416CI 600rwhp are they out there?
01-15-2012, 06:46 AM
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416CI 600rwhp are they out there? Hi Guys,
I am looking to crack 550rwhp after i get the heads back from their valve job, and ITB's blended in.
Has anyone cracked 600 with this size engine NA?
The only thing mine is missing is solid lifters, after that i really dont know how i would improve it further....
I am looking to crack 550rwhp after i get the heads back from their valve job, and ITB's blended in.
Has anyone cracked 600 with this size engine NA?
The only thing mine is missing is solid lifters, after that i really dont know how i would improve it further....
01-15-2012, 10:43 PM
#5
LOL 416s are completly forged intenals and the pistons already have flycutting and the heads are already 65cc.
but lstvr I am sure a couple 416s have hit that mark, your power seems a bit low maybe the 225cc heads are holding you back, that cam is HUGE but im not sure what rpm you are making.
I know my engine wil ldo about 550 to the wheels in my car and makes it power at 6200 rpms and then lvls off till 6800. I run a stock intake and stock cnc ported heads. definetly sounds like your engine has the potential for over 600 wheel power.
but lstvr I am sure a couple 416s have hit that mark, your power seems a bit low maybe the 225cc heads are holding you back, that cam is HUGE but im not sure what rpm you are making.
I know my engine wil ldo about 550 to the wheels in my car and makes it power at 6200 rpms and then lvls off till 6800. I run a stock intake and stock cnc ported heads. definetly sounds like your engine has the potential for over 600 wheel power.
01-17-2012, 08:36 AM
#7
I don't think it is much of a problem these days with the right parts. Many of the aftermarket head options available now (canted etc) can flow more than enough air to make 600rwhp.
I'm using a cheap off the shelf Victor Jr and imagine there is some gain to be had on my setup with a better intake. And for reference, my cam isn't much bigger than yours.
I'm using a cheap off the shelf Victor Jr and imagine there is some gain to be had on my setup with a better intake. And for reference, my cam isn't much bigger than yours.
Last edited by Tireburnin; 01-17-2012 at 03:48 PM.
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01-17-2012, 03:37 PM
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01-18-2012, 01:57 PM
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I think you'll make your 550 goal. The 600 rwhp with those heads will be tough. Have the Kinsler injectors been converted to elec or are they still mech.? Very interesting build.
01-18-2012, 02:05 PM
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I am also having the latest Comp double springs installed, as they are a direct replacement for the Dual Extremes, and i can re use my Ti retainers, Shane at Thunder has advised to do this, and his advice has always reaped dividends..
The injectors are a MOPAR low resistance type, this did fool me when i installed them as it was overloading the ECU drivers, and causing them to overheat and the values kept altering on the dyno. Alot of head scratching and we discovered it, and so installed resistors to compensate and started again.
Frustrating day!
The bodies are used items from a Mosler race car.
Currently looks power curve looks like this
Last edited by lstvr; 01-19-2012 at 03:16 AM.
01-19-2012, 07:46 PM
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A friend of mine has a 2003 Corvette with a new 416 ci, Trick Flow heads, cam, FAST intake, etc. that made 585 rwhp on the dyno if that helps. I was there during the dyno run so this is confirmed.
01-20-2012, 01:58 PM
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Futral Motorsports 416ci Team - Alan is building my new 416 for my race car. The previous motor (408) did 552 at the tire through a T-400 and 5200 stall and a ported FAST 92mm intake and TB. We have decided to replace the FAST intake with a MAST single plane 4500 and matching 4500 throttle body. The previous heads were All Pro (Cathedral Port) and have now went with MAST LS3. Cam specs will be in the 25x/26x with close to .700 lift and custom Diamond domed pistons (14.0 compression). I'm hoping to see 600rwhp and sub 9.50 1/4's at over 140mph. A manual transmission would help on the dyno but the car is a dedicated race car. I don't think we are missing any parts to get to our goal, but your point of view is always appreciated. Hope this helps, motor is expected to be complete in March.
