Pro Stock John

iTrader: (34)

Okay, let's touch base for a little and then get this project rolling...

The test chassis for our forced induction project will be none other than Project Dragula, which is a hardtop 98 Formula that I bought at the beginning of 2000. Dragula started out as a heads/ cam ride in 2000 and went 11.76@114mph with a 222/224 cam, GTP heads, and other boltons... Hardly a barn burner by today's standards but for 2000 that was good enough to keep Dragula in the top 15 NA for a long time.

I next went with an ARE 422ci iron block. Dragula gained 75 lbs from the iron block and another 70 lbs from the moly rollcage. Fighting some gremlins the Formula went from 11.3@120.3mph it's first time out down to an 11.02@122.6mph.

Around the time we needed to pull the shortblock to address an issue with the reluctor wheel, I realized that I wanted to go faster, a LOT faster. My calculations said that 10.8 was gonna be possible with the 422ci, and probably about 9.8's with a 150-200 shot of nitrous at a 3500lb raceweight.

But, even though I had originally planned to use nitrous on top of the 422, I really didn't feel as excited as I got when I thought about forced induction.

Dragula is getting a Vortech YS trim this year, and I am starting a build from scratch. Yup, I sold the 422ci and a lot of other parts. Dragula will not join the turbocharged clan but will go it alone and run a big supercharger.

So, without further ado, it's time to spec out the shortblock...

I am liking the idea of seeing what a stock cube aluminum block can handle. I want to see a stock displacment run bottom 9's.

So, I am buying a brand new LS6 block, driving out to meet up with a guy who has a crate motor he is not using, and paying about $550 for it, but have to drive 2 hours tomorrow nite.

I've ordering for this block so far...

-Diamond Pistons, off the shelf, 9:1, 3.905 bore
-Eagle 6.125 rods, ARP rod bolts (L19 bolts)
-Stock crank 3.622 out of a donor motor
-FMS/ Cam Motion supercharger cam
-6.0 heads by Chris Gelineau
-ARP main studs
-GM MLS 6.0 head gaskets
-I need bearings (I want Federal Mogul)
-I need rings-I need a set of head studs
-I need a timing chain
-I need valvesprings

I will pick up the block tomorrow nite, and then drop it off at Speed Inc. (www.ls1speed.com) and have them hone the block out to 3.905 for our Diamond Pistons. I will have them balance the rotating assembly and might have them assemble the shortblock. Everything I need for the shortblock is in stock or I can get it within 10 business days. I will add part numbers and sources as I order the parts this week. Now to hone the block can cost anywhere between $125-175 for a V8 just as an FYI. Balancing the rotating assembly can run anywhere from $200 to 300 if the machine does not have to do that much work to the assembly. I'm not sure how much work this rotating will require but I think that the new rods are heavier than stock if that makes a difference. The cost to have the block assembled might be anywhere from $300 to $500. As you can imagine, the costs add up quickly for the shortblock. Additionally, if you are redoing your stock block, you may want to tear it down yourself or you will end up incurring more costs.

The goal is to have studded block that can handle 800 crank HP and can hopefully hold together with 16-20 lbs of intercooled boost. First goal is to see how much power the setup can make with unleaded gas (110 unleaded).

Meanwhile other parts are being spec'd out like the torque converter and the fuel system but let's hold off on discussing those aspects of the project for now.

As I continue to spec out the longblock, I will take the above list and repost it adding prices and part numbers.

<small>[ March 19, 2003, 08:42 PM: Message edited by: Pro Stock John ]</small>

Camaro_Zach

iTrader: (19)

<img border="0" alt="[burn out]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_burnout.gif" /> sounds like a sick setup, i cant wait till you get that beast in the bird.

Black Sunshine/ 00SS

iTrader: (1)

WOW, your engine takes 2 timing chains!! Mine only takes 1. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" />

I dont know about low 9's, but then again, I dont know much about blowers. What is your estimated RWHP, and expected race weight?

Pro Stock John

iTrader: (34)

I am shooting for 3400 raceweight. I was 3550 raceweight last year, but 75 lbs of that was the block. I will be adding the weight of the blower and the intercooler but hopefully can rip out some more weight. I am not going to be crazy about it.

RWHP, well... I'm gonna use a T400 transmission and it won't have lockup, so let's say the equivalent of 800 crank HP. I'm going to run the T400 for now and then swap in a 4L80E over next winter.

SMOKINV8

iTrader: (6)

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Pro Stock John:
<strong>I am liking the idea of seeing what a stock cube aluminum block can handle. I want to see a stock displacment run bottom 9's.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">You've got some big stones (or maybe big bucks) spending that much money on a short block, just to see if it will handle the HP you're throwing at it. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Big Grin]" src="gr_grin.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="gr_images/icons/tongue.gif" /> Should be interesting to see what 2k3 Dragula runs. Best of luck with the project John. <img border="0" alt="[burn out]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_burnout.gif" />

Terry Burger

iTrader: (4)

It's pretty easy to get a setup like that running high 9s on 346ci, I don't think you need a YS to do it. Just run the off the shelf ATI kit! It's MUCH easier than doing a custom kit. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" />

Pro Stock John

iTrader: (34)

The ATI kits were considered but in the end I want to see how a YS trim works on a stock cube motor. I don't want to jump the gun regarding the supercharger setup but it should be pretty neat and not overly custom except for the fact that I will be running air to water not air to air for the intercooler.

