TwitchZ28

iTrader: (3)

Hey guys...yes I read the sticky...yes I checked out the sites....yes I read many threads.

I only have a pretty simple question. But while i was looking for the answer in the forums the conversation always got way more complicated and out of hand for my intelligence at this point.

Which program would be cheaper overall?

I have a 2002 Z28 that I will be tuning with it(enhanced os would be cool but that is down the road)

Also I plan on tuning a couple of my friends cars around here in Indianapolis if I get good.

Which program will be more cost effective and less haggle for me to be able to just tune different cars?

HPT has the credit system which is kinda cool at first cause I can tune my car and 3 more(who I can charge and put money back into my pocket) but then afterwards I have to pay 100 a car to tune correct?

Also I cannot seem to find where/how the efi live licencing system works. I saw someone say it only goes by ecm serial and not car vin and stuff correct?


NOT TRYING TO START A HATE FEST HERE but which would be better in my case? Also pro's and con's of each would be cool(read a pro's and con's thread and people just got pissed and arugued)

joecar

Yes that is correct, with EFILive a license attaches to the PCM serial number.

foff667

iTrader: (2)

Good thing about our single vcm licenses is that 75% of their value gets put towards the year/model license for each.

For instance if you tune (2) 2002 Camaro V8's using the single vcm licenses, the next 2002 Camaro V8 you go to tune will ask you if you want to do a year/model license for only $150 so you'd have the 2002 Camaro/Firebird unlimited license and would never need to license another one.

we also offer upgrade paths from year/model to tunershop...same deal 75% of year/model licenses go towards the tunershop license with no limits on the amount unlike efi who limits you to 50% of the total tunershop cost.

When it comes to cost effectiveness ours comes out on top.

minytrker

iTrader: (13)

Both charge $99 for a license or credit. The biggest difference is in how there unlimited or streams work. HPT goes by year, example unlimited 2002 camaro vs EFI goes by pcm, with EFI you would spend a little more BUT you would have unlimited 99-04 PCM not just one unlimited car. The custome OS are also free with EFI. I have both HPT and EFI, HPT would be cheaper if your just going to tune just camaro's but if your tuning alot of differnt cars EFI is cheaper IMO.

CalEditor

iTrader: (1)

It also depends on what you plan to adjust.

Just so we are on the same page

HPT = 02 SLP & SS & Z28 Auto 12212156 .bin = Total Parameters : 572

JET = 02 SLP & SS & Z28 Auto 12212156 .bin = Total Parameters: 609

EFILive = 02 SLP & SS & Z28 Auto 12212156 .bin = Total Parameters : 680

I own all 3

ringram

Did you include the user extend cax files available from the efilive website to add lean cruise, dynamic fueling etc to the out of the box 680 parameters?
If not then you need to add another 10+ as well as the custom OS stuff?

CalEditor

iTrader: (1)

I did not and I did not to HPT or JET.

TwitchZ28

iTrader: (3)

ok well in my certain situation I feel like it would be cheaper to do efi live because most all the cars I would be tuning would be ls1 f-bodies...however having to pay for a 99 credit, then a 00 credit, then an 01 credit, then an 02 credit...seems more expensive. Correct me if i'm wrong

foff667

iTrader: (2)

In this case you are incorrect.

Efi doesn't even offer credits for 99, 00, 01, 02 lol

You pay vehicle by vehicle forever unless you opt for the unlimited license which is what? $3000k

Our gen 3 car unlimited license is $1500(less then that if you consider your interface already comes with $400 in credits) and comes with unlimited vcm enhancements for that license.

As stated our licensing is always going to be the cheaper route no matter what any of the efi fanboys portray.

TwitchZ28

iTrader: (3)

o awesome. thanks for the info foff. I appreciate it.

can anyone argue a case as to why efi live could be better? I know there are a lot of hardcore efi guys and a lot of hardcore hptuners guys. So far foff and the others are being very helpful but I am trying to be fully educated on either side before making a decision

thanks

thing is to me that people seem to bitch about not having the enhanced os for free from hp tuners but way i see it I have the option to use it on my car and not **** with it on other peoples cars.


o and one more question for you foff! On the website by the suite it says something about dodge credits coming soon. Does that mean that we will be able to tune some dodge's soon??? That would super pump me up cause my dad has a 2010 Challenger R/T and I might be getting a 98 Ram 1500 5.9 magnum to daily.

CalEditor

iTrader: (1)

I can, but for you HPT will do.

You can get JET tuning software and one of the best scaning software you can purchase for under $520, but it is for a more advanced user and not a beginer

minytrker

iTrader: (13)