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01-20-2012, 02:24 PM
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Team - Alan is building my new 416 for my race car. The previous motor (408) did 552 at the tire through a T-400 and 5200 stall and a ported FAST 92mm intake and TB. We have decided to replace the FAST intake with a MAST single plane 4500 and matching 4500 throttle body. The previous heads were All Pro (Cathedral Port) and have now went with MAST LS3. Cam specs will be in the 25x/26x with close to .700 lift and custom Diamond domed pistons (14.0 compression). I'm hoping to see 600rwhp and sub 9.50 1/4's at over 140mph. A manual transmission would help on the dyno but the car is a dedicated race car. I don't think we are missing any parts to get to our goal, but your point of view is always appreciated. Hope this helps, motor is expected to be complete in March.
CoopZ06
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02-04-2012, 05:39 AM
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Pray C5 Z06 have dyno'd 570+ rwhp / 530+ rwtq with off the shelf TFS 235 and Vengeance ported FAST 92 intake
A reworked TFS-235cc, ((PORTED MATCH 102mm INTAKE)) and right cam can get you there
A reworked TFS-235cc, ((PORTED MATCH 102mm INTAKE)) and right cam can get you there
02-05-2012, 04:48 AM
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Just a few thoughts:
Maybe the problem is being married to the Heads Cam and exhaust?
Heads - Not to say that KRS aren't an awesome outfit, but for the price of that valve job wouldn't it have been better just buy a new set of heads (as said some TFS235s?) I expect you checked but worth asking the question.
CAM - That cam is probably less than optimal for the setup. Wasn't that cam speced to run the fast intake?
Might be worth finding someone who has proven experience making cams for ITB setups?
Exhaust headers - maybe its worth tearing it down and making a new set, allot of other ppl have put together really close block huggers...
An off the wall suggestion would be to ship your Heads and intake to the states sell them, then get Texas to spec a 'small bore' LS7 HCI for you. At least the ITBs should easily make back the money you paid for them...
Maybe the problem is being married to the Heads Cam and exhaust?
Heads - Not to say that KRS aren't an awesome outfit, but for the price of that valve job wouldn't it have been better just buy a new set of heads (as said some TFS235s?) I expect you checked but worth asking the question.
CAM - That cam is probably less than optimal for the setup. Wasn't that cam speced to run the fast intake?
Might be worth finding someone who has proven experience making cams for ITB setups?
Exhaust headers - maybe its worth tearing it down and making a new set, allot of other ppl have put together really close block huggers...
An off the wall suggestion would be to ship your Heads and intake to the states sell them, then get Texas to spec a 'small bore' LS7 HCI for you. At least the ITBs should easily make back the money you paid for them...
02-05-2012, 04:59 AM
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Just a few thoughts:
Maybe the problem is being married to the Heads Cam and exhaust?
Heads - Not to say that KRS aren't an awesome outfit, but for the price of that valve job wouldn't it have been better just buy a new set of heads (as said some TFS235s?) I expect you checked but worth asking the question.
CAM - That cam is probably less than optimal for the setup. Wasn't that cam speced to run the fast intake?
Might be worth finding someone who has proven experience making cams for ITB setups?
Exhaust headers - maybe its worth tearing it down and making a new set, allot of other ppl have put together really close block huggers...
An off the wall suggestion would be to ship your Heads and intake to the states sell them, then get Texas to spec a 'small bore' LS7 HCI for you. At least the ITBs should easily make back the money you paid for them...
Maybe the problem is being married to the Heads Cam and exhaust?
Heads - Not to say that KRS aren't an awesome outfit, but for the price of that valve job wouldn't it have been better just buy a new set of heads (as said some TFS235s?) I expect you checked but worth asking the question.
CAM - That cam is probably less than optimal for the setup. Wasn't that cam speced to run the fast intake?
Might be worth finding someone who has proven experience making cams for ITB setups?
Exhaust headers - maybe its worth tearing it down and making a new set, allot of other ppl have put together really close block huggers...
An off the wall suggestion would be to ship your Heads and intake to the states sell them, then get Texas to spec a 'small bore' LS7 HCI for you. At least the ITBs should easily make back the money you paid for them...
Take ITB's off!!!???
Are you on drugs, replace with a crappy charge robbing single plane intake so it shunts in traffic, no thanks!
ITB's are THE Ultimate way to fuel a NA engine, take a look at F1 or GP1 bikes, no plastic single bodies there..
I just asked if anyone has hit 600rwhp with 416CI
02-05-2012, 06:22 AM
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Sorry didn't mean what you seemed to have read.
