Rossko85

iTrader: (11)

Need some help on why I burned a plug completely off the top....the prong bend was melted and gone...It started after I tunned witht the N20...Everything tunned in great on the 100shot and NA...well a couple of nights later I go to start the my car and get a CHK Eng light...i attempt to reset it and to no success...so I waited until this morning until i realized that I have scan guages that detect and clear DTC's...

so I pulled the code and it was
P0300 which is Multiple Cylinder Misfire code...so I looked at the misfires option on my scan gauge, something I didnt or dont use much...but when looked at it is said 16!!! so i went to the local advance to get an open lot to look at this thing and if i needed anything I was right there...so I clear the DTC's...off my gauge..the CHK light goes away...im still getting a lil sputter and a bunch of misfires....so I go start pulling the plugs on the front...starting witht the DOD Cylinders...which by the way I have DOD tunned to OFF...and check all of them up front they are all good...not too white and not too dark, but except #7....that thing was toasted to no end...literally looked like someone had taken a bite out of the very top...it was all to hell!!!

so I replaced the plugs and now i still have misfires only like 0-2 or sometimes I will see 12-10-4-2 coming to a stop or going into accel...but they go away when driving...so, little did I know that there are some misfires in ignition that pop up here and there on NA tune just due to the nature of the beast, and now that I am watching them I notice them...but not nearly as bad as they were...cause the only thing that got me to look at them was the DTC code...but with that said...

My tunner was contacted as well as my LS guy about it....Tunner immiediately said chk the plugs..and they are correct for N20..NGK TR-6 (.035 Gap)...now he did hit it really lean in his drive way while trying to tune in his wideband, later figuring out it was bad!! The car sounded as if it was cam'n and we all know we dont have that luxery!! lol but he said that it wouldnt have done that type of damage that quick...he tunes cars that have been running lean for months until they call him...but it was a theory...cause the only way you burn plugs is going too LEAN!!

But then that kind of got thrown out the door because we tunned all day and night NA and N2O on them...and that was the only plugh that did it...and these plugs have been sprayed with a 50 shot with no tune and ran for 3 months in preperation on the car for the tune...so scratch that idea...unless the little lean spike with all the tunning and N2O weakened the plug in question and fried it...but thats still highly unlikely, and with it only taking that one..."which there was a first hint of another theory" Ill explain that on the bottom in what I think it could be....

Then there was the question and theory that while spraying it yesterday to wet the girlfriends pants, that the car went too lean while spraying and fried that plug...which I examined that possiblility souley due to me having a Fuel Pressure Safety Switch (FPSS) which was not hooked up during yesterdays passs, but then I remembered that my FJO controller wasnt getting a signal to the selinoids..which we found out it was due to a loose ground that fell off the FPSS due to a faulty screw that went bye bye...so we just hard wired the ground and bypassed the FPSS...we tunned on it just fine and the Air fuel was just fine both N2O passes...so nothing changed from that to yesterday when I sprayed...so that kind of cancelled that out....

with that said, my tunner then told me he wants me to check the oil for SHAVINGS....he is trying to out weight DETONATION!!! potentially from a lean spike that fried and burned/ate that plug...ONLY THAT PLUG THOUGH??? So im going to run around on the NA tune only until FRI and then check the #7 Plug to examine the condition....and hopefully rule-out the NA/Timing issues....or Misfires..which like i said earlier are expected a lil when or after you pull timing for a tune...my LS guy told me his Pontiac Fire Birdy did the same thing once he got it tunned...it would do a lil misfire then stop on down the road...so im seeing some similar characteristics here...very, very LS at the heart....

With that said, if the NA looks okay on the plugs or that plug since thats the only one burning up, then that will secure my NA tune as ok....then spray it on the wet 100 shot a couple of passes to see if that plug is doing anything like it did before...My LS guy; who by the way has help me build this whole car as it is...dropped a lil bug that the LS1 guys have had trouble with #7 Cylinder frying plugs....this got me curious...he said it was because they were so far back and got so hot and something about the oil pump, but it made it too hot so they fried plugs...

well after I flipped this engine around in the RIGHT WHEEL DRIVE WORLD lol...I had a belt system at the radiator and a tranny to the rear....and an intake that faced toward the firewall...so that help the conclusion of #7...we started to make another LS relationship discovery..but he said it was also due to the LS1 having the intake furthest away from the plug as well had something to do with it...and he didnt know if it would be the same issue as the LS1 due to our intakes being mounted the way they are...
so is it a phenomenan or is there a tie there somewhere from its grand pa!!!?

