need a little educating
07-08-2007, 10:40 AM
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need a little educating looking at some Patriot LS6 stg II heads, question is they are offered in 59cc and 64cc combustion chamber sizes, i know 59cc will increase compression ratio, so my question is does increasing compression ratio cause more torque increase or more hp increase, i know both will increase but which one would it help more?
07-09-2007, 07:06 PM
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Originally Posted by 02silvaZ
83 views and only one response, pretty rediculous
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07-09-2007, 08:28 PM
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Originally Posted by ProjecT 9
like you already seem to know it can increase both. me personally would go with the 64cc heads to give you some grace just in case you ever have to mill the heads again. thats just me though. run those and some thinner head gaskets and you can work with the milling/shaving of the heads to get your desired compression ratio. cool?
07-09-2007, 08:34 PM
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Originally Posted by 02silvaZ
thanks, any idea what a 59cc chamber might yield for a comp ratio, 11:1 or 11.5:1, wasnt tryin to get an attitude, sorry for sounding like that
assuming your running a stock bottom LS1 with a -0.007 DH with a 59cc head here are some compression ratio's for a few different gasket thickness's.
.053 (stock)= 11.42:1
.045 = 11.66:1
.040 = 11.82:1
All the same with 64cc heads
.053 = 10.70:1
.045 = 10.92:1
.040 = 11.05:1
Let me know if there are any other gasket thickness's your thinking about running.
Jon
Last edited by ProjecT 9; 07-09-2007 at 08:56 PM.
07-09-2007, 09:44 PM
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A few things go into CR, as stated above...
--> type of piston ( in your case, this does not apply as you have stock "flat top" pistons) if they were domed, or had reliefes, then it applies( i/e forged aftermakred pistons), head gasket thickness, cc of combustion chamber in head, etcetc...
You may not want to go ***** out with the cc of the heads you are looking at as it will drastically reduce PTV clearance with almost any cam you run...you will only be able to fit a few small cams with stock gaskets, anything thinner and you should flycut...especially with a 59cc combustion chamber.
Just food for thought...
Flycutting is really a great thing to do, that way there is no guesswork..its your call how far you want to take this.
Also, the higher the compression ration, the higher the octane needed to run without detonation. This deters many from going higher than say 11.0-1 + on a street car.
Erik
--> type of piston ( in your case, this does not apply as you have stock "flat top" pistons) if they were domed, or had reliefes, then it applies( i/e forged aftermakred pistons), head gasket thickness, cc of combustion chamber in head, etcetc...
You may not want to go ***** out with the cc of the heads you are looking at as it will drastically reduce PTV clearance with almost any cam you run...you will only be able to fit a few small cams with stock gaskets, anything thinner and you should flycut...especially with a 59cc combustion chamber.
Just food for thought...
Flycutting is really a great thing to do, that way there is no guesswork..its your call how far you want to take this.
Also, the higher the compression ration, the higher the octane needed to run without detonation. This deters many from going higher than say 11.0-1 + on a street car.
Erik
07-10-2007, 08:42 PM
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Originally Posted by 02silvaZ
so this would be too high to run on 93 octane?
whats your target compression? we need to establish that first
Jon
Last edited by ProjecT 9; 07-10-2007 at 08:51 PM.
07-10-2007, 08:59 PM
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Originally Posted by ERIK@MASPORT
A few things go into CR, as stated above...
--> type of piston ( in your case, this does not apply as you have stock "flat top" pistons) if they were domed, or had reliefes, then it applies( i/e forged aftermakred pistons), head gasket thickness, cc of combustion chamber in head, etcetc...
You may not want to go ***** out with the cc of the heads you are looking at as it will drastically reduce PTV clearance with almost any cam you run...you will only be able to fit a few small cams with stock gaskets, anything thinner and you should flycut...especially with a 59cc combustion chamber.
Just food for thought...
Flycutting is really a great thing to do, that way there is no guesswork..its your call how far you want to take this.
Also, the higher the compression ration, the higher the octane needed to run without detonation. This deters many from going higher than say 11.0-1 + on a street car.
Erik
--> type of piston ( in your case, this does not apply as you have stock "flat top" pistons) if they were domed, or had reliefes, then it applies( i/e forged aftermakred pistons), head gasket thickness, cc of combustion chamber in head, etcetc...
You may not want to go ***** out with the cc of the heads you are looking at as it will drastically reduce PTV clearance with almost any cam you run...you will only be able to fit a few small cams with stock gaskets, anything thinner and you should flycut...especially with a 59cc combustion chamber.
Just food for thought...
Flycutting is really a great thing to do, that way there is no guesswork..its your call how far you want to take this.
Also, the higher the compression ration, the higher the octane needed to run without detonation. This deters many from going higher than say 11.0-1 + on a street car.
Erik
I agree with everything you said and is very good information, but I think patriot heads are welded up instead of being milled down for their chamber sizes, so 59cc chambers allow the same p/v clearance as the 64 cc chambers. So he might not need to flycut depending on which cam he uses.
07-11-2007, 05:42 PM
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this is what i am planning on running..........
02+ z06 cam, yes i know there are bigger but this what i want
pat perf stage 2 LS6 heads, either 59cc or 64cc depending on what will work
change over to 1.8 ratio rockers
was looking to get at least 11:1 out of it, i am gonna run the z06 cam so i am looking to see what would be a better head to make the most out of it and get under the curve power out of the setup
02+ z06 cam, yes i know there are bigger but this what i want
pat perf stage 2 LS6 heads, either 59cc or 64cc depending on what will work
change over to 1.8 ratio rockers
was looking to get at least 11:1 out of it, i am gonna run the z06 cam so i am looking to see what would be a better head to make the most out of it and get under the curve power out of the setup
07-12-2007, 08:19 PM
#18
Increasing compression creates more torque. Couple more torque with more RPM and you have more horsepower. So that's actually a poorly parsed question, as there is no true answer other than both.
And as stated before, run as much compression as you can safely. Increasing the compression provides lots of extra torque, increases throttle repsponse, and allows you to use more aggressive cams and receive more of the pros and fewer of the cons associated with them.
The LS1s design allows a lot of compression on pump gas. I'm running 11.7:1 on 93 octane, in 100 degree heat with no knock or other problems.
And as stated before, run as much compression as you can safely. Increasing the compression provides lots of extra torque, increases throttle repsponse, and allows you to use more aggressive cams and receive more of the pros and fewer of the cons associated with them.
The LS1s design allows a lot of compression on pump gas. I'm running 11.7:1 on 93 octane, in 100 degree heat with no knock or other problems.
07-12-2007, 08:50 PM
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Originally Posted by ProjecT 9
what thickness HG you wanting to run?
Let me know if there are any other gasket thickness's your thinking about running.
Jon
Let me know if there are any other gasket thickness's your thinking about running.
Jon