Sponsors!!! LTx support??
05-25-2006, 03:53 PM
#1
Sponsors!!! LTx support?? Well ok... i know this is a LSx board and all... But i mean there is a pretty large LTx following here. I jsut dont see a ton of support for the motors though.
Like when i got to turbo my motor... I need tuning and what not. But im basicly screwed. There is Tunercats and LT1edit... and that is it. There is no one in the area to tune my car (no one withone hundreds and hundreds of miles... i dont know of anyone).
Aftermarket EMS is kinda out of the question untill this winter or so, and i will need some sort of support in the near future.
I know the PTK kit is available. But that still doesn't solve my tuning issues. And I plan on making my kit anyways.
Like when i got to turbo my motor... I need tuning and what not. But im basicly screwed. There is Tunercats and LT1edit... and that is it. There is no one in the area to tune my car (no one withone hundreds and hundreds of miles... i dont know of anyone).
Aftermarket EMS is kinda out of the question untill this winter or so, and i will need some sort of support in the near future.
I know the PTK kit is available. But that still doesn't solve my tuning issues. And I plan on making my kit anyways.
05-25-2006, 05:52 PM
#3
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You could look into a piggyback DFI setup..... don't know what it costs nowadays but you don't HAVE to go the standalone route AFAIK..... A piggyback just splices into your stock wiring harness allowing you to keep all your other engine functions but the motor and it's sensors are under the DFI box' control.... idle speed, fueling and spark, etc are all user controlled... I had a setup like this on my old 355 and it worked flawlessly.... and it's much cheaper than a full standalone system like FAST or Gen VII DFI with a standalone harness.... Joe Overton might know how to source one for your needs..... It'll probably run a grand...
05-25-2006, 06:11 PM
#4
Originally Posted by OutlawZ
You could look into a piggyback DFI setup..... don't know what it costs nowadays but you don't HAVE to go the standalone route AFAIK..... A piggyback just splices into your stock wiring harness allowing you to keep all your other engine functions but the motor and it's sensors are under the DFI box' control.... idle speed, fueling and spark, etc are all user controlled... I had a setup like this on my old 355 and it worked flawlessly.... and it's much cheaper than a full standalone system like FAST or Gen VII DFI with a standalone harness.... Joe Overton might know how to source one for your needs..... It'll probably run a grand...
I have thrown around a ton of ideas and im still deciding. First was Megasquirt. Then Holley (but herd it has problems). Then Fast XFI.
Piggy back sounds like an alright system for now at least. But then again i may just go with a simple turbo system.. injectors... and a rich mail order tune. Then save for the XFI with a PCB harness to make it plug directily into the stock harness.
05-25-2006, 06:22 PM
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Where do you live?. There are still faithful companies that deal with the LT1 community. Just to name a few. Thunder Racing,Combination motorsports, LS1speed. Anyone of those outfits will be able to help you along.
05-25-2006, 06:23 PM
#6
Originally Posted by MEAN LT1
Where do you live?. There are still faithful companies that deal with the LT1 community. Just to name a few. Thunder Racing,Combination motorsports, LS1speed. Anyone of those outfits will be able to help you along.
05-25-2006, 09:16 PM
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I was running a Gen VI DFI box. not the new style GEN VII but the analog based box with a splice in harness..... There probably aren't very many Gen VI boxes left around with all the new systems that are out.... It's an outdated setup but it did the job that's for sure.... You could possibly source one somewhere however...
I just bought the XFI setup... the complete standalone that completely removes the stock harness..... It's a pricey setup but the quality is great, everything is put together really well and the software is infinitely tuneable... I could plug this thing into a fuel injected blown big block on spray or on my 383 LT1 with the 400 shot direct port setup and it wouldn't care either way..... You 'd have to talk to the FAST people to find out if there is a splice in harness for the XFI setup.... Realistically speaking with the splice in all you are doing is "intercepting" the voltages coming from all your sensors at the PCM..... So you don't lose airbags, stock gauges, ABS, etc which might tie into the PCM.... Functionally however it does the same exact thing as a standalone, allowing all your programmable sensors to be modified and accept wider parameters that the PCM does not.....
