are at 400 whp? That's way low man, way low. The LPE cam you have spec'd is almost identical to the LS6 cam that can be had for maybe $100. If you are looking for a little more power than this with stock drivability look for either and LS7 cam or an LS9...they are identical except the LS7 has 120* LSA and the LS9 has 122* LSA (and still only $100). Or, you can go aftermarket...EPS, Thunder Racing, Cam motion are all good places to start. I would not pay an aftermarket premium ($400) for something that close to OE specs.
5.3 heads are not the way to go with this build, I would recommend OE 243 or 799 heads over worked 5.3 heads since you do not really want to go over 10:1 with a 112. The 112 is a heat pump and the increase in compression ratio will cause detonation or you will have to pull almost all the timing. I am safely running 18* of timing on 243 heads with no knock retard.
Upgrade the HEX (check Frozenboost.com) and pump, get 1 7/8" headers, and you can get an OD crank pulley and/or a 2.6 or 2.7 supercharger pulley to get boost up to 10ish lbs and you should be close to 520 whp. Don't bother with the 90mm throttle body upgrade since it will net you only 5 hp or so with tuning.
The GTO's make more power than us CTS-V guys b/c you don't have as much driveline losses. I dyno'd at 487 whp with my mods if that means anything.
5.3 heads are not the way to go with this build, I would recommend OE 243 or 799 heads over worked 5.3 heads since you do not really want to go over 10:1 with a 112. The 112 is a heat pump and the increase in compression ratio will cause detonation or you will have to pull almost all the timing. I am safely running 18* of timing on 243 heads with no knock retard.
Upgrade the HEX (check Frozenboost.com) and pump, get 1 7/8" headers, and you can get an OD crank pulley and/or a 2.6 or 2.7 supercharger pulley to get boost up to 10ish lbs and you should be close to 520 whp. Don't bother with the 90mm throttle body upgrade since it will net you only 5 hp or so with tuning.
The GTO's make more power than us CTS-V guys b/c you don't have as much driveline losses. I dyno'd at 487 whp with my mods if that means anything.
04-09-2012, 05:50 PM
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That's the info I'm looking for! Haven't bought anything yet. Looking for Noob advice.
And where would one find these LS6/7/9 cams?
And where would one find these LS6/7/9 cams?
Last edited by superGTO; 04-09-2012 at 05:58 PM.
04-09-2012, 08:30 PM
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LS6 Cam: 204*/218* .551"/.551" on 117.5 LSA PN 12565308 Retails for $270 but you can find LS6 take out cams for $100-$150 range.
LS7 Cam: 211*/230* .591"/.591" (with 1.8 rockers, .558" with 1.7 rockers) on 120 LSA. GM Part Number 12571251 GM list is $166.15.
More specs here: https://ls1tech.com/forums/generatio...cam-specs.html
LS9 Cam: 211*/230* .562"/.558" on 122 LSA. GM Part Number 12638427 GM list is $98.00.
Keep in mind that with the LS7 or LS9 cams you would have to change to a LS2 front cover, TBSS LS2 cam gear, and extend the cam sensor harness to make them work. If you search you will find more info on this.
You can go more wild on the cam and get a little more power, you may want to post in the GTO section and get more info.
LS7 Cam: 211*/230* .591"/.591" (with 1.8 rockers, .558" with 1.7 rockers) on 120 LSA. GM Part Number 12571251 GM list is $166.15.
More specs here: https://ls1tech.com/forums/generatio...cam-specs.html
LS9 Cam: 211*/230* .562"/.558" on 122 LSA. GM Part Number 12638427 GM list is $98.00.
Keep in mind that with the LS7 or LS9 cams you would have to change to a LS2 front cover, TBSS LS2 cam gear, and extend the cam sensor harness to make them work. If you search you will find more info on this.
You can go more wild on the cam and get a little more power, you may want to post in the GTO section and get more info.
04-12-2012, 10:52 AM
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Update:
I told you I was a NOOB right? Found some more paperwork with the car and found that it does have an aftermarket cam already installed by the previous owner. I've only had the car for a little bit and this is all new info.
It is a flowtech induction cam. 218/228-114 with lift of .561/.571. So close to the stock LS9 numbers. Just a little over.
He "lost" the dyno sheets to it. I have serious doubt that it was actually ever on the dyno now and I am just being told these numbers. So it is probably a little better than previously thought. But time to get it to the dyno to find out. I have HPtuners already, so I downloaded the tune to take a look at it. Looks like the commanded AFR at WOT is about 10.8 so that can get leaned out a bit once I install the WB sensor.
Looks like heads are still stock with just the upgraded springs, retainers, locks, and new pushrods. Valves are stock. Looks like stock maggie pulley, but I haven't measured it yet.
I told you I was a NOOB right? Found some more paperwork with the car and found that it does have an aftermarket cam already installed by the previous owner. I've only had the car for a little bit and this is all new info.
It is a flowtech induction cam. 218/228-114 with lift of .561/.571. So close to the stock LS9 numbers. Just a little over.
He "lost" the dyno sheets to it. I have serious doubt that it was actually ever on the dyno now and I am just being told these numbers. So it is probably a little better than previously thought. But time to get it to the dyno to find out. I have HPtuners already, so I downloaded the tune to take a look at it. Looks like the commanded AFR at WOT is about 10.8 so that can get leaned out a bit once I install the WB sensor.
Looks like heads are still stock with just the upgraded springs, retainers, locks, and new pushrods. Valves are stock. Looks like stock maggie pulley, but I haven't measured it yet.
04-12-2012, 11:40 AM
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East texas muscle cars blower cam! Innovators west 8" overdrive lower pulley, 2.8" front pulley on the stock :083:1 rears, longtubes and you should be over 500whp.
