heads worth the money?
I've never said Bret's isn't intelligent. I've never even met the guy or had the pleasure of a face to face discussion with him.
I will roll out the fact that I've never recommended a reverse split to a customer of mine in 5+ years of LSx sales experience. I've sold a few when they had a cam spec'd by whomever and just wanted to purchase from a reputable vendor, but that's as far as it goes...for whatever that's worth to you.
I will roll out the fact that I've never recommended a reverse split to a customer of mine in 5+ years of LSx sales experience. I've sold a few when they had a cam spec'd by whomever and just wanted to purchase from a reputable vendor, but that's as far as it goes...for whatever that's worth to you.
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Heck it's took me over a week to port a FAST and I still haven't bolted it to the car to port match it to the heads.
You can bet that Ed Curtis or Bret will spec the cam for me though. I for one don't want to have to worry about changing valve springs yearly in my street car.
Um, seriously, he is not asking why GM didnt use an aftermarket head on the ZO6. Or any car. A 5.3 may be for some that want a small camshaft. They are cheap to produce and TSP can pass that savings to thier customers. For a NA app, 243s properly worked will be hard to beat. I remeber when TSP carried other heads but felt better doing thier own for a few reasons. One is better QC on in house work. They do have a few bad apples out there. So do a few other top head companies. And N2O will work with any camshaft. But if you want to optimize its use. Then get a custom grind. I have a set of 243s that I really want to make them work. I like to say factory parts. I do let people know if they were reworked.
hey bro, all u have done is bash the reverse split cams? can u explain why they arent the good cams? do a search, and youll see every person that has ran the reverse split has never been disappointed with its performance for a street car and the traditional split cams that u say are the way to go , there has been a bunch of people dissapointed with its under the curve on some of the popular DD sized cams.
Last edited by TXZ28LS1; Nov 14, 2008 at 06:10 PM.
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My car makes over 350lb/ft of torque from 3,300-6,300rpms. That's usuable torque that you feel on the street in a "street" car.
Sure 420rwhp isn't dyno queen numbers, but if I wanted to make 450rwhp and need a 4.10 gear to get the car going from a redlight then I could have used one of your magician sticks.
I'd be interested to see one of your dyno sheets with your 5.3 heads and MS4 cams though. It would be interesting to compare the curves.
thanks
Mark
Sure 420rwhp isn't dyno queen numbers, but if I wanted to make 450rwhp and need a 4.10 gear to get the car going from a redlight then I could have used one of your magician sticks.
I'd be interested to see one of your dyno sheets with your 5.3 heads and MS4 cams though. It would be interesting to compare the curves.
thanks
Mark
Here ya go, red is 243's with a 218* intake, blue is 5.3, 2.5's with a 237* intake.
We had a coil pack issue (MSD coils)that was showing up above 4000rpm. It was taken care of later with stock coil packs.
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hey bro, all u have done is bash the reverse split cams? can u explain why they arent the good cams? do a search, and youll see every person that has ran the reverse split has never been disappointed with its performance for a street car and the traditional split cams that u say are the way to go , there has been a bunch of people dissapointed with its under the curve on some of the popular DD sized cams.
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If I were only going to spend $1200 on heads I would get a $530 nitrous kit from Nitro Dave and run 10's no problem. You don't need all the bells and whisles that everyone thinks they have to have with a nitrous kit. Use the K.I.S.S. method and you will have a fast fun car. My bone stock '99 Camaro ran 7.20's and 11.30's weekly by only switching the stock tire for a set of ET Streets.
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Verdad Gallardo its all about your combo..combo..combo man. yeah the reverse split cam might not be the ideal cam for spray, but the X1 and TR230 cam are proven cams already. i made 395rwhp stock heads without a pulley on my A4 with a very mild cam and alot of people say it takes a huge cam to make 400rwhp on a A4. gillbot is running mac midlengths and a 4k stall and makes 399rwhp with a TR230 cam stock heads.. so for that 1 idiot to say reverse splits suck is ignorant espeically when wilwaxu is running old *** MTI LS1 heads and X1 and runs 10's.. and is still running that setup..
they say the reverse split cams are ideal for stock heads? if thats the case then why did poolfanatic back in the day make 445 rwhp with his X1 and MTI LS6 heads? i could only imagine the power it might make with some killer AFR or even TFS heads..and again cam guru predator-z is running a small reverse split in his 370. im still waiting for KMS 1320 to let us know why the TR230/X1 cams suck? i bet his answer is just cuz 90% of ls1tech runs traditional split and not so many run reverse splits..LOL..
thats why there have been a few threads lately bout guys asking about TR230? its cuz its proven itself time and time again even being as old as it is.
Last edited by TXZ28LS1; Nov 15, 2008 at 09:17 AM.
I bought my X1 for cheap and I'm happy with it. Run's well for a car with 120K miles. I just can't afford to do a cam swap right now. This is my only car, and the price of a dyno tune is at least $400, plus the time and money to purchase a new camshaft is a factor.
Related to nitrous, reverse split cams are VERY bad. By design, as mentioned, they delay the EVO and hold the exhaust valve open for a shorter period of duration. Nitrous is injected on top of the air being brought naturally. You've set up the VE's to "optimize" low end torque, but are significantly adding torque through nitrous. Why wouldn't you trade some of the unusable torque for HP you can use by opening the exhaust valve sooner nad holding it open longer? Reverse splits go in the opposite direction that one should go when choosing a cam for nitrous.
Last edited by KMS.1320; Nov 15, 2008 at 04:30 PM.