I think you have the right idea. See if you can find a cheap splice in standalone box even if it's Gen VI..... If not go ahead and buy the LT1 Edit until you save up enough for the XFI... I've heard pretty good things about LT1 Edit up to about 800 hp or more than 7200 rpms (since the pcm logs off at that RPM).... With your turbo setup you would also be limited to high impedence injectors (I think 50lb units might be the limit for your app which might not be big enough....) hope this helps...
I just bought the XFI setup... the complete standalone that completely removes the stock harness..... It's a pricey setup but the quality is great, everything is put together really well and the software is infinitely tuneable... I could plug this thing into a fuel injected blown big block on spray or on my 383 LT1 with the 400 shot direct port setup and it wouldn't care either way..... You 'd have to talk to the FAST people to find out if there is a splice in harness for the XFI setup.... Realistically speaking with the splice in all you are doing is "intercepting" the voltages coming from all your sensors at the PCM..... So you don't lose airbags, stock gauges, ABS, etc which might tie into the PCM.... Functionally however it does the same exact thing as a standalone, allowing all your programmable sensors to be modified and accept wider parameters that the PCM does not.....
I think you have the right idea. See if you can find a cheap splice in standalone box even if it's Gen VI..... If not go ahead and buy the LT1 Edit until you save up enough for the XFI... I've heard pretty good things about LT1 Edit up to about 800 hp or more than 7200 rpms (since the pcm logs off at that RPM).... With your turbo setup you would also be limited to high impedence injectors (I think 50lb units might be the limit for your app which might not be big enough....) hope this helps...
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05-25-2006, 10:48 PM
#8
Originally Posted by OutlawZ
I was running a Gen VI DFI box. not the new style GEN VII but the analog based box with a splice in harness..... There probably aren't very many Gen VI boxes left around with all the new systems that are out.... It's an outdated setup but it did the job that's for sure.... You could possibly source one somewhere however...
I just bought the XFI setup... the complete standalone that completely removes the stock harness..... It's a pricey setup but the quality is great, everything is put together really well and the software is infinitely tuneable... I could plug this thing into a fuel injected blown big block on spray or on my 383 LT1 with the 400 shot direct port setup and it wouldn't care either way..... You 'd have to talk to the FAST people to find out if there is a splice in harness for the XFI setup.... Realistically speaking with the splice in all you are doing is "intercepting" the voltages coming from all your sensors at the PCM..... So you don't lose airbags, stock gauges, ABS, etc which might tie into the PCM.... Functionally however it does the same exact thing as a standalone, allowing all your programmable sensors to be modified and accept wider parameters that the PCM does not.....
I think you have the right idea. See if you can find a cheap splice in standalone box even if it's Gen VI..... If not go ahead and buy the LT1 Edit until you save up enough for the XFI... I've heard pretty good things about LT1 Edit up to about 800 hp or more than 7200 rpms (since the pcm logs off at that RPM).... With your turbo setup you would also be limited to high impedence injectors (I think 50lb units might be the limit for your app which might not be big enough....) hope this helps...
I just bought the XFI setup... the complete standalone that completely removes the stock harness..... It's a pricey setup but the quality is great, everything is put together really well and the software is infinitely tuneable... I could plug this thing into a fuel injected blown big block on spray or on my 383 LT1 with the 400 shot direct port setup and it wouldn't care either way..... You 'd have to talk to the FAST people to find out if there is a splice in harness for the XFI setup.... Realistically speaking with the splice in all you are doing is "intercepting" the voltages coming from all your sensors at the PCM..... So you don't lose airbags, stock gauges, ABS, etc which might tie into the PCM.... Functionally however it does the same exact thing as a standalone, allowing all your programmable sensors to be modified and accept wider parameters that the PCM does not.....
I think you have the right idea. See if you can find a cheap splice in standalone box even if it's Gen VI..... If not go ahead and buy the LT1 Edit until you save up enough for the XFI... I've heard pretty good things about LT1 Edit up to about 800 hp or more than 7200 rpms (since the pcm logs off at that RPM).... With your turbo setup you would also be limited to high impedence injectors (I think 50lb units might be the limit for your app which might not be big enough....) hope this helps...