So thats where our thoughts are going toward now, and cross referencing all the LS1 TECH boards...u know, the guys way up toward the top over us LS-4's!!! LOL ...we down here in the pit...so im going to check for the SHAVINGS tomarrow when I get an oil change...full synthetic since i bought her....and I will sift throught the oil...im praying guys its not going to show any detonation stress or shavings from valves or piston rings...

as of right now my pistons feel fine if i can even say that lol as far as compression, and my oil consumption is normal as well as levels and temps...so Im keeping my fingures crossed!! but I have also thought outside the box on this one...remember earlier when I said that I would explain the the simple thought that would make since as well since all the other variables have been put aside...and that all the other 7 plugs were just fine...even though I replaced them due to uneven displacement...lol..but that very simply IT COULD JUST BE A BAD OR WEAK PLUG!!! that simply went out from factory or that a lean spike on my first day of tunning caused the thing to be comprimised a bit and spraying and tunning just was the straw to break the camels back...

so let me know what your guys's insight is on this or if you have any idea of anybody else doing this or what the heck.....Im hoping i just burned a plug due to the spike in air making it lean and just screwed the pooch there after the tune on it and will be able to move on with no issues...but besides that...this car has come so far...and its a quick car for what it is. fast on everybody's *** meters...lol thanks guys...sorry so long...i tried to space it up!!

TS6

iTrader: (41)

Cliff notes please.

From what I skimmed through, you went lean and burned a plug. I would do a compression test and leakdown test to see if you damaged your motor.

dnkynrbk

iTrader: (34)

I would do the same as above. THROW AWAY THE TR6 PLUGS they are crap. Go to a TR7 non projected plug.

Robert56

iTrader: (2)

I agree with the above posts. Check out the recent 2 or 3 threads on plugs for insight.
Robert

ShiznityZ28

iTrader: (11)

First. None of those guys sound like they know nitrous

2nd "but it was a theory...cause the only way you burn plugs is going too LEAN!! " is definatly wrong.

3rd. You really are going at this the wrong way. Anyone who tells you tr-6 are the correct plug for nitrous is just dumb. The correct plug is determined by a few things and for the most part a tr-6 is not cold enough unless its a small hit and very mild setup. Guys around here are just figuring this out but to much timming, to much fuel ,hot plug and wrong gas is why ls1's burn up 7. The 7 deal is because of the heat in the motor not the intake.7 will burn up first but only from 1 or more of the other things being wrong. Very few motors are burned up lean

Now a question.

What is a spot on tune for a 50 and 100 shot? You say it tuned good but what did the plugs look like? what af? what timming?

TS6

iTrader: (41)

Another problem is that unless you are checking the plugs immediately after a run then its not going to give you a true reading.

SPEEDYws6

iTrader: (9)

Sounds like too much timing and the wrong plugs.

Rossko85

iTrader: (11)

well the setup I have is very mild...I have just a factory LS4...thats a 5.3L V8 (325) Have no motor work done at all....just a Tranny cooler, Downpipe, poly motor mount and top bearing bushings with a RAT dogbone, and CAI and a TBS...and then of course the
N2O wet shot with a FJO mini-prog. controller.... with a NA tune...so im only at 250 to the wheels factory without the tune and N2O guys....im not a race car lol...that has made it hard for all the race/fast car guys to work or trouble shoot on my car...its a family car that just so happens to be a LS car...243 Heads and LS1 Valve Springs....

To answer ?'s,
What is a spot on tune for a 50 and 100 shot?: Im not sure of your ?

