jrivera04

This guy is going to be the richest man in the world if this goes to the masses.

Water as Fuel

Here is the site for the welder.

Welder

ws6nick

iTrader: (1)

holycrap!
Is that for real???

RDISADEIFAN

I bet that technolgy has been around for year and someone bough the patent and buried it.If they do produce that car widescale then water prices go up.I saw on 20/20 that there is a **** load of oil sand in Canada that could run the world for like around 100years.

Assassin

iTrader: (3)

I've gotten flame from water a while back, I was going to be working on something to run soley on water, but turbo's came first, lol, simple electrolisis w/water will break it down to hydrogen and oxygen, only down sides is it corodes easily, and there is one more ingredient that they didnt tell you besides water, though I'm not about to give up the secrets....

FastTrackDF82

Local news station just did a little thing about him about an hour ago. He has a contract with the government to create a water power Humvie and another contract with a auto manufacturer...they didn't say.

Tap water = 87
Distilled = 103

FastTrackDF82

I heard the same thing. Supposedly the government was paying pep like 80K to do the job. But its so damn cold and just a rinky dink town that people aren't going as fast as they would like. My *** would rather be cold and in the middle of no where rather than 130 degree heat and the fear of having my head cut off.

MountainMotor

iTrader: (2)

Would be awesome but it'll never make it to the large scale market, oil companies won't allow it. My physics teacher and I were working on something similar to his design but a little different. It would change everything.

do0dfromcali

Thats pretty sweet.

My question is this:

Once the water is used in the vehicle, does it go back into evaporation or is that water completly burned off never to be seen again? If it were to be completly burned off, wouldn't eventually down the road we have a huge drought?

Sinner

It's not a rinky dink town, over 100,000 people there. The problem, besides it's dark most of the year, cold, tons of snow and when it's not cold...there's **** loads of bugs, it the price of land. Fort MacMurray is basically all bog land. A single wide mobile home costs about $380,000 CDN. So even making 80k a year, you can't afford it.

But there is a crap load of oil up there. With our oil and water, Canada is poised to be a huge player in the world in the coming decades.

Sgt. Spuds

iTrader: (1)

Water is never completely burned away, or so I have been told.

Sounds like a cool deal, can you imagine getting thirsty in welding class and drinking out of your torch?

GatorFan08

iTrader: (1)

I was wondering the same thing lol. That wpuld be cool to have water for gasoline. But I also like Ethanol. I much rather run Ethanol then water.

7sechemi

No, it is impossible to eliminate elements, matter cannot be distroyed or created

SapphireHawk

It's complete BS!

While it is possible to turn H2O into HH + O it takes more engery to split the elements then burning the HH + O creates.

Not to mention if you invented something this amazing do you really think you'd be driving a 94 escort???? Seriously, you'd have VC money up your a$$.

Abidar

It's likely that the escort was his previous "ride" and he decided to experiment on his own stuff. Even if he did have crap tons of money, he might not flaunt it. Why would he? He's got enough fame to last a life time if it ever went through. Some of the brightest people don't follow convention (Albert Einstein rode a bike, he couldn't think while driving).

Snootch

iTrader: (3)

There will always be the same amount of water on earth. The amount we have now is the same amount we had 10,000 years ago. It just simply changes form and location (liquid, gas, solid, etc.)

383LQ4SS

iTrader: (33)

I dont think its going to be that simple as water in the tank and start her up.I havent looked into this much...but Nothing is free in thermodynamics.

Yes you can make hydrogen from water using electrolysis and several other ways. Hydrogen is the most abundant element in the universe. But...the production of hydrogen is not as easy as sticking a car battery on the electrodes sunk in water. There are power requirements to think about. How much electricity does it take to extract X amount of hydrogen from some amount of water? And how much potential enery can then be extracted from that hydrogen? Does the power extracted from the produced hydrogen yeild enough energy to not only run the car...but produce enough electricity to continue the water electrolysis/hydrogen production at a rate to sustain both? Im not sure but I dont think so.
Mainly due to the laws of thermodynamics. I dont know the energy that is contained in a unit of hydrogen and how much electricity it could make powering an inefficent internal combustion engine to then drive generators to supply power for electrolysis. But I would think around 30% efficient if that.

