99TransAmLS16Spd

iTrader: (8)

Allgeier, T., Klenk, M., Landenfeld, T., Conte, E., Boulouchos, K., Czerwinski, J., “Advanced Emission and Fuel Economy Concept Using Combined Injection of Gasoline and Hydrogen in SI Engines,” Publication #2004-01-1270, March, 2004, Society of Automotive Engineers, Troy, MI.

Shinagawa, T., Okumura, T., Furuno, S., Kim, K., “Effects of Hydrogen Addition to SI Engine on Knock Behavior,” Publication #2004-01-1851, June, 2004, Society of Automotive Engineers, Troy, MI.

Conte, E., Boulouchos, K., “Influence of Hydrogen-Rich-Gas Addition on Combustion, Pollutant Formation and Efficiency of an IC-SI Engine,” Publication #2004-01-0972, March, 2004, Society of Automotive Engineers, Troy, MI.

And a dated, but interesting NASA study http://ntrs.nasa.gov/archive/nasa/ca...1977016170.pdf

Again, not trying to prove anything here except that if somebody really does have questions, these are good places to get them from from credible sources. Not TMX with his 4 semesters of physics, not me with my "measly" 2 semesters of engineering physics.

ChevyMan88

I admit 99TransAm6Speed that you have presented some interesting studies. Let me just say, however that these supposed gains are minor compared to the enormous amount wasted by electrolysis. Electrolysis is less than 50% efficient using standard equipment. Converting mechanical energy to electricity is 70% efficient with the best of alternators. Multiply is up and you get 35% efficiency for producing and then burning hydrogen. The NASA study used hydrogen supplied onboard and saw a 3% efficiency gain, but consumed an enormous amount of hydrogen. Producing this hydrogen wastes an enormous amount of electricity. If NASA or the SAE thought this was feasible to really do, they would have done a real world implementation rather than pumping in hydrogen on a dyno.

Now if NASA can't make it work in the real world, only on paper, why would you ever think a couple guys in their garage with **** they bought from a snake oil salesman could see gains. With all the money invested in hybrid and electric technology, Toyota would put this on a prius if they could. The fact is, however, that no one has actually made it work. The products sold online are from scammers and designed for people who want to run their cars on hemp because its natural man, but get frustrated when the pot leaves clog their injectors.

Let me just clarify for everyone reading that true hydrogen vehicles work because the hydrogen is produced outside the car. Sure more power is put in than you get out, but the power comes from the power grid, and electricity is dirt cheap compared to gasoline.

Now, can we stop talking about talking about perpetual motion machines in the advanced tech forum. The admins really need to start locking these threads. This thread is a rarity in that some real science turned up in support of the idea, but excepting a few intelligent posts, it is four pages of bull about whether or not energy is conserved, something that people got tired debating about a thousand years ago when the realized you can't magically make energy. If I see one more thread about hooking an electric motor to a generator, I might lose it.

Ethan[ws6]

iTrader: (13)

Electrolysis =/= perpetual motion

Also, we had stopped talking. Last post was > 1.5 months ago.