I am not sure how you always argue HPT is cheaper. I HAVE HPT and EFI and use both all the time. I like parts of EFI and parts of HPT, and wish you could combine the two and have the badest tuning software out there. I am just glad that EFI & HPT are both out there because I think they are both way ahead of the other tuning options out there. HPT is cheaper for a single vehicle platform for example if you are a corvette shop. BUT if you tune alot of differnt vehicles EFI is cheaper with the way they do there stream for pcm type. For example I bought E38 stream in 06 or 07 when it came out and have been tuning almost every new car & truck that has come out without buying anything. Back to the LS1 stream its $2495 retail for ALL LS1 BASED PCM's 98-2004 and includes the following vehicles,
Can you tune all those for $2495 with HPT?
04-05 Cadillac CTS-V 5.7L
99-02 Chevrolet Camaro 5.7L
99-04 Chevrolet Corvette 5.7L
99-06 Holden Commodore 5.7L
01-05 Holden Monaro 5.7L
99-02 Pontiac Firebird 5.7L
04 Pontiac GTO 5.7L
V8 SUV's
00-05 Buick Rainier 5.3L
00-05 Chevrolet Suburban 4.8L, 5.3L, 6.0L 8.1L
00-05 Chevrolet Tahoe 4.8L, 5.3L
00-05 Chevrolet Trailblazer 5.3L
00-05 GMC Envoy 5.3L
00-06 GMC Yukon & Denali 4.8L, 5.3L, 6.0L 8.1L
02-07 Hummer H2 6.0L
00-05 Isuzu Ascender 5.3L
V6 SUV's
00-04 Chevrolet Blazer 4.3L
00-04 Chevrolet S10 4.3L
01 GMC Jimmy 4.3L
01-04 GMC Sonoma 4.3L
01 Oldsmobile Bravada 4.3L
V8 Trucks
02-06 Cadillac Escalade 5.3L, 6.0L
02-06 Chevrolet Avalanche 5.3L, 8.1L
03-09 Chevrolet Kodiak 8.1L
99-07 Chevrolet Silverado 4.8L, 5.3L, 6.0L 8.1L
03-04 Chevrolet SSR 5.3L
99-07 GMC Sierra 4.8L, 5.3L, 6.0L 8.1L
03-09 GMC Topkick 8.1L
V6 Trucks
01-07 Chevrolet Silverado 4.3L
01-07 GMC Sierra 4.3L
V8 Vans
01-07 Chevrolet Express 4.8L, 5.3L, 6.0L
01-07 GMC Savana 4.8L, 5.3L, 6.0L
V6 Vans
01-05 Chevrolet Astro 4.3L
01-07 Chevrolet Express 4.3L
01-05 GMC Safari 4.3L
01-07 GMC Savana 4.3L

TwitchZ28

iTrader: (3)

well seeing as I dont plan on having a shop or doing a ton of tuning ill just charge people who I tune for the price of a licence and a little more for cash in my pocket. I can do vehicle specific either way so I dont see it as a big deal for me. and with hpt I get a few free up front and a cheaper starting price.

btw what is my motivation for buying the pro over the standard?

gofastwclass

iTrader: (2)

I have multiple cars I tune (all mine plus a couple of friends) so I only bought licenses for what I use. I'm never (and you probably won't either) going to need a multi-vehicle or blanket group because it would never pay for itself.

Pro (HPT) gives you the ability to have inputs like a wideband O2 or other outboard sensors go directly in the program. With HPT there is a scan tool / data log function which allows you to monitor and record those and all the factory sensors real time, the play them back and watch what your engine was really doing at 5800 RPM when it went lean and hiccuped or whatever. I think EFI Live has a similar option but I don't remember the details on it.

One thing is certain - go pro if you are going to tune cars (even just your own) and get a wideband. Otherwise you are just changing random parameters without knowledge of what they actually did.

TwitchZ28

iTrader: (3)

o ok thank you very much man. that's what i needed to hear

as of now the only thing I can think of that would be better from efi live is that I could do all my friends tunes in real time on enhanced os without having to pay 200 dollars worth of licensing for each car... I would have to charge everyone more that 200 dollars for a street tune just to put any money in my pocket...that is unless I opted to just tune them in non enhanced os...which idk how much of a difference it would be overall. can someone elaborate on how much harder and less accurate it would be doing standard tunes to others rides and not anhanced os

minytrker

iTrader: (13)

From reading what your wanting to either EFI or HPT Pro will do the job. It will just come down to you making the choice. Like I said before I have both and like and dislike things about each one so it comes down to personal choice. The custom OS are nice and I use them fairly often but I have tuned way more vehicles without them. They dont make your tune better they just give back or add more tables or more functions like high and low timing tables in SD. They also allow some come neat things like in EFI adding nitrous tables. But in the end both EFI & HPT get the job done.

foff667

iTrader: (2)

efilive does not offer any real time tuning custom operating systems, you'd need to purchase the $1000 3rd party hardware/software license for that

foff667

iTrader: (2)

As usual you haven't been listening.

He's going to be tuning LS1 based fbodies, not trucks, not vans, not 4.3ltr S10's.

BTW can you tune all of those for $1500 with EFI? No you can't, so get on point rather than posting non factual information.

TwitchZ28

iTrader: (3)

foff do you know the answer to the dodge question? I would love to be able to tune my step dad's 2010 R/T 5.7 hemi challenger and his 98 ram 5.9 magnum...and my 98 ram 5.9 magnum haha.

But other than that most tuning should be ls1's and stangs...

another thing the website shows that you can only tune 05+ 4.6 mustangs. is that true? or can you also tune the 96-04 4.6's? cause that is what a lot of my car friends drive.

foff667

iTrader: (2)

We have long term plans to support the older JTEC pcms found in the older 98 ram's as well as the NGC4 pcm's found in the newer 07+ hemi's, we are currently working on the NGC3 stuff.

We currently only support the 05+ V8 Mustangs but have done some 05+ V6 Mustang cals on a case by case basis. The older EEC ford stuff is still a ways away.