rockytopper

I fired my Ls1 engine which was a pull out. It has zero oil pressure. The only mod I did was install a S&P modified pan and tube to fit my cutlass. I read on here that others have had similar issues. I noted problems fitting the pan back on because it hit the pickup tube. After a bit of persuaion I was able to get it on. The pick up tube hit the two vane ribs in the pan. It looked like it was going to be very close to the bottm but I did not check the clearance to the bottom of the pan. I called S&P and explained to them the fit issues and how I went about the installation. I put the tube in the pump and torqued it down before attaching the main bearing support. I had to bend the tube and support to line it up and then tighten it. I was told that this is normal and even thow I may have preloaded the tube that the o ring unless it slipped and got damaged should not be causing the problem. I was told to remove the pan and tube and stuff the pump full of vaseline to prime it. The S&P rep said they have had the same pronblems with pull out engines or crate engines that have set for a long period and that GM actually has this noted in a service bulletin. That's all well and good but I hate to pull the engine and go thru this if I can avoid it. I just mentioned to my buddy why can't I just over fill the pan to submerge the tube and pump, crank it over and drain the excess oil out. I found in another post that this had been done. Is this a valid approach? I want to prime the engine with a primer canister thru the sending unit and then try this before pulling the engine and checking the tube. I put on a mechanical gage so I know I have no oil moving. I did not fill the filter which I will also do and after checking it it is also dry so no oil is moving. I sure hope I didn't screw this engine running it a couple of minutes with out oil. please advise before I preceed. Thanks in adance.

LS1-450

iTrader: (33)

Don't run it. Just turn it over w/ the starter until the oil moves or builds some pressure. Why not try the over fill approach, as long as, you DO NOT start the engine. You don't want the cam spinning that fast while partially submerged in oil. You'll know if any damage by metal flakes...etc.. I double bolted my pick up tube on the pump because it always looked cocked with the stock one bolt arrangement. Here is a pick. If the overfill doesn't help, then I'd check the "o"-ring & double bolt the pick up tube, personally. Also, make sure that the other end of the tube isn't blocked or up against anything. Sounds like you may have it against the bottom of the pan. Might also be up against a baffle or the side of the pan. Good-luck

BTW, I have primed SBC pumps w/vaseline before, but, never had to prime my LS6 that way. The pump arrangements are different. Although, that doesn't mean that the LSX style oil pump can't be primed by using vaseline.
It's more likely an "o"-ring issue.

LS1-450

iTrader: (33)

Another thing that is often missed is the oil port fitting that needs to be installed in the back driver's side of the block under the rear cover. Have you had the rear cover off? The fitting looks like a barbell. It goes here. See pics.

rockytopper

The only thing removed was the oil pan and tube. I haven't even removed the trans that came attached to it.

rockytopper

The only other noted difference was the pan from S&P uses a different oil filter than the stock pan I bought with the engine. They will not innerchange because the threads are different.

LS1-450

iTrader: (33)

OK, then it's probably the "o"-ring or the end of the pick up tube, maybe a prime issue. Go with your plan. Disconnect the fuel & spark, over-fill & turn it over w/ the strarter, then go from there. Good-luck

bczee

iTrader: (12)

Rock.. I had the same problem. I replaced my pump with a stock LS6 pump.. but that most likely is a problem and I just swap it in just to be safe.

Most likely the oil ring and pickup tube are not seated flush since you had to bend it around.. I would check it again. .but also with the modified tube and pan.. you really need to check the pickup and the bottom clearance of the pan.

I also just filled my pump with STP to help create a vacuum for the oil to be pump and primed.
You should be able to just remove the front accessories, balancer/pully and the cover. Check the pickup tube to make sure it is flush. If that looks good, remove the front of the oil pump and pack it with grease or oil of your choice. In on mag write of a build that I read a while ago. I saw/read that while they were building the engine on the stand and upside down. they filled the pickup tube with oil, repalce the pan and then flipped it over to complete the build.. that might have at lease keep enough oil to make a good seal in the pump so that on startup, it would prime ok.