You say it tuned good but what did the plugs look like?: IDK right after but all looked good except #7 when I pulled them...just that 1 cause i get random misfires which is just the tune showing its face cause its random...but the only way I knew there was a problem was due to the CHECK light...which is what give me a DTC...this is all new for everybody with this motor....so need to get more people who have done this but we are writting the book...

what af?: Monitored by tunner 12.2-12.5

what timming?: NA and N2O are the same...cause we sprayed twice and he said that all looked good with the NA tune...he did yank 3* of timing im sure for the N2O alone, just for that....
I looked at my oil plug when I changed the oil today.....it looked good...no metal shavings....and the oil had nothing in it as well...Ill try to get a compression test done on it too...

Drewstein

Too much timing IMO.

I have run bottle upon bottle through TR6 plugs without issue so I say plugs are fine.

WE TODD DID

iTrader: (2)

I skimmed through the post, but didn't see where you said what the total timing is when spraying. The only thing knocks off plug tips, too much timing. I don't care how lean it was, that isn't what burns plug tips. It was over timed, point blank.

w&a racing

u dont have a problem at all................move the nozzel.......its in the wrong place.......change ur plugs to a colder plug...number 7 is going fat and burnin up the plug......lean want hurt a plug that bad its fat that does it......

one day yall will learn that nitrous is not the problem its fuel that kills u

1MEANGTO

Too much timing. I shoot for a fatter afr too though.

SPEEDYws6

iTrader: (9)

Lots of bad info in here... Search for the plug reading threads.

Rossko85

iTrader: (11)

Yeah...all these are options I have considered and brainstormed...but IDK..only 7 is burning up...so I have determined Im going to move to TR7's...seems to be a good move right there for starters....as far as timing...possibly..but my faith lies in my tunner...hes tunned a lot of LS cars..this was his first GXP GP though...and moving the nozzel...have considered that...if you guys see these wrong wheel drive nightmares space in the bay....its pretty much in one spot...its tight!!! but I have a TBS and the nozzel is no more or less than 6" from the intake and right in the elbow curve...great positioning...so I dont think its an atomization issue...i heard lightly moded cars need to go to tr6 but every car is diff...I need to move to tr7

Rossko85

iTrader: (11)

thats gonna make me go get a new NA tune for timing I think......that sucks...diff timing now...

Rossko85

iTrader: (11)

and could there been a momement of over timing....? and if thats the case...why in the hell am I seeing the problem after the tune a few days later after my tune and after I sprayed for the 3rd time and first time away from the tunner....???

WE TODD DID

iTrader: (2)

You won't always hurt it the first time you spray. Being that you only sprayed it 3 times before you hurt it tells me that you are way out of the ballpark on the timing. Most "tuners" don't know how to tune nitrous, they usually get the a/f ratio where they like it, and take out how much timing they "think" is right, although they never pull a plug to verify. How many times did he pull the plugs to check the timing marks after a dyno pull? There is no magic number for timing. The plugs tell you what your timing needs to be, as well as where the fuel needs to be. You can go to a colder plug, but you're still going to be over-timed.

Rossko85

iTrader: (11)

that makes a lot of since..and thats what im gathering im going to do...cause now im getting like no knock at WOT but get it around town...like at 8.0*!!! so he tunned me at WOT with no or very minimal KR and i know pulled like 3* for the N20....but for the NA im awaiting his response...so i think i need to go back to him on the tr7's and have him add some more timing and tune me around town for drivability more or less...cause he doenst tune stock cars as he says...and looking at my A/F ratio for the N2O is exactly what he did...i was expecting more, but didnt get it....it seemed to be a little fast!! have you ever heard of anybody being tunned on N2O only spraying twice ans saying it looks good...im not knocking him...but this was his first....GXP..what do i really need him to do next time...

Rossko85

iTrader: (11)

and here is my info straight from the tunner: The afr was in the high 11s on spray. Timing at WOT was 25-26*. We pulled 4* out for the N2O. This was after we pulled 4* from the entire table at the star....EXACT TEXT FROM MY TUNNER....

krazy4

iTrader: (5)

I would run the a/f a little lower like around 11.2-11.5 and read EVERY plug.