I heard above 500 hp no matter what tuning program you are using you lose resolution and cant tune as well as you could below 500 hp (because we are talking a blown application... so the MAP sensor is a big deal... and the stock pcm hates 2-3 bar maps sensors.... so you lose resolution.. at least as far as i know...). Unless im wrong.. i wouldn't mind being told so...
For now 42# injectors and a decent tune on the stock shortblock will be alright... But later its going all out...
Like... i plan on standalone EMS.. then fuel system... upgrading from t61 to a larger turbo... then pulling motor and rebuild for the big boost. This way the car is never down for a long period and I can stretch the costs over a period of time while still driving the car.
Engine managment is a big deal right now and If i can get something to support 900 hp now, then im going for it. Now there is a company that makes it possible to plug the fast XFI directly into the stock harness... its about $700
but that is so much money and if i can get something cheaper... then i could afford it... i graduate tomarro.. so that kidna gives you a idea of the situation im in for cash.. lol...
Thanks for your help... I'll probly pm you a lil later on fuel system..
05-26-2006, 06:13 AM
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no problem..... I know Joe Overton is a dealer for Gen VII boxes..... I wish fasttrackperformance was still open or i'd refer you there. that is where i got my XFI box from but john mackenzie sold everything from DFI to XFI to harnesses and all the software... he sold his business to someone else and that person hasn't yet got everything up to speed....
05-26-2006, 09:06 AM
#10
Nick, some advice for you.
First, let me state that a local LS1 has made 820rwhp boosted on stock ecu.
Now, as far as LT1's go, here are some options i have thought about:
Option 1:
Run stock 1 bar MAP sensor and in the 100KPA cell for timing (last cell which is 0psi gauge) enter a conservative timing #. This timing number will be what you want at whatever given boost level you plan to run. What this means is that if you want to run 10psi and you want 15 degrees timing at 10psi, then in the 100kpa cell you would enter 15 degrees. The problem with this is that thru all boost levels 1-10psi they will all have the same low timing. This will cost you some power/tq doing it this way, but its the simplest.
Opton 2:
Run stock 1 bar MAP sensor and run a timing retard box (like MSD). This way you can have a somewhat normal timing # in the 100KPA cell (0 psi gauge) and then the box will pull timing based on the MSD box (it will pul 0-4 degrees per # of boost I believe).
Opton 3:
Run a 2 bar map sensor and rescale your timing tables and any other tables tha rely on MAP. The MAP sensors are 0-5V, so going from 1 bar to 2 bar means you need to scale the tabel in half. what this means is now 50kpa is 0psi and the 100kpa cell represents 14.5psi. So everything betwen 50-100kpa are the timing cells for boost.
Option 4: run an aftermarket setup.
Options 1,2 and 3 will require you to have different tunes for fueling due to different weather (summer versus winter tune). You can use tunercat or lt1edit.
First, let me state that a local LS1 has made 820rwhp boosted on stock ecu.
Now, as far as LT1's go, here are some options i have thought about:
Option 1:
Run stock 1 bar MAP sensor and in the 100KPA cell for timing (last cell which is 0psi gauge) enter a conservative timing #. This timing number will be what you want at whatever given boost level you plan to run. What this means is that if you want to run 10psi and you want 15 degrees timing at 10psi, then in the 100kpa cell you would enter 15 degrees. The problem with this is that thru all boost levels 1-10psi they will all have the same low timing. This will cost you some power/tq doing it this way, but its the simplest.
Opton 2:
Run stock 1 bar MAP sensor and run a timing retard box (like MSD). This way you can have a somewhat normal timing # in the 100KPA cell (0 psi gauge) and then the box will pull timing based on the MSD box (it will pul 0-4 degrees per # of boost I believe).
Opton 3:
Run a 2 bar map sensor and rescale your timing tables and any other tables tha rely on MAP. The MAP sensors are 0-5V, so going from 1 bar to 2 bar means you need to scale the tabel in half. what this means is now 50kpa is 0psi and the 100kpa cell represents 14.5psi. So everything betwen 50-100kpa are the timing cells for boost.
Option 4: run an aftermarket setup.
Options 1,2 and 3 will require you to have different tunes for fueling due to different weather (summer versus winter tune). You can use tunercat or lt1edit.