Reverse splits can be ok DD cams I guess on a stock intake/heads with 1 7/8th longtubes and true duals.. but for cars that want the best out of the 1/4 mile they aren't. And they do SUCK for nitrous use. Reverse split cams in theory delay the opening of the exhaust valve to make more use of the power stroke. If it opens late, close to the bottom, you will take advantage of the expansion, but you will pay for it with pumping losses by not having enough time to let the cylinder blow-down. You must let the residual gas start out of the exhaust valve early enough so that the piston will not have to work so hard to push it out. Opening the exhaust valve earlier like a traditional split, will give the engine a longer blow-down period which will reduce pumping losses. But, if you are only interested in low speed operation, say up to 4000 RPM, you can open the exhaust valve later.
Related to nitrous, reverse split cams are VERY bad. By design, as mentioned, they delay the EVO and hold the exhaust valve open for a shorter period of duration. Nitrous is injected on top of the air being brought naturally. You've set up the VE's to "optimize" low end torque, but are significantly adding torque through nitrous. Why wouldn't you trade some of the unusable torque for HP you can use by opening the exhaust valve sooner nad holding it open longer? Reverse splits go in the opposite direction that one should go when choosing a cam for nitrous.
Related to nitrous, reverse split cams are VERY bad. By design, as mentioned, they delay the EVO and hold the exhaust valve open for a shorter period of duration. Nitrous is injected on top of the air being brought naturally. You've set up the VE's to "optimize" low end torque, but are significantly adding torque through nitrous. Why wouldn't you trade some of the unusable torque for HP you can use by opening the exhaust valve sooner nad holding it open longer? Reverse splits go in the opposite direction that one should go when choosing a cam for nitrous.
so your still saying reverse split cams suck...
okay so tell when have u ever heard of a reverse split lacking under the curve? when have u heard of a reverse split being to be re defined 2-3 times like a traditional split because it was lacking under the curve and people running those cams were disappointed? " I AGREE THE REVERSE SPLIT ISNT THE IDEAL CAM FOR SPRAY", but u can still spray it. ive talked to sponsors who said reverse is fine up until over 150 shot.. then the traditional will be better suited, and this isnt sponsors who designed the X1 or TR 230. ive had 2 guys who ran the X1 with spray and tell me there cars were running like bats out of hell with the reverse split and 100 shot...both i believe ran 10's btw.. do a search with reverse split in the nitrous section there was a guy who sprayed over a 200 shot on a reverse split.
Last edited by TXZ28LS1; Nov 15, 2008 at 05:39 PM.
I hope this sounds right, becvause I just got back from a party and I'm feeling a little too good.. If you are running the reverse split, esp with intake mods like intake/heads, chances areyou aren't clearing the combustion chamber effectively and have residual gasses contaminating the incoming intake charge, costing power.
I know of some one here in Houston that runs a set of Greg Good ported 5.3 heads and is in the 9's naturally asperated. I am sure the car I am speaking of makes well above 500rwhp.
so your still saying reverse split cams suck... okay so tell when have u ever heard of a reverse split lacking under the curve? when have u heard of a reverse split being to be re defined 2-3 times like a traditional split because it was lacking under the curve and people running those cams were disappointed?
do a search with reverse split in the nitrous section there was a guy who sprayed over a 200 shot on a reverse split.
okay so tell when have u ever heard of a reverse split lacking under the curve? when have u heard of a reverse split being to be re defined 2-3 times like a traditional split because it was lacking under the curve and people running those cams were disappointed? do a search with reverse split in the nitrous section there was a guy who sprayed over a 200 shot on a reverse split.
I would take a 228/232 111* over a 230/224 ANY day of the week.
Chris1313 had great results with his 230/230 111*.
Man you can tell harecorels1 is down and it's members are getting bored. Things are actually making sense around here the last couple of days...
9 times out of 10 in my opinion you don't here of reverse split cams "lacking in the TQ" department; or that people liked the cams better are because the cam they are comparing it too was WAY too ******* big to begin with. I don't know of any 239/236 Donky Dick Reverse Split cams. haha I bet those would really be pigs!!!
I would take a 228/232 111* over a 230/224 ANY day of the week.
Chris1313 had great results with his 230/230 111*.
Man you can tell harecorels1 is down and it's members are getting bored. Things are actually making sense around here the last couple of days...
I would take a 228/232 111* over a 230/224 ANY day of the week.
Chris1313 had great results with his 230/230 111*.
Man you can tell harecorels1 is down and it's members are getting bored. Things are actually making sense around here the last couple of days...
The "experts" over here are enthusiats.. they don't design and build race engines for a living. Those are the guys I like to listen to.. but yes, my favorite site is down and I'm bored as hell
You see.. when Tech started, it was a good source of information. It was started to be a no-bs tech site because LS1.com was becoming a giant lounge area. But then the sponsors came in, needed to help the site run and pay for the server and bandwidth. Then came the rules about what could be talked about and what could be linked. The sponsors thought that since they pay for the site, the site should become their storefront. The admins allowed that for the most part, and more sponsors had to come on and they made more money. Controlling what could be talked about pissed off a lot of people who could no longer talk freely about technical information unless it had to do with a sponsor's product.. no more direct comparisons. What if a sponsor's product wasn't as good as another product who wasn't a sponsor? Nope, off limits now. So people who knew a LOT about technical info left, as the site was no longer what it was when it started. People were making too much money off it. Now what you are left with is like gmhtp online.. one big advertisement. If the sponsors tell you it's good, you buy it thinking it is.. and no one can refute it because they get banned for sponsor bashing. Hey, they can't afford to lose money because a sponsor pulls out, so why not supress good tech info instead? That's why this site is what it is now.