what internals are the 850rwhp+ guys using?
09-09-2005, 03:06 PM
#1
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what internals are the 850rwhp+ guys using? what rods, pistons, crank, and rings are you guys using for a 850+rwhp durable (if its possilbe) FI setup?
09-09-2005, 07:21 PM
#4
"Stock crank will take 850" 
He said rwhp, which would make the crank HP over 1000. No way the stock crank will live at those levels, and I believe you'd be foolish to build a
GRENADE
like that....
$hit could kill you or someone nearby.... cuz you know it won't blow when you're going 20mph...
Jim
He said rwhp, which would make the crank HP over 1000. No way the stock crank will live at those levels, and I believe you'd be foolish to build a
GRENADE
like that....
$hit could kill you or someone nearby.... cuz you know it won't blow when you're going 20mph...
Jim
09-09-2005, 07:37 PM
#6
To quote Harlan directly: "Although i don't recommend it to anyone, i ran a stock crank up until the end of last year. . . I've since gone to a callies crank, no need to gamble. . ."
Jim
Jim
09-09-2005, 07:42 PM
#7
i totally agree.There no need to freaking risk it at those power levels.....so there are people making 800+ rwhp on a stock crank,does that mean they arent risking it?of course not.if ur going for #'s like that its foolish.I went eagle crank,callies rods,Weiseco pistons.
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09-09-2005, 07:42 PM
#8
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Originally Posted by DeltaT
To quote Harlan directly: "Although i don't recommend it to anyone, i ran a stock crank up until the end of last year. . . I've since gone to a callies crank, no need to gamble. . ."
Jim
Jim
09-09-2005, 07:53 PM
#10
that makes sense.....so when he drops $10+K on his setup and uses a stock crank,if he ever gets serious about the car or decides to make more power then he either tears her down to replace the crank....or risks it and prays for no bye bye motor.and he never stated he was staying with a 346....evil twin no flame intended but do you own an ls1 or just the stang?just curious....
09-09-2005, 08:21 PM
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Presently I don't own an LS1 powered F-bod, although I have owned a Z28, do own a 5.3L gen3 powered sierra, and am looking into getting a nice low miles 04 Z06 before Xmas if I can snag one.
I don't know about you but I consider 850 RWHP to be "getting serious" and if he wants to get race car serious the difference between pulling the motor down to re-ring and change all the bearings (which he should do) and re-ringing the motor with new bearings and a new crank isn't a whole lot more effort. Mightymouse is doing the stock crank shibango and making a lot of power with pump gas and meth, and I don't want to say he is for sure, but I'm fairly certain Big_TT_Paul is running a stock crank in his C5 that has been making 1000 RWHP for a year and is running 8's with a glide now.
I don't know about you but I consider 850 RWHP to be "getting serious" and if he wants to get race car serious the difference between pulling the motor down to re-ring and change all the bearings (which he should do) and re-ringing the motor with new bearings and a new crank isn't a whole lot more effort. Mightymouse is doing the stock crank shibango and making a lot of power with pump gas and meth, and I don't want to say he is for sure, but I'm fairly certain Big_TT_Paul is running a stock crank in his C5 that has been making 1000 RWHP for a year and is running 8's with a glide now.
09-09-2005, 11:07 PM
#14
I agree with ddnspider - what's another $750 or $1000 when you are building a motor to that level.
I like the German philosophy - overbuild and understress. That is the key to reliability. I don't know about you, but reliability is high on my list for a street car, cuz I'll put thousands of miles on it.
GM will tell you that crank is only good for 350HP. Even double that, which is being generous, is pushing it. Spring for another grand and get a crank built for your peak power level.
Your drivetrain is like the proverbial chain - it is only as strong as its weakest link. Maybe you're right, but if you are wrong you will be stranded with a grenaded motor somewhere like Bakersfield, CA!
Even Harlan switched to a Callies crank, so why argue?
Jim
I like the German philosophy - overbuild and understress. That is the key to reliability. I don't know about you, but reliability is high on my list for a street car, cuz I'll put thousands of miles on it.
GM will tell you that crank is only good for 350HP. Even double that, which is being generous, is pushing it. Spring for another grand and get a crank built for your peak power level.
Your drivetrain is like the proverbial chain - it is only as strong as its weakest link. Maybe you're right, but if you are wrong you will be stranded with a grenaded motor somewhere like Bakersfield, CA!
Even Harlan switched to a Callies crank, so why argue?
Jim
09-10-2005, 06:52 AM
#15
Yep, i switched. Various reasons, not limited to ultimate strength however.
I did run a stock crank at various power levels from stock power to north of 1KRW, ran the same crank for nearly 3 years. That crank saw an Incon kit with a mild HC, the 66 setup w/ the 6 speed (briefly) and almost a full season w/ the 66's and the glide. I ultimately replaced that crank w/ another stocker right before thunder last year when we lost the roller tip off a crane lifter and took out the bottom end. I didn't think twice about shoving another $400 crank in it then.
For most, the stocker will get the job done. I had that crank fluxed a few times and never saw any indications of impending failure.
I had to eventually ask myself, when is too much too much? finally deciding to make a track only setup (yes we took the 66/glide setup on the streets
) and rethinking the goals finally convinced me to switch. Maybe i'm just getting old, but driving over a crank at 180+ wasn't high on my priority list 
I did run a stock crank at various power levels from stock power to north of 1KRW, ran the same crank for nearly 3 years. That crank saw an Incon kit with a mild HC, the 66 setup w/ the 6 speed (briefly) and almost a full season w/ the 66's and the glide. I ultimately replaced that crank w/ another stocker right before thunder last year when we lost the roller tip off a crane lifter and took out the bottom end. I didn't think twice about shoving another $400 crank in it then.
For most, the stocker will get the job done. I had that crank fluxed a few times and never saw any indications of impending failure.
I had to eventually ask myself, when is too much too much? finally deciding to make a track only setup (yes we took the 66/glide setup on the streets
) and rethinking the goals finally convinced me to switch. Maybe i'm just getting old, but driving over a crank at 180+ wasn't high on my priority list
09-10-2005, 11:04 AM
#16
Originally Posted by ty_ty13
what rods, pistons, crank, and rings are you guys using for a 850+rwhp durable (if its possilbe) FI setup?
09-10-2005, 12:56 PM
#17
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Originally Posted by DeltaT
I agree with ddnspider - what's another $750 or $1000 when you are building a motor to that level.
I like the German philosophy - overbuild and understress. That is the key to reliability. I don't know about you, but reliability is high on my list for a street car, cuz I'll put thousands of miles on it.
GM will tell you that crank is only good for 350HP. Even double that, which is being generous, is pushing it. Spring for another grand and get a crank built for your peak power level.
Your drivetrain is like the proverbial chain - it is only as strong as its weakest link. Maybe you're right, but if you are wrong you will be stranded with a grenaded motor somewhere like Bakersfield, CA!
Even Harlan switched to a Callies crank, so why argue?
Jim
I like the German philosophy - overbuild and understress. That is the key to reliability. I don't know about you, but reliability is high on my list for a street car, cuz I'll put thousands of miles on it.
GM will tell you that crank is only good for 350HP. Even double that, which is being generous, is pushing it. Spring for another grand and get a crank built for your peak power level.
Your drivetrain is like the proverbial chain - it is only as strong as its weakest link. Maybe you're right, but if you are wrong you will be stranded with a grenaded motor somewhere like Bakersfield, CA!
Even Harlan switched to a Callies crank, so why argue?
Jim
Harlan runs a 30 (?) inch tall tire, so why argue and run a 27 or 28?
Harlan runs a powerglide, so why argue and even think about a T56?
Harlan ran twin T66's, so why argue and run something smaller in your street car?
I know, how about this one.
Even pro mod blower cars run billet cranks, so why argue and even think about a forged crank.
Even Pro 5.0 cars run clutchless lencos, so why argue and run a powerglide?
Even the space shuttle runs solid fuel rocket boosters, so why argue and even think about internal combustion?
So if your philosphy is overbuild, why even mess with a stock block? C5R all the way. Overbuild that bitch to the max. Eagle rods? Bitch please. Have cunningham whip out you some custom TI rods for 490 a piece. What's 490 dollars a rod when you need to overbuild! A forged crank really isn't enough either, nothing less than overbuilt, so we need to go billet. 2 grand on top of a forged crank is nothing when you need to overbuild, right? I don't think a 12-bolt or 9" is quite good enough either, what's another couple grand for a strange 9.5" rear end? Your argument is weaker than steven hawkins trying to wrestle
And for the record, I'm done with this argument.
Last edited by eviltwins; 09-10-2005 at 01:33 PM.
09-10-2005, 02:01 PM
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Originally Posted by eviltwins
How can you even say that doubling 350 HP is being generous and pushing it? It's been proven to hold 800+ rear wheel on many different occassions, but you can say 700 is pushing it from your vast amounts of personal experience and knowledge? Harlan's situation gunning for 7's @ 180+ MPH making 1500-odd horsepower, once again, is a bit different from an 850 RWHP street setup.
Harlan runs a 30 (?) inch tall tire, so why argue and run a 27 or 28?
Harlan runs a powerglide, so why argue and even think about a T56?
Harlan ran twin T66's, so why argue and run something smaller in your street car?
I know, how about this one.
Even pro mod blower cars run billet cranks, so why argue and even think about a forged crank.
Even Pro 5.0 cars run clutchless lencos, so why argue and run a powerglide?
Even the space shuttle runs solid fuel rocket boosters, so why argue and even think about internal combustion?
So if your philosphy is overbuild, why even mess with a stock block? C5R all the way. Overbuild that bitch to the max. Eagle rods? Bitch please. Have cunningham whip out you some custom TI rods for 490 a piece. What's 490 dollars a rod when you need to overbuild! A forged crank really isn't enough either, nothing less than overbuilt, so we need to go billet. 2 grand on top of a forged crank is nothing when you need to overbuild, right? I don't think a 12-bolt or 9" is quite good enough either, what's another couple grand for a strange 9.5" rear end? Your argument is weaker than steven hawkins trying to wrestle
And for the record, I'm done with this argument.
Harlan runs a 30 (?) inch tall tire, so why argue and run a 27 or 28?
Harlan runs a powerglide, so why argue and even think about a T56?
Harlan ran twin T66's, so why argue and run something smaller in your street car?
I know, how about this one.
Even pro mod blower cars run billet cranks, so why argue and even think about a forged crank.
Even Pro 5.0 cars run clutchless lencos, so why argue and run a powerglide?
Even the space shuttle runs solid fuel rocket boosters, so why argue and even think about internal combustion?
So if your philosphy is overbuild, why even mess with a stock block? C5R all the way. Overbuild that bitch to the max. Eagle rods? Bitch please. Have cunningham whip out you some custom TI rods for 490 a piece. What's 490 dollars a rod when you need to overbuild! A forged crank really isn't enough either, nothing less than overbuilt, so we need to go billet. 2 grand on top of a forged crank is nothing when you need to overbuild, right? I don't think a 12-bolt or 9" is quite good enough either, what's another couple grand for a strange 9.5" rear end? Your argument is weaker than steven hawkins trying to wrestle
And for the record, I'm done with this argument.
you should be ashamed of your self.... that is really horrible to say...