06-01-2006, 05:55 PM
#11
Originally Posted by OutlawZ
I was running a Gen VI DFI box. not the new style GEN VII but the analog based box with a splice in harness..... There probably aren't very many Gen VI boxes left around with all the new systems that are out.... It's an outdated setup but it did the job that's for sure.... You could possibly source one somewhere however...
I just bought the XFI setup... the complete standalone that completely removes the stock harness..... It's a pricey setup but the quality is great, everything is put together really well and the software is infinitely tuneable... I could plug this thing into a fuel injected blown big block on spray or on my 383 LT1 with the 400 shot direct port setup and it wouldn't care either way..... You 'd have to talk to the FAST people to find out if there is a splice in harness for the XFI setup.... Realistically speaking with the splice in all you are doing is "intercepting" the voltages coming from all your sensors at the PCM..... So you don't lose airbags, stock gauges, ABS, etc which might tie into the PCM.... Functionally however it does the same exact thing as a standalone, allowing all your programmable sensors to be modified and accept wider parameters that the PCM does not.....
I think you have the right idea. See if you can find a cheap splice in standalone box even if it's Gen VI..... If not go ahead and buy the LT1 Edit until you save up enough for the XFI... I've heard pretty good things about LT1 Edit up to about 800 hp or more than 7200 rpms (since the pcm logs off at that RPM).... With your turbo setup you would also be limited to high impedence injectors (I think 50lb units might be the limit for your app which might not be big enough....) hope this helps...
I just bought the XFI setup... the complete standalone that completely removes the stock harness..... It's a pricey setup but the quality is great, everything is put together really well and the software is infinitely tuneable... I could plug this thing into a fuel injected blown big block on spray or on my 383 LT1 with the 400 shot direct port setup and it wouldn't care either way..... You 'd have to talk to the FAST people to find out if there is a splice in harness for the XFI setup.... Realistically speaking with the splice in all you are doing is "intercepting" the voltages coming from all your sensors at the PCM..... So you don't lose airbags, stock gauges, ABS, etc which might tie into the PCM.... Functionally however it does the same exact thing as a standalone, allowing all your programmable sensors to be modified and accept wider parameters that the PCM does not.....
I think you have the right idea. See if you can find a cheap splice in standalone box even if it's Gen VI..... If not go ahead and buy the LT1 Edit until you save up enough for the XFI... I've heard pretty good things about LT1 Edit up to about 800 hp or more than 7200 rpms (since the pcm logs off at that RPM).... With your turbo setup you would also be limited to high impedence injectors (I think 50lb units might be the limit for your app which might not be big enough....) hope this helps...
what system would you go wiht? I can't find pictures of either software or anything. If not megasquirt is the direction im going...
06-01-2006, 07:59 PM
#12
Originally Posted by Dragframe
Well ok... i know this is a LSx board and all... But i mean there is a pretty large LTx following here. I jsut dont see a ton of support for the motors though.
Like when i got to turbo my motor... I need tuning and what not. But im basicly screwed. There is Tunercats and LT1edit... and that is it. There is no one in the area to tune my car (no one withone hundreds and hundreds of miles... i dont know of anyone).
Aftermarket EMS is kinda out of the question untill this winter or so, and i will need some sort of support in the near future.
I know the PTK kit is available. But that still doesn't solve my tuning issues. And I plan on making my kit anyways.
Like when i got to turbo my motor... I need tuning and what not. But im basicly screwed. There is Tunercats and LT1edit... and that is it. There is no one in the area to tune my car (no one withone hundreds and hundreds of miles... i dont know of anyone).
Aftermarket EMS is kinda out of the question untill this winter or so, and i will need some sort of support in the near future.
I know the PTK kit is available. But that still doesn't solve my tuning issues. And I plan on making my kit anyways.
07-13-2006, 06:17 PM
#13
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Originally Posted by OutlawZ
no problem..... I know Joe Overton is a dealer for Gen VII boxes..... I wish fasttrackperformance was still open or i'd refer you there. that is where i got my XFI box from but john mackenzie sold everything from DFI to XFI to harnesses and all the software... he sold his business to someone else and that person hasn't yet got everything up to speed....
You can check out some of our other work at Horsepower Conneciton.com
http://www.horsepowerconnection.com
By the way our splice in harnesses for most vehicles are $399