The other way to look at it is how fuel cells work for electricity generation...such as on spacecraft. Its the reverse of electrolysis. O2 and H2 are combined in a similair apparatus that makes electrolysis happen...and electricity is generated. I think the efficiency of those is around 80%


Really the only difference between this and the Hydrogen fuel cells the auto manufacturers are working on is that this supposedly produced the hydrogen on the fly. So in other words you fill the tank with water and then use a small amount of stored hydrogen and a battery to start the car. Once running then use onboard alternators powered by the running hydrogen fuel engine to produce the energy required for the electrolysis to produce the hydrogen fuel and the system will continue running as long as there is water in the tank to be converted. I dont know if that is currently possible. My intitial feeling is that it is not. somewhere along the line your gonna have to plug the car in overnight and have larger storage tanks to make it an effective vehicle with any practicality.

In the hydrogen fuel cell cars GM and others are making...there will be plants that produce the hydrogen by various means...and that will be taken to what would be hydrogen "gas stations" where you would fill up your hydrogen powered car. The downside of the hydrogen fuel cell is the very high pressures it needs to be stored at to make it practical to carry enough to get similair range as a gasoline car. And the energy required to produce this hydrogen will be enormous. Unless you use atomic energy, solar or some other renuable souce...its a total trade off. You burn coal or fossil fuel to power electric plants to produce the electricity required to make hydrogen. You havent really helped much in that scenario.


I did some more digging and found some things.

the electric power required to electrolyze the hydrogen equivalent to 1 gallon of gasoline is equal to (500 moles) x (0.06587 kWh/mole) = 32.935 kWh, and the approximate cost of that power = (32.935 kWh) (@ 13.5¢/kWh) = $4.45 per 'gallon equivalent'


Converting KwHours to HpHours you multiply the KWH X 1.34

So the 32.9 KWH of energy required to convert hydrogen to the equivilent of 1 gallon of gas (for reference) would require ~44 Hp hours of energy. IOW the hyd fuel (that is equal to 1 gallon of gas) would have to sustain the internal combustion engine its running at 44 HP for 1 hour just to turn the generators enough to reproduce another quantity of hydrogen to make it run another hour. That does not inlude % of loss for the generator and drive system and also does not include PROPPELLING THE CAR...lol. Obviosuly 1 gallon of gas (or the h2 equivelent) is not going to sustain 44 hp for 1 hour...not even close.

I think for this to remotely work it would need to be plugged in at night to continue electrolysis, have a large storage tank, the electrolysis unit would have ALOT of surface area of cathode/anode to produce the required hydrogen, etc etc.

I personaly think the guy in the vid is filling a small tank on his car with hydrogen BEFORE starting and then his electrolysis macnine adds to the amount as its running...but would eventually deplete itself if left to run as it was.

But we will see.

383LQ4SS

iTrader: (33)

Also...the guy isnt telling the whole truth. Subtely they say "right now the car is rigged to run off gasoline and hydrogen"

So whats happening is the engine runs on gas and the engine turns an alternator or alternators that produce electricity for the electrolysis that in turn make hydrogen......but very small quantities.

This wont work unless a more efficient way of making much larger quantities of hydrogen is dicovered. It will likley take a catalyst...and using the catalyst will likley not make it a clean alternative. Its already more expensive than gas to make per equivelent unit.

He is not the only guy making a hydrogen gerarating welder. A quicj google search turned up several and the technolgy to do this is not new.

LSWon00

iTrader: (3)

You can't destroy energy. All you can do is convert it from one form to another. Water converts to heat then to steam then condenses to water again.

BTTM

iTrader: (1)

Oil companies and our own government. With the dollar so closely tied to oil, I'd be hard pressed to believe that the government will eagarly support any alternatives that would reduce oil consumption significantly, thereby putting tremendous downward pressure on the value of an already low dollar. This is why there is sooo much behind the scenes concern about the coming International Iranian Oil Bourse; which, for the first time, oil will be traded for Euros instead of dollars.

Interesting idea, though. It would be interesting to see where this goes with the resources of an automaker behind it.

00SSQuiniqua

iTrader: (2)

Sounds like a nice idea at first, but electrolysis reactions like this will require a high current input just to drive the reaction. It would never be efficient enough to use in something such as an automobile without the use of much more energy just to reduce/oxidize the water.