OK, this is where I was coming from:
Would you change your heads? - very unlikely
Would you change your cam? - again very unlikely
Would you rework the exhaust? - slim to no chance
This armchair spectator thinks that the only two places to improve = a new cam or a better pair of heads.
Also - you do know what "off the wall" means?
Actually yes - codine 
Just to say but the crappy intake wouldn't be so much a problem if you didn't have that Hercules cam to make up for the that octopus of an exhaust.
Sorry for misreading your post, between the lines I read a want for 600rwhp.
Any suggestion that you would get anywhere near 'that' with a plastic intake was stupid, thats why it was a consideration if you really wanted 550 and the work done to the heads ends up yielding minimal gains.
It is worth keeping in mind that there are LS3 based 408 and 416s that make the same rwhp or alittle more than the 416 in its previous form (and its not like you have a mild setup with that 24x/25x cam).
I fully admit to being an armchair spectator, so wasn't expecting you to care much about the post either way.
Hope you get good gains with the work done to your heads
OK, this is where I was coming from:
Would you change your heads? - very unlikely
Would you change your cam? - again very unlikely
Would you rework the exhaust? - slim to no chance
This armchair spectator thinks that the only two places to improve = a new cam or a better pair of heads.
Also - you do know what "off the wall" means?
Are you on drugs, replace with a crappy charge robbing single plane intake so it shunts in traffic, no thanks!
Just to say but the crappy intake wouldn't be so much a problem if you didn't have that Hercules cam to make up for the that octopus of an exhaust.
I just asked if anyone has hit 600rwhp with 416CI
Any suggestion that you would get anywhere near 'that' with a plastic intake was stupid, thats why it was a consideration if you really wanted 550 and the work done to the heads ends up yielding minimal gains.
It is worth keeping in mind that there are LS3 based 408 and 416s that make the same rwhp or alittle more than the 416 in its previous form (and its not like you have a mild setup with that 24x/25x cam).
I fully admit to being an armchair spectator, so wasn't expecting you to care much about the post either way.
Hope you get good gains with the work done to your heads
02-05-2012, 06:33 AM
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Sorry didn't mean what you seemed to have read.
OK, this is where I was coming from:
Would you change your heads? - very unlikely
Would you change your cam? - again very unlikely
Would you rework the exhaust? - slim to no chance
This armchair spectator thinks that the only two places to improve = a new cam or a better pair of heads.
Also - you do know what "off the wall" means?
Actually yes - codine
Just to say but the crappy intake wouldn't be so much a problem if you didn't have that Hercules cam to make up for the that octopus of an exhaust.
Sorry for misreading your post, between the lines I read a want for 600rwhp.
Any suggestion that you would get anywhere near 'that' with a plastic intake was stupid, thats why it was a consideration if you really wanted 550 and the work done to the heads ends up yielding minimal gains.
It is worth keeping in mind that there are LS3 based 408 and 416s that make the same rwhp or alittle more than the 416 in its previous form (and its not like you have a mild setup with that 24x/25x cam).
I fully admit to being an armchair spectator, so wasn't expecting you to care much about the post either way.
Hope you get good gains with the work done to your heads
OK, this is where I was coming from:
Would you change your heads? - very unlikely
Would you change your cam? - again very unlikely
Would you rework the exhaust? - slim to no chance
This armchair spectator thinks that the only two places to improve = a new cam or a better pair of heads.
Also - you do know what "off the wall" means?
Actually yes - codine
Just to say but the crappy intake wouldn't be so much a problem if you didn't have that Hercules cam to make up for the that octopus of an exhaust.
Sorry for misreading your post, between the lines I read a want for 600rwhp.
Any suggestion that you would get anywhere near 'that' with a plastic intake was stupid, thats why it was a consideration if you really wanted 550 and the work done to the heads ends up yielding minimal gains.
It is worth keeping in mind that there are LS3 based 408 and 416s that make the same rwhp or alittle more than the 416 in its previous form (and its not like you have a mild setup with that 24x/25x cam).
I fully admit to being an armchair spectator, so wasn't expecting you to care much about the post either way.
Hope you get good gains with the work done to your heads
When your engine actually makes it out your bedroom door, the come down to TVR Power and run the car up!