TimE

iTrader: (8)

I'm at a little of a loss as to what to do. I have an '01 Z28 with 166k miles that the A4 recently crapped out on. I have been seeing metal shavings in the oil for the last 20k miles and the "piston slap" that it has had since new has turned into a constant rattle at all rpm's. My plan at this point is to pull everything out and open the ls1 up for a little looksee and replace the trans. Here's where the dilemma I'm having comes in...


This car has been my daily since it was purchased new. For the last ~12 years it has seen 12k miles/year. My driving is about 90% Interstate/Highway. So what I replace the stock motor with will see daily duty but I am looking to get as much out of the engine as I realistically can within my budget constraints. My TOTAL engine budget is ~$6k, which would include gaskets, replacement motor mounts, etc., to get everything into the car and running. The trans and converter cost is already accounted for and not included in the above amount.


I want to get the most "bang" for my buck. So what I am looking at is buying a reasonable mileage pullout, upgrading it and installing into my Z. At this time I am looking at an LQ9/4 or a GTO LS2. My goal, if it is attainable within my budget, is to have a daily that I can at least keep up with (hopefully out run!) the newer Coyotes, LS3's, etc. (Is this even realistic?)


I will be running a set of 1 7/8" SE headers with a TSP ORY through a Magnaflow catback. All of the "supporting mods" are in place--lid, SSRA, LS6 intake, UD Pulley, etc. Camshaft wise, I plan to get a "baby cam" spec'ed by one of the guru's (Geoff, Martin, Tony, PatG, etc), something with good torque under the curve and relatively easy on the valve train. The trans will be rebuilt/upgraded and I will purchase a good quality converter(undecided on brand at this point) around a 3600 stall. The rear is a stock 10 bolt with 3.42's. Now for the questions...


For the LQ4/9 route I am curious as to suggestions on heads. I have been looking at the PRC as cast 225's but am also wondering about the LS3 from either GM or TSP for a similar cost(~$1900 total). If I go with the cathedral I will reuse my LS6 intake/throttle body/maf. Going the LS3 route, I have sourced out a complete LS3 intake with rails and injectors for $350 and I would need a larger DBC TB($250-300ish used?) plus the harnesses adapters for the injectors. Cost wise, which one makes more sense for the hp return for the $$ spent?


For the LS2 it would basically be a stock LS2 with 243's plus a cam and then a DBC throttle body for the LS2 intake or swap my Stock TB and LS6 intake over. I would need to upgrade the injectors and buy the adapter harnesses needed for an LS2 swap. The buy in for the LS2 is a good bit higher so that limits what I can realistically do to it but it already has a good set of heads.


Anyway, I would like to get some insight on the choices above as to what you would consider to be the better route and why, OR good suggestions for an alternative plan. Any feedback, direction, or input is gladly welcomed.

Mercier

iTrader: (15)

When I was in front of a similar situation, I opted for the aluminum block(100lbs) and higher compression(10.9:1) of the LS2. Probably cost me $500-$700 more. BUT you can sell nice 243 heads for $400 and typical truck heads will sit on your shelf. Later trucks came with 799/243 which is about the same thing, possibly just with lesser valve springs..but you would likely be changing those anyway. But it evens out more than you think if your truck engine doesn't come with 243s.

You can bore an iron block(generally .060") further than an aluminum(.020-.030") piece also but that may not matter to you if you are planning on mostly driving it for another ten years.

IMO, for daily driver, 6.0L or less, cathedral port heads will give you the best low-mid range torque.

Here's some interesting reading showing your LS6 intake will actually outperform the LS2 I just posted to another thread:

http://www.ls1gto.com/forums/showthr.../289456?page=1

psychosid30

iTrader: (7)

There are so many ways you can do this, but, here is my two cents worth:
You are wanting both reliability for the long haul and power to play with. With that in mind, I'm always leery about pull out motors. You never know what you're getting, or how well they were taken care of. For piece of mind, Thompson Motorsports has LS3 short blocks for $3800 with forged pistons ($4600 for the 416 stroker). GMPP offers CNCd LS3 heads for around $1200 (the flow ridiculously well). Pair that with your bolt ons and the cam you are discussing and you will have plenty of power and the reliability of a new motor. You will have to fit your knock sensors on the side of the motor and buy a couple of wiring extensions, but that won't be too bad if you shop around (I found it all dirt cheap). This route will put you right at your budget, but it would definitely give you plenty of reliable power.


Again, many ways to go about this, just my two cents worth!

TimE

iTrader: (8)

The LS6 intake vs the LS2 is crazy! Makes me feel better about my top end anyway.


I like the sounds of a fresh built short block but buying heads and then all of the other needed parts could push me over the top. (From crunching numbers it looks like it will be $1500-$2000 to get EVERYTHING I need to complete the install, i.e all gaskets, timing chain, cam/springs/locks/retainers, motor mounts, rocker trunnion upgrade, head bolts, plus an LS3 loaded intake, 8 offset rockers, so on and so on...)


What about a (TMS/ATK/somebody else?) LS3 or maybe a 408 stroker(or a forged 370 or 383) with some massaged 799 heads and an ls6 intake? This would get me a better bottom end and then, once more funds become available, I could upgrade the topend with LS3 parts as suggested.
In the meantime, I guess I could start looking for some used nitrous deals to make the power I would like to see. Just not a big fan of nitrous...


I don't know, I guess I'm over thinking everything and am wanting more than what I can really afford, which stinks. Sounds like the whole thing I'm looking at will end up being a compromise.

TimE

iTrader: (8)

After too much number crunching I decided to go with a pullout. It is a 2006 GTO LS2. I will swap my LS6 intake onto it and then start looking at cams and such. For what I bought it for, I might be able to swing a FAST 102...

dailydriver

What are the factory, 'loaded' LS3 intakes going for now??

I have heard from some tuners that they actually flow as well as, if not better than ANY of the aftermarket, rectangle port intakes (at least on un-massaged, factory LS3 heads). True or false???

thompson

iTrader: (4)

If there is anything we can help with let us know. Give us a call at the shop or send me an email directly at Aaron@ThompsonMotorsports.net.

Thank you,
Aaron @ Thompson Motorsports

TimE

iTrader: (8)

Not positive on the flow comparison but from what I have read the LS3 is an excellent factory intake. It is what I would run for a budget LS3 head swap. Price wise, I saw a complete intake/rails/injectors on another forum yesterday for $350. Sounded like a decent price to me.

TimE

iTrader: (8)

Thanks Aaron. I have been looking at all of the vendors and really liked the reviews I saw about you guys. I just bought an LS2 pullout, but if the need arises I will contact you.

Oh, and thanks for supporting the forum and offering feedback/input.

dailydriver

Some are asking (and maybe even getting) MORE than that for the LS6 intakes, nitrous cracks and all!

TimE

iTrader: (8)

Well...went to pick up the "LS2 from a 2006 GTO", and it turns out it was an LS1. Then the guy tried to tell me he knew what he had. Gee whiz...