I'll revise the list tomorrow with part numbers and costs.

sited12

I know this isnt short block but what are you going to do for intake manifold. Are you going to run a sheet metal with it since its a forced induction motor or just LS6.

GeorgeC

John, why the stock crank? I know it's a sturdy piece and all. Hell, I still have a stock crank in mine (cause I can't afford anything else <img border="0" title="" alt="[Embarrassed]" src="gr_emb.gif" /> ), but if you're starting from scratch and shooting for low 9's with a lot of boost, I'd want an aftermarket crankshaft (but still stock stroke)...

Just my opinion. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" />

Coach 02 A3 Z/28

iTrader: (10)

Hell Ya. <img border="0" alt="[worship]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_hail.gif" />

What a bad a$$ motor. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Cool]" src="gr_images/icons/cool.gif" />

I can't wait to see what it does at the track. <img border="0" alt="[evil]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_devil.gif" />

Coach

Pro Stock John

iTrader: (34)

George I don't want to run more than stock stroke but maybe I will have the crank hardened. I want to the blower to be doing the work. I just want the longblock to stay together.

Reason I am gonna do a Cam Motion cam is that I always said I would try one.

GeorgeC

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Pro Stock John:
<strong> George I don't want to run more than stock stroke but maybe I will have the crank hardened. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I had my crank hardened pretty good yesterday, but I doubt my wife would want to help you out with yours... <img border="0" alt="[jester]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_jest.gif" />

XLR8NSS

iTrader: (4)

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by GeorgeC:
<strong> </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Pro Stock John:
<strong> George I don't want to run more than stock stroke but maybe I will have the crank hardened. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I had my crank hardened pretty good yesterday, but I doubt my wife would want to help you out with yours... <img border="0" alt="[jester]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_jest.gif" /> </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">George at your age I thought Viagra was the only thing that could help. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="gr_eek2.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="gr_images/icons/tongue.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" />

OK PSJ, sorry for the intrusion. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" />

John

FEAR THE LS1

iTrader: (1)

LOL good one George!

I guess PSJ would rather be blown than stroked ya know.

PNYKILR

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by GeorgeC:
<strong> </font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by Pro Stock John:
<strong> George I don't want to run more than stock stroke but maybe I will have the crank hardened. </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">I had my crank hardened pretty good yesterday, but I doubt my wife would want to help you out with yours... <img border="0" alt="[jester]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_jest.gif" /> </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">LOL at GeorgeC

Onyx LS1

iTrader: (5)

</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">Originally posted by XLR8NSS:
<strong>George at your age I thought Viagra was the only thing that could help. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Eek!]" src="gr_eek2.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="gr_images/icons/tongue.gif" /> <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" />

John </strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana, Helvetica, sans-serif">hahah <img border="0" title="" alt="[Razz]" src="gr_images/icons/tongue.gif" />

John, why don't you go with a stock stroke forged crank?

frcefed98

iTrader: (16)

Same build up here but using an ATI D1 here are the parts I have
Eagle PN CRS6125B3D
Diamond 11503s/diamond rings
6.0 untouched heads(thanks formulation)
LS6block new never assembled(thanks Valvegod)
Stock crank.
John can you post the PN for the GM head gaskets that you bought for the 6.0 heads from the dude in the classifieds. I can't find a PN for them.
Need main bearings and timing chain too as well as the studs but those are easy to come by, but those will come as soon as my tax refund comes sometime this week and off to the ma-chine chop it goes for honing, balancing and assembly. I plan on running 15psi.
J <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="gr_images/icons/wink.gif" />

BIGBOS

Sounds like an excellent setup John, we got to hold it down with stock displacement F.I. cars.... <img border="0" alt="[judgement]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_judge.gif" />

I will be doing a similar setup late in the summer but with my current ATI blower, can't wait to see that car run again John... <img border="0" title="" alt="[Smile]" src="gr_stretch.gif" />

<small>[ February 24, 2003, 10:44 PM: Message edited by: BIGBOS ]</small>

ChrisB

Sounds like a good solid setup! I would echo the concerns for a stock crank at your projected power levels, though I think sticking with stock stroke for extra piston strength is a good idea - but a forged unit would be nice. Make sure whatever you get you have a keyway cut in - you are going to want your hub keyed for sure with a YS trim.

And I like your choice on the blower also! Have you considered air/water vs. air/air for intercooling? For an all out drag setup the air/water has obvious advantages (water/ice or dry ice/acetone), but otherwise I like the air/air. Either way spearco is the way to go.

On the tuning setup if you can get a voltage to frequency converter and calibrated mass air like Harlan's setup then the tuning will pretty much just fall into place!

Suspension-wise I would talk to Madman - has has proven he can get a high hp blower car to stick, no question.

But sounds like an awesome package, good luck!


Chris

DOC OTIS

iTrader: (9)

Ah Ha He said crank <img border="0" alt="[jester]" title="" src="graemlins/gr_jest.gif" /> Reminds me of Beavis and Butthead