TK 14 SS

Could someone please explain the Torque management in LS1Edit on an M6 for me. Also is this basically for when the car senses "LOW TRAC" and/or "ASR". If so can I get rid of it or basically tone it down a bit.

Thanks in advance!
I'm going to work now but will check back in the morning

Troy

felton316

What it does: if the car's pcm determines more than 350ft-lbs (stock PCM value) it will reduce timing to prolong the life of the transmission. Less power = longer life according to GM.

CAT3

iTrader: (9)

Different view maybe, but I thought it was for the above AND when the car PCM senses the shift, right before it pulls timing therefore reducing torque and adding longevity!

Any1 else?

felton316

Cat3, that is true, If you ever watch the delivered torque value on a scanner during a shift, it will go to an outragoues number due to the load lifting off of it for a brief second. I have logged some full throttle runs, that during a shift it reported 1400ft-lbs! That's why I believe that shifts do activate TM also.

FAST99Z

what he said (shifting and pull timing)

Team ZR-1

The bogus values you are seeing are NOT from the PCM, it is a bug in your scanner software that has been there for years and vendor never fixes it. It is a computer math problem from the old 640K RAM limits and scanner software is not doing the math conversion correctly.

Using a valid scanner and you'll not see those types of values and those bogus ones are leading you into a wrong thought process.

Torque management is looking for sudden SPIKEs, not just going over the value that is set within the PCM.

You can go above the set value if you engine is smoothly increasing in engine load, what it looks for is sudden spikes above the set value as if spinning the tires it know that rear wheels are rotating faster then fronts.
Its purpose is to save drivetrain from sudden increase of torque/stress, traction control and if a A4 trannie to take the load off trannie by unlocking torque converter.

felton316

Hey thanks JR for that little tid bit. I'm still using the ancient DOS version of AutoTap.

CAT3

iTrader: (9)

John, what exactly are the repurcussions of disabling/deleting TM?

TK 14 SS

Whoa!
Great information thanks guys.

So now that I was seeing just slightly above 350 ft/lbs all the way from 3,500 to 5,000 rpm at the wheels I'm thinking that maybe it is/was affecting the timing/power.

Next, question is where do I go from "here" do I just increase the "max torque" within the torque management??? or like CAT3 asked what if (how do) I disable/delete it???

Boy! between this (TM), the COT's, dirty MAF sensors, and the throttle cable not opening the throttle all the way (much less me "adjusting" the bump stop), I've got to have more power yet

felton316

I have set max torque to '639' (I believe that is the internal limit of the pcm from the ls1edit list). I also set all values in the torque reduction table to zeros. I have a 98 M6, so thats all I needed to do, A4 guys I believe there is another table you need to modify. After turning off TM, it was one of those mods you can feel in the seat of your pants!

Team ZR-1

I know of 2 Corvettes that have crashed because someone upped the TM and TC values so high that when the car needed those functions they did not turn on and drivers lost control.
Of course with TM turned off more stress/load is put on drivetrain.

If your scanner works correctly ( I use Ease and never see bogus values) and your scanning/recording Delivered Torque and you see negative values AND your on the gas pedal then T.M has kicked in, if backing off the gas pedal then of course torque would be reduced and should have negative values.
This way you know if you need to tweak TM or not.

Team ZR-1

If ( again if your scanner works correctly) and your not seeing nagative values when ON TPS then TM is not effecting your performance, if you have high negative values that is the amount of torque being backing off, thus if you are in process of shifting and backing off of TPS then it is normal for torque value to go negative since lifting would cause engine to be producing less power.

You could go and adjust TM via LS1edit and command how much torque for each gear or how much timing is yanked for each gear which could be a plus for if your getting too much wheel spin costing you time, but controlling TM/TC you could reduce that spin and have better traction and constant smooth output of power.

Do not use a TM value greater then 640, anything above that is a bogus value and would confuse PCM.

A4 trannie is tougher to deal with since PCM controls torque converter, as to when it locks or unlocks it so tuning TM and TC requires more thought process and selective tuning of those functions.

CAT3

iTrader: (9)

Holy shiat. All I ever heard was turn it off (raise values etc..). Now all this....ouch. Maybe it is time to test-n-tune. I am ashamed to say that I never knew what TM's purpose was until recently and my opinion was, get rid of it al together. Would be nice to dial it in for max. traction and time. But might have to play around with it for a while which will be slower since i am using Predator.

Cal

iTrader: (1)

If you watch the ignition timing on Autotap or EFILive, you will see it drop to zero anytime you push in the clutch to shift. It's probably good to leave it that way until you upgrade the stock clutch and rear-end.

malibu350

okay a little new to messing with the t/m. I have the T-56 tranny in my TA. I changed the max torque to 600 to be on the safe side. Should I try changing anything else. The only time I get the low traction light is when I down shift.

Hybrid Slow

What about the TM in the LS1 Trucks? Is it the same system? How much more complicated would it be in an automatic 4x4?

Thanks.

malibu350

ttt

Black LS1 T/A

Ken Kelly did say, in the LS1-Edit list, that some people report incorrect behavior with settings above 639 for Max TQ. He said SOME PCM's make this a negative value (anything above 639) and he planned to enforce this limit.

My car dyno'd 656 RWTQ. I guess I will lose this AND I plan on upping the boost at some point. If I could increase the RWHP and let the RWTQ stay where it's at, I guess I would have no beef. But won't cutting torque also cut horsepower?

iateyourcat

Does it cut all tq above a given threshold or does it just cut it under low traction? Either way I'd want get rid of most of the tq reduction..

Team ZR-1

TM is only looking for a sudden SPIKE of torque above the TM value set in the PCM.

It has no effect if your rear tires are not spinning, your engine could have 800 ft/lbs and be just fine, until PCM sees a sudden change where rear tires are rotating faster then the fronts, then it would compare PCM's set value and react.

Setting the max TM value in PCM above 640 would then cause a problem for the PCM software was designed to compare a max TM set value of 640 and any value above that could not be understood by PCM software and thus any time TM would be kicked in with a invalid set value PCM would be confused.