JMBLOWNWS6

iTrader: (17)

Weird. I was under the impression that the starter does not produce enuff RPM's to pump oil. If I am not mistaken I also read that in one of W2W threads.

rockytopper

quote "I saw/read that while they were building the engine on the stand and upside down. they filled the pickup tube with oil, repalce the pan and then flipped it over to complete the build".

So why wouldn't over filling the crankcase so that the tube is complerely full and maybe even full enough to enter the oil pump work. AM I going to cause catastrophic failure by turning the engine over with this much oil in it? Then drain it back to normal level as soon as I see oil moving in the sending unit hole. my plan is to add 12 qts total to the engine. I calulated the volume of the pan and it is approximately .384 cubic ft or 2.874 gal (12 qts) I am going to put one or 2 of the 12 qts down the sending unit hole with a small funnel. If I'm about to do somethin stupid here someone please save me.

rockytopper

from what I read it's pumps but will not create any amount of pressure when cranking with the starter.

Rodder

iTrader: (2)

My 40K mile LS1 made about 15 psi cranking it with the starter (fuel system dry/unplugged) after sitting for a year and getting a new Autokraft pan/pickup. It took it about 30 seconds of cranking for the pressure to come up the first time.

Before you do ANYTHING else you need to remove the pan and check the O-ring AND the clearance between the pickup and the bottom of the pan. There have been several people on here who had problems with the S&P-modified pickup and had to fix the clearance on it.

If it was my motor and someone had run it for a couple of minutes without oil, I'd be tearing it down to inspect the bearings, cam, and pistons.

LS240sx

iTrader: (12)

we made a tool to prime oil pumps but it requires an old crank bolt and timing piece off the snout of the crank. Just welded them together and insert it over the crank snout with the oil pump on and in place. Take the old timing piece off and slide you piece over the front till it slides in the pump. Then we just took a drill that turned 800 rpms and turned it over till oil pressure cam up. Then we pulled it apart and reassembled the motor and instant pressure when it started.

rockytopper

I just read this post

https://ls1tech.com/forums/showthrea...prime+oil+pump

this appear to be the way to go. just pull the plug behind the alt and pump the oil in, I think this should lead right to the pump

Cam72aro

iTrader: (28)

I dont think that the pump priming is the problem. I think you either bent the pickup tube out of the pump inlet or cut the oring or something of that nature. You can crank on the starter and it will build pressure. Mine will go up to around 30 if I crank on the starter long enough. Pull the pan, check the pickup. Josh

55chevy

iTrader: (6)

While I'll was trouble shooting my no start issue the weekend, I had enough oil pressure to cause a leak in a loose oil sendor plug on the top back of the block. The electric gauge did not come up when the ignition was in the crank position but it did show about 15 psi when I released the key. So I assume the electric guage looses power during the cranking and the engine does build up to about 15 psi.

Good luck.

kevin 67/6.0

I hope you find the problem out . I just ordered a oil pan and picup for my 6.0. Mine came from BRP but i dont want any isues later. Let me know what to look for. So when i install it i will know what to look for. (thanks)

LS1MCSS

iTrader: (18)

I am gonna guess that the pickup is flat against the bottom of the pan, cutting off the oil inlet.

forcd ind

iTrader: (7)

i wonder if jacking up the rear would allow enough oil to run into the pump-you guys got me worried now when i go to fire it up-lol
this kind of reminds me what i had to do when i ran a Howard Stewart race pump (fuel) on my s/b, hell to prime it

bczee

iTrader: (12)

I think if you can some how just get some oil into the pump, that it would create a vacuum and start pulling oil up the pickup tube.. providing the Oil and Pickup Tube is not your problem.

george88gta

iTrader: (3)

I tried this method. I used a hand pump and I was able to get about 3/4 of a quart in to the system before I felt any back pressure. Since this plug is right next to the oil pump, I have to believe that this method fills the pump. This is the procedure that you would follow if you were using the GM oil primer kit ( manufactured by Kent-Moore). I wonder if just overfilling the system with oil, is still trapping air pockets ( similar to refilling a drained cooling system and trapping air in the heater core) and you have to get those air pockets out before you build up oil presure and flow. I havent started my engine yet, so I cant comment on how well this worked, but the